The First Vision

[Yitoz]

To give heed, both in his words and commandments... pay attention to; take notice of

section 21 verses 4–6 [D&C 21:4–6], the Lord states:

“Wherefore, meaning the church, thou shalt give heed unto all his words and commandments which he shall give unto you as he receiveth them, walking in all holiness before me;

“For his word ye shall receive, as if from mine own mouth, in all patience and faith.

“For by doing these things the gates of hell shall not prevail against you.”

Again, Joseph obviously didn't receive 114 by divine inspiration. Thanx for proving my point by your reply above. D&C 114 was absolute rubbish because either the mormon gods are baffoons or the one spewing such rubbish was the baffoon. Most likely, since both utter falsehoods on a regular basis, then both attempt to lead the unwary down the road to perdition.

 

[Richard7]

Again, Joseph obviously didn't receive 114 by divine inspiration. Thanx for proving my point by your reply above. D&C 114 was absolute rubbish because either the mormon gods are baffoons or the one spewing such rubbish was the baffoon. Most likely, since both utter falsehoods on a regular basis, then both attempt to lead the unwary down the road to perdition.

I honor your personal speculation on meaning and divine inspiration... how would this change my testimony since nobody as of yet can show where the BoM came from other than actual Gold Plates... you can cherrypick all you want, but actually going after something a lot more complicated has to be very futile to the Evangelicals here...

 

[brotherofJared]

Again, Joseph obviously didn't receive 114 by divine inspiration.

U r entitled to ur opinion but that doesn't make it fact. Are u now changing ur argument from failed prophecy to failed "inspiration". How can u support that reasoning. Maybe the inspiration was to have Patten arrange his life so his family would be able would be provided for in his absence.

It's not like statements like this weren't made in the Bible, Jesus told the twelve that they would sit as judges of Israel knowing full well, we assume, that Judas would never sit as a judge. Is Jesus a false prophet? Moses said that Ephraim would gather Israel in the last days but some here believe that Ephraim is doesn't exist anymore. Is Moses a false prophet?

I'm sorry but IMO, ur argument isn't very inspiring.

D&C 114 was absolute rubbish because either the mormon gods are baffoons or the one spewing such rubbish was the baffoon.

Again, ur opinion is noted. Are u willing to make the same claims about Jesus and Moses in the very same basis. God has made statements and later changed his mind. Case in point, king Hezekiah was to die according to the prophet, but the King prayed towards the temple pleading his case and the same prophet who told him to set his life in order returned and told him the Lord changed his mind. So, was the prophet a buffoon? Or, do u think God was drawing out Hezekiah for his own purposes that explaining what he wanted Hezekiah to do simply would not have produced the desired effect. If I tell u to exercise faith and I'll consider letting u live is not the same as exercising faith based on my own volition.

Nevertheless, these things, the very things you bloviate over, happen in the scripture that u claim are true but feel u can stand in judgment over someone else's beliefs. Again, u literally have nothing but ur opinion as backing. I suspect sections like 114 we're written just for people like our critics. It gives them something to complain about making them seem more foolish the more they insist on making a mountain out if a mole hill.

Most likely, since both utter falsehoods on a regular basis, then both attempt to lead the unwary down the road to perdition.

Careful, judge not...

 

[Yitoz]

Maybe...

This is the sum total of all mormon apologetics and doctrine. Pure speculation without factual historical support.

 

[Richard7]

This is the sum total of all mormon apologetics and doctrine. Pure speculation without factual historical support.

Sum total is the reality of the Book of Mormon.... no need to speculate when one really takes the time to humbly and sincerely read the Book of Mormon and pray about it... hmmm

 

[brotherofJared]

This is the sum total of all mormon apologetics and doctrine. Pure speculation without factual historical support.

You're not paying attention. All of Christianity is based on speculation without factual historical support. You haven't seen it. No one on this board has seen the resurrected Christ, and none of the people on this board would recognize him anyway since none of us knew Him when he died. The very fact that there are thousands of Christian sects indicates an abundance of speculation.

 

[Richard7]

Again, Joseph obviously didn't receive 114 by divine inspiration. Thanx for proving my point by your reply above. D&C 114 was absolute rubbish because either the mormon gods are baffoons or the one spewing such rubbish was the baffoon. Most likely, since both utter falsehoods on a regular basis, then both attempt to lead the unwary down the road to perdition.

typical straw-man.... "Thanx for proving my point" .... real issue was not addressed, nice try.

 

[dberrie2020]

This is the sum total of all mormon apologetics and doctrine. Pure speculation without factual historical support.

The Church of Jesus Christ believe Jesus Christ is the Savior and Redeemer of the world. Please explain for us why that is "speculation without factual historical support." How is your theology Christian--if you believe that is speculation?

 

[Mod10]

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