The fallacious analogy of the drowning man

civic

Well-known member
who is in need of a life preserver is unbiblical.

We have heard this used by the anti-calvinist crowd for years. The man is drowning and several people in boats pass by and then when he gets to heaven he asks when did you try and save me.

The One who rescues is God who extends the life preserver to the man to "save " him. The man to be saved must reach out and accept the life preserver or else he drowns. They correlate this analogy to the gospel message and receiving it to be saved. But there is a huge flaw in this analogy.

How can a dead man in the water be saved ?
How does a dead man grab the life preserver ?

Fallen men are not "drowning" they are already drowned ( DEAD ) in their trespasses and sins. They are dead in sin, not alive. They are spiritually dead. They are already under the water at the bottom of the river, lake or ocean. They have been dead for years or decades.


Matthew 8:22 - "But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead."

Romans 11:15 - "For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?"

John 11:25 - "Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live"

Luke 15:24 - "For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry."

Luke 9:60- But Jesus told him, "Let the dead bury their own dead. You, however, go and proclaim the kingdom of God."

Ephesians 2:5- And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

hope this helps !!!
 

SovereignGrace

Well-known member
 

preacher4truth

Well-known member
who is in need of a life preserver is unbiblical.

We have heard this used by the anti-calvinist crowd for years. The man is drowning and several people in boats pass by and then when he gets to heaven he asks when did you try and save me.

The One who rescues is God who extends the life preserver to the man to "save " him. The man to be saved must reach out and accept the life preserver or else he drowns. They correlate this analogy to the gospel message and receiving it to be saved. But there is a huge flaw in this analogy.

How can a dead man in the water be saved ?
How does a dead man grab the life preserver ?

Fallen men are not "drowning" they are already drowned ( DEAD ) in their trespasses and sins. They are dead in sin, not alive. They are spiritually dead. They are already under the water at the bottom of the river, lake or ocean. They have been dead for years or decades.


Matthew 8:22 - "But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead."

Romans 11:15 - "For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?"

John 11:25 - "Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live"

Luke 15:24 - "For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry."

Luke 9:60- But Jesus told him, "Let the dead bury their own dead. You, however, go and proclaim the kingdom of God."

Ephesians 2:5- And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

hope this helps !!!
"Nuh-uh, 'cause Lazarus proved that even when we are dead we can choose to obey Jesus. That means even after we die we can still vote for Jesus!" o_O
 

PeanutGallery

Active member
The dead need a resurrection
Judgment comes at the resurrection; salvation comes from the physician.

Mark 2:17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
 

civic

Well-known member
Judgment comes at the resurrection; salvation comes from the physician.

Mark 2:17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
like the OP said we are discussing the "dead " not the sick.

if you have trouble with that then I understand why you are switching the topic and wandering off course.

but feel free to start you own thread on those who are sick and need to see a physician.

hope this helps !!!
 

Our Lord's God

Well-known member
who is in need of a life preserver is unbiblical.

We have heard this used by the anti-calvinist crowd for years. The man is drowning and several people in boats pass by and then when he gets to heaven he asks when did you try and save me.

The One who rescues is God who extends the life preserver to the man to "save " him. The man to be saved must reach out and accept the life preserver or else he drowns. They correlate this analogy to the gospel message and receiving it to be saved. But there is a huge flaw in this analogy.

How can a dead man in the water be saved ?
How does a dead man grab the life preserver ?

Fallen men are not "drowning" they are already drowned ( DEAD ) in their trespasses and sins. They are dead in sin, not alive. They are spiritually dead. They are already under the water at the bottom of the river, lake or ocean. They have been dead for years or decades.


Matthew 8:22 - "But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead."

Romans 11:15 - "For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?"

John 11:25 - "Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live"

Luke 15:24 - "For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry."

Luke 9:60- But Jesus told him, "Let the dead bury their own dead. You, however, go and proclaim the kingdom of God."

Ephesians 2:5- And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

hope this helps !!!

Why do the dead need to die with Christ?

Or has this never even occurred to you?
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
The dead in sins are sick and need a physician.
No the sick are not dead in sin, they are alive Spiritually and the Spirit in them makes them aware of their need of Christ, like the publican Lk 18:13

13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.

If the sick were dead, then they wouldn't need a doctor, they need a resurrection.
 

Our Lord's God

Well-known member
No the sick are not dead in sin, they are alive Spiritually and the Spirit in them makes them aware of their need of Christ, like the publican Lk 18:13

13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.

If the sick were dead, then they wouldn't need a doctor, they need a resurrection.

And hearing this, Jesus said to them, “It is not those who are healthy who need a physician, but those who are sick; I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners.”
 

TibiasDad

Active member
like the OP said we are discussing the "dead " not the sick.

But Jesus is talking about the same people that you are referring to. He says we are sick and need a physician. All analogies fall short at some point and we need be mindful to not carry the literalism too far.

Doug
 

SovereignGrace

Well-known member
But Jesus is talking about the same people that you are referring to. He says we are sick and need a physician. All analogies fall short at some point and we need be mindful to not carry the literalism too far.

Doug
He was using the analogy of sick ppl needing a physician. But the dead in sins need life. The lost are not sick, but spiritually dead. No physician can cure that.
 

TibiasDad

Active member
He was using the analogy of sick ppl needing a physician. But the dead in sins need life. The lost are not sick, but spiritually dead. No physician can cure that.

So now there are three classes of people. Living, dead and the sick who are somewhere in between. Besides, Jesus said he was talking about sinners, the spiritually sick, which, again, are the same people that you are calling dead. And yes, the Great Physician can do that.

On hearing this, Jesus said to them, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners." Mark 2:17

Doug
 

SovereignGrace

Well-known member
So now there are three classes of people. Living, dead and the sick who are somewhere in between. Besides, Jesus said he was talking about sinners, the spiritually sick, which, again, are the same people that you are calling dead. And yes, the Great Physician can do that.

On hearing this, Jesus said to them, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners." Mark 2:17

Doug
He was using an analogy that those who are sick need a cure. This cure is only found in Christ. But let's not throw out Ephesians 2:1. The Greek word used for dead is nekros, which means literally a dead corpse.
 

TomFL

Well-known member
He was using an analogy that those who are sick need a cure. This cure is only found in Christ. But let's not throw out Ephesians 2:1. The Greek word used for dead is nekros, which means literally a dead corpse.
The same word is used in the parable of the prodigal son

Luke 15:24 —KJV
“For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.”

He was not a corpse
 
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