The False Doctrine of "Hell"

[Hawkeye]

So the theologians and biblical scholars that disagree with you are illiterate?

No. But the common man during the early days of Catholicism was....and it was to this populace that the superstitions and fairy tales were promulgated......and they believed them as many simple folk would.

Enter the "Dark Ages"............

The Catholic Church continued in these fantasies until even Martin Luther could not part with them after condemning much of what the Church stood for.

The false theology became rampant with the introduction of the King James version to the scriptures...............and continues to this day except for a few literal translations which honestly attempt a correct rendering.

Remember......the definitions had to change in order to scare the folks about burning forever....and unfortunately....this will also affect the nature of men's belief until the Kingdom of Yahweh is upon us.

It's not difficult to see how this happened. If you're told a lie in childhood......and grow up with others who also believe that lie.....it's very hard to give it up. Church history is usually a good place to see the Genesis of this false theology. Put on your thinking cap and pray for guidance.

 

[4Him]

being a genius is actually a deficit to understanding Him. His prophets were simple souls, not theologians.

This isn't about being a genius. I don't assume all theologians or biblical scholars are geniuses, why do you?

 

[4Him]

No. But the common man during the early days of Catholicism was....and it was to this populace that the superstitions and fairy tales were promulgated......and they believed them as many simple folk would.

Not all biblical scholars and theologians are Catholics....so there's that.

 

[4Him]

a genius is just an entity, per original usage. any genius is too many in my book.

 

[Gary Mac]

Non Christians cannot renounce what they already renounce.

the so called dark ages were better than now.

It is for you I agree -- But the kingdom of God that I live in is light, is Love, is beautiful, Joy unspeakable. Everyday is better than the last, positive and full of fun.

I would not want to live the dark life that you say your god lives in. You have painted a very dismel image for your god in a planet of the apes.

 

[Hawkeye]

Not all biblical scholars and theologians are Catholics....so there's that.

So....you would question the reformation.....not believing that Protestants took much theology from the Catholic Church?

 

[GeneZ]

It is difficult prove something doesn't exist when somebody imagines it is true.

Well? God does not exist. You only imagine him to be real.

Hell? That's not real.

Death? maybe this is all one big imaginary dream of yours. You are only dreaming of what you now see as reality and history. Even death is something you are imagining in your dream...

You are just going to wake up someday from your sleep and tell everyone of your imagined world you are now living in. Kind of like Dorothy waking up at the end of the Wizard of Oz and telling everyone about what she saw.

And, thanks for imagining of me in your dream so I could post this...

 

[4Him]

So....you would question the reformation.....not believing that Protestants took much theology from the Catholic Church?

If you want to discuss the Catholic Church, go to the appropriate board.
Not all biblical scholars and theologians are Catholic. Fact.

 

[Hawkeye]

If you want to discuss the Catholic Church, go to the appropriate board.
Not all biblical scholars and theologians are Catholic. Fact.

Actually....I was discussing the Reformation and doctrine developed for its Genesis.

 

[Bob Dobbalina]

Actually....I was discussing the Reformation and doctrine developed for its Genesis.

It's obvious that the Protestant movement filtered the Word through the Catholic Church's interpretation. I believe Luther's anti-semitism led to much error.

 

[Hawkeye]

It's obvious that the Protestant movement filtered the Word through the Catholic Church's interpretation. I believe Luther's anti-semitism led to much error.

That's a big "Ten Four"!

 

[Bob Dobbalina]

That's a big "Ten Four"!

So why do you suppose it's so popular to believe that YHWH is so ruthless, so merciless as to torture people with inconceivable fury while keeping fire-proof immortal worms alive? Mark 9:48

See, I just can't get past those worms. They are not dead- but the people are...? Eternal torment is eternal life, undoubtedly. This is where I'm truly puzzled because entrance to the Kingdom of YHWH is not a zero-sum game. The Kingdom is not in limited supply; nobody gets more if there are less people at the table. I truly don't get it.

 

[Hawkeye]

So why do you suppose it's so popular to believe that YHWH is so ruthless, so merciless as to torture people with inconceivable fury while keeping fire-proof immortal worms alive? Mark 9:48

See, I just can't get past those worms. They are not dead- but the people are...? Eternal torment is eternal life, undoubtedly. This is where I'm truly puzzled because entrance to the Kingdom of YHWH is not a zero-sum game. The Kingdom is not in limited supply; nobody gets more if there are less people at the table. I truly don't get it.

You can lay the original blame to early Greek philosophers who taught the immortality of the soul. When that doctrine was accepted by the Catholic Church they had to invent a place where folks would be sorted out to see where they would end up. Presto; Bingo; Purgatory!

A fiery Hell was already part of Greek philosophy so the church changed the meaning of some words in scripture to allow for the immortality of the soul if the stopover in purgatory was unsuccessful. It generally relied on the amount of money paid in indulgences to determine the final outcome.

Fairy tales.................

 

[Bob Dobbalina]

It's my understanding that the same word- nephesh- is translated as body sometimes and others as soul, as it suits the prevailing orthodoxy. Is there agreement amongst contemporary translations now?

 

[Bob Dobbalina]

It's my understanding that the same word- nephesh- is translated as body sometimes and others as soul, as it suits the prevailing orthodoxy. Is there agreement amongst contemporary translations now?

This was supposed to be addressed to Hawkeye; of course, all are welcome to comment.

It's obvious to most that human error has run rife through the many different translations of the Bible. It was the false doctrine discussed here that started me wondering; then realizing that immortal souls are not in the Scriptures- that changed my life and led me back to YHWH. The way "nephesh" is used should make any thinking person question the whole doctrine. Hawkeye addressed the question of "nephesh" more eloquently than I am able and I encourage all to scroll back and read his posts.

 

[Bob Dobbalina]

what was wrongly accepted from rome all the way to modern christianity was the idea He created this world and this body, and plus misunderstanding the prophets.

much before luther things were already a mess.

I believe Luther's anti-semitism led to perpetuation of catholic error.

 

[Bob Dobbalina]

What about Mark 9:48 people? Anybody beside Hawkeye wanna posit an answer to the question-

Why does GOD grant eternal life to worms but not people? How does the same state of affairs- both in the unquenchable fires of torment- result in two opposite states? The people are dead? but the worms are alive? Please explain how that works.

 

[Hawkeye]

It's my understanding that the same word- nephesh- is translated as body sometimes and others as soul, as it suits the prevailing orthodoxy. Is there agreement amongst contemporary translations now?

I'm not certain but I believe the King James is probably still the most widely read translation by Protestants. It's a shame as so many passages are made incorrect because of faulty (sometimes purposeful) rendering of the Greek. Both Old and New books suffer the same.

One of the most commonly tampered with words is the Greek PSUCHE which is translated "Soul" in the New. It's used 105 times....but only as "Soul" 58 times. It's also rendered as mind (3 times); Life (40 times); and heart, heartily, us and you one time each. This is the Greek equivalent of the Hebrew, Nephesh.

PSUCHE is also used for animals just as Nephesh is in Genesis. In [Revelation 8:9] it is called "Life". In [Revelation 16:3] we see it describing lower animal life.

[Matthew 16:25-26] For whosoever will save his life (PSUCHE) shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life (PSUCHE) for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul (PSUCHE)? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul(PSUCHE)?

Obviously....this is tampering by the translators.

Mortal, temporal human physical life......subject to death.

 

[Gary Mac]

I'm not certain but I believe the King James is probably still the most widely read translation by Protestants. It's a shame as so many passages are made incorrect because of faulty (sometimes purposeful) rendering of the Greek. Both Old and New books suffer the same.

One of the most commonly tampered with words is the Greek PSUCHE which is translated "Soul" in the New. It's used 105 times....but only as "Soul" 58 times. It's also rendered as mind (3 times); Life (40 times); and heart, heartily, us and you one time each. This is the Greek equivalent of the Hebrew, Nephesh.

PSUCHE is also used for animals just as Nephesh is in Genesis. In [Revelation 8:9] it is called "Life". In [Revelation 16:3] we see it describing lower animal life.

[Matthew 16:25-26] For whosoever will save his life (PSUCHE) shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life (PSUCHE) for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul (PSUCHE)? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul(PSUCHE)?

Obviously....this is tampering by the translators.

Mortal, temporal human physical life......subject to death.

When the SPirit of God enters a person as He did in Jesus and we become like Him to have His same mind, Same walk as He walks in it, same nature of Love, same disposition of, then all of these technical difficulties dissipate and He opens all of His heaven to us. Even Jesus went through this process in Matt 3:16 where he went from teachings th elaw of the temples in the temples, to teachings Gods way for SPirit in the streets.

 

[Base12]

First, notice that "hell" is absent in Genesis 1.

Actually it is.

The first two verses of the Bible describe the creation of what the KJV calls Hell.

Second, notice that "hell" is absent where it should be present in Genesis 3.

Hell is there as well. It is in the form of the Lake of Fire.

The primary passage is "the rich man and Lazarus" in Luke 16:19-31 (Link). But look closely at the passage, this is a parable by Jesus, not a description of actual events.

Typical.

Whenever someone is caught in a lie, they always state "it never happened".

In other words, the Rich Man and Lazarus 'never happened', otherwise it would 'contradict the False Narrative' that Hell is not real.