The "gods" of John 10:34-35

[Ongyo no Kiheiji]

Two questions (for the Trinitarians):

1) Are the "gods" mentioned at John 10:34(, ie, the "gods" of Psalm 82:6) 'true gods or false gods'?

2) How does quoting Psalm 82:6 help Jesus prove that "he is Deity"?

 

[Ongyo no Kiheiji]

Two questions (for the Trinitarians):

1) Are the "gods" mentioned at John 10:34(, ie, the "gods" of Psalm 82:6) 'true gods or false gods'?

2) How does quoting Psalm 82:6 help Jesus prove that "he is Deity"?

Are there any Trinitarians willing to discuss this?

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Are there any Trinitarians willing to discuss this?

Better translated "Rulers". Since there's only ONE GOD , then obviously calling HUMANS gods, has to be interpreted differently. Ps 82 makes it clear that they "Die like Men" (Which is all they are).

 

[Ongyo no Kiheiji]

Better translated "Rulers".

Based on what exactly?

Since there's only ONE GOD , then obviously calling HUMANS gods, has to be interpreted differently.

Again, how would interpreting QEOI as "rulers" help Jesus?

Ps 82 makes it clear that they "Die like Men" (Which is all they are).

Just like Jesus did.

 

[Tanachreader]

Are there any Trinitarians willing to discuss this?

You don’t believe in the gods! Not even the one who has blinded you?

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings Ongyo no Kiheijic,

I am very interested in the passage John 10:30-36 as a whole, and what you have chosen is part of Jesus’ reply to their accusation.

Two questions (for the Trinitarians):
1) Are the "gods" mentioned at John 10:34(, ie, the "gods" of Psalm 82:6) 'true gods or false gods'?

My answer is that the term "gods" needs to be considered in the Biblical language of Hebrew, not the normal usage of the word "god" or "gods" in English. I find this first question obscure and ambiguous, so I would like you to explain what the term “gods” here represents. Who are these “gods”? I understand that there are at least two views as to the meaning of “gods” here, and I endorse one of these, but I will wait for your explanation.

2) How does quoting Psalm 82:6 help Jesus prove that "he is Deity"?

I am not a Trinitarian so I will not answer this second question. I suspect that Trinitarians will not have a clear and simple answer to this question. I understand that some Trinitarians agree with the view that I hold on Psalm 82:6, but they then have difficulty when they then try to explain John 10:30-36 and why Jesus quotes this, as they want to hold onto the incorrect view of John 10:30 in support of the Trinity.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[Ongyo no Kiheiji]

You don’t believe in the gods! Not even the one who has blinded you?

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

No real response I see.

 

[Tanachreader]

No real response I see.

You gods reject the WORD.
So you have set your throne over God as your father did.
I literally know and hear the GOD of Israel as they did in the OT.
So to summarize repent or die as a deceiver.

 

[Ongyo no Kiheiji]

You gods reject the WORD.

Could you be more specific?

So you have set your throne over God as your father did.

I have no throne, so what are you talking about?

I literally know and hear the GOD of Israel as they did in the OT.

If that were the case, you should be able to discuss the OP.

So to summarize repent or die as a deceiver.

No need as I've done this already.

 

[Tanachreader]

Could you be more specific?

I have no throne, so what are you talking about?

If that were the case, you should be able to discuss the OP.

No need as I've done this already.

You know what I mean.
You have heard it all from Christians.
You reject Jesus therefore the Spirit of God is not with you.
The op is you are a god with your own word and throne of your life rejecting the truth which pleases the god of this world satan.
Satan planted your beliefs, they took root in you and have grown.
You have become one of them.
You now sit with your father of lies with him on the throne to deceive where possible.

 

[johnny guitar]

Two questions (for the Trinitarians):

1) Are the "gods" mentioned at John 10:34(, ie, the "gods" of Psalm 82:6) 'true gods or false gods'?

2) How does quoting Psalm 82:6 help Jesus prove that "he is Deity"?

Neither. They died like the MEN they were.

 

[johnny guitar]

Based on what exactly?

Again, how would interpreting QEOI as "rulers" help Jesus?

Just like Jesus did.

Jesus voluntarily laid down His life and raised Himself from the dead.
The so called gods of Psalm 82 did NEITHER.

 

[Ongyo no Kiheiji]

You know what I mean.
You have heard it all from Christians.
You reject Jesus therefore the Spirit of God is not with you.

I don't reject what the Bible says about Jesus--that he is "the Christ, the son of God" (John 20:31).

What I reject is the belief that is not expressed in Scripture--that he is God the son.

The op is you are a god with your own word and throne of your life rejecting the truth which pleases the god of this world satan.

The OP is about the gods of John 10:34, 35, so is not about your assumptions.

Satan planted your beliefs, they took root in you and have grown.
You have become one of them.
You now sit with your father of lies with him on the throne to deceive where possible.

More unsubstantiated opinions, but nothing about the OP.

(Interesting.)

 

[Ongyo no Kiheiji]

Jesus voluntarily laid down His life and raised Himself from the dead.

Jesus laid down his life and was resurrected by God.

The so called gods of Psalm 82 did NEITHER.

You cannot say that they didn't "lay down their lives". Nor can you say they(--like Christ) won't be resurrected.

 

[Ongyo no Kiheiji]

Neither. They died like the MEN they were.

What are you responding to--the 1st question or the 2nd question?

 

[Tanachreader]

I don't reject what the Bible says about Jesus--that he is "the Christ, the son of God" (John 20:31).

What I reject is the belief that is not expressed in Scripture--that he is God the son.

The OP is about the gods of John 10:34, 35, so is not about your assumptions.

More unsubstantiated opinions, but nothing about the OP.

(Interesting.)

John chapter 1 says He is God and there are other passages as well.

 

[Ongyo no Kiheiji]

John chapter 1 says He is God and there are other passages as well.

I address this here.

 

[johnny guitar]

Jesus laid down his life and was resurrected by God.

You cannot say that they didn't "lay down their lives". Nor can you say they(--like Christ) won't be resurrected.

ONLY Christ voluntarily laid down His life and raised Himself from the dead.

 

[Ongyo no Kiheiji]

ONLY Christ voluntarily laid down His life

Many people voluntarily lay down their lives

and raised Himself from the dead.

Acts 2:24, 32.

 

[johnny guitar]

Many people voluntarily lay down their lives

Acts 2:24, 32.

How did they do that???Did they yield up their spirit as Jesus did?
Yep, God The Father, Son, Holy Spirit raised Jesus from the dead.