The Nature of God verses the Nature of Man

Yodas_Prodigy

Well-known member
I read in a thread that Mikey believes man had God’s nature. Then Beachie chimed in to agree. And Mikey believes to be Born again restores the God nature.

Hey Pete, I am of the mind that Adam did take on the nature of God's enemy at the fall. Let explain why.
  1. Adam is born perfect with the nature and image of God.
  2. Adam, being the very nature of God is that he in essence was also love.
  3. With the loss of the image of God, the nature of God in man was now gone as well and man with the absence of God's nature was left with the very nature of God's enemy.
  4. This is what we are born with and why we must be born again. To restore that which was lost and again are filled with His nature.
Thoughts?

I want to compare and contrast God’s nature with Man’s nature.

First, I want to discuss the nature of God.

The most important element of God’s nature is His holiness. God is clearly separate from His creation based on His nature and attributes. Holiness is the foundation of all other aspects of God’s character. Rev. 15:4 says, “You alone are holy.” Revelation 4:8 describes the four living creatures who sing to God day and night, “Holy, holy, holy is the Lord God Almighty, who was, and is, and is to come.” It is God’s holiness that makes Him the “consuming fire” that will judge all sin.

God is an eternal spirit. He is one God who has always existed as three distinct Persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. He does not have a physical body (even though Jesus became incarnate).

God is also, by nature, sovereign. He is judged by no one and has absolute authority over the entire universe and everything in it. His sovereignty is expressed in many ways, including His omnipotence. All of His ways are right, and whether mankind believes God’s ways to be “fair” is irrelevant. The God is not constrained by place or time.

God is immutable. He does not change, being the same “yesterday, today and forever”. He states outright, “I the LORD do not change.”

The Almighty’s sovereignty speaks to His right to do whatever He wishes, and His omnipotence describes His ability to do so. He knows everything, from eternity past to eternity future, everything we think, do, and say. He has personal knowledge of every person who has ever lived or will live.

We must remember God’s wrath, which flows from His holiness. He has a righteous anger against sin. It is also God’s nature to love, and in His love for the world, He sent His only Son, Jesus Christ, to redeem His people.

Love is an attribute of God; He is literally the essence of love. God’s love is eternal. Because He is immutable, His love never changes. His love is perfect and holy.

Now I want to discuss the nature of man.

Human nature is that which makes us, well, human. Our nature is uniquely distinct from the rest of creation in that we can think and feel. We are able to reason. No other creature has this ability, and this is a unique gift given to us by God. Notice the Word creature. We are created beings. Our ability to reason enables us to reflect on our nature and God’s nature and to figure out knowledge of God’s will for creation. No other part of God’s creation has a nature like ours capable of reason.

Scripture teaches that God created human beings in His image. This means that He enables us to have some understanding of Him and of His vast and complex design. Our human nature reflects some of God’s attributes, although in a limited way. We love because we are made in the image of the God who is love. Because we are created in His image, we can be compassionate, faithful, truthful, kind, patient, and just. In us, these attributes are distorted by sin, which also within our nature.

Human nature was perfect because of having been created so by God. The Bible teaches that human beings were created “very good” by a loving God, but that goodness was damaged by the sin of Adam and Eve. Continuing the mirror as a metaphor, our reflecting of God’s image is disjointed and imperfect due to our nature being broken like a broken mirror.

The entire human race inherited a sin nature. When a person trusts in Christ, he receives a new nature, “Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come!”

Sanctification is the process by which God develops our new nature, enabling us to grow into more holiness through time. This is a continuous process. Not until we are glorified in heaven will our new nature be set free to live for eternity in the presence of the God in whose image we are created.

As you are able to read, the Nature of God is vastly different from the Nature of Man. To believe man has the same nature as God is to violate God’s created being, man, and removes the uniqueness of God. In some respects, this is an attack on God, no matter the justification. To believe man has God’s nature is no different than Mormonism… It is heretical in the eyes of the Historic Christian faith...
 

Yodas_Prodigy

Well-known member
I read in a thread that Mikey believes man had God’s nature. Then Beachie chimed in to agree. And Mikey believes to be Born again restores the God nature.



I want to compare and contrast God’s nature with Man’s nature.

First, I want to discuss the nature of God.

The most important element of God’s nature is His holiness. God is clearly separate from His creation based on His nature and attributes. Holiness is the foundation of all other aspects of God’s character. Rev. 15:4 says, “You alone are holy.” Revelation 4:8 describes the four living creatures who sing to God day and night, “Holy, holy, holy is the Lord God Almighty, who was, and is, and is to come.” It is God’s holiness that makes Him the “consuming fire” that will judge all sin.

God is an eternal spirit. He is one God who has always existed as three distinct Persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. He does not have a physical body (even though Jesus became incarnate).

God is also, by nature, sovereign. He is judged by no one and has absolute authority over the entire universe and everything in it. His sovereignty is expressed in many ways, including His omnipotence. All of His ways are right, and whether mankind believes God’s ways to be “fair” is irrelevant. The God is not constrained by place or time.

God is immutable. He does not change, being the same “yesterday, today and forever”. He states outright, “I the LORD do not change.”

The Almighty’s sovereignty speaks to His right to do whatever He wishes, and His omnipotence describes His ability to do so. He knows everything, from eternity past to eternity future, everything we think, do, and say. He has personal knowledge of every person who has ever lived or will live.

We must remember God’s wrath, which flows from His holiness. He has a righteous anger against sin. It is also God’s nature to love, and in His love for the world, He sent His only Son, Jesus Christ, to redeem His people.

Love is an attribute of God; He is literally the essence of love. God’s love is eternal. Because He is immutable, His love never changes. His love is perfect and holy.

As a follow up, I want to mention what God's nature has that our nature does not have. This is not an exhaustive list.

God is eternal. We had a beginning.
God is immutable. We are not.
God is omniscient. We are not.
God is omnipresent. We are not.
God is omnipotent. We are not.
God is Holy Holy Holy. We are not.
God is love. We are not.
God is the uncaused one. We are caused.
God is transcendent. We are not.
 

Mikey1967

Member
As a follow up, I want to mention what God's nature has that our nature does not have. This is not an exhaustive list.

God is eternal. We had a beginning.
God is immutable. We are not.
God is omniscient. We are not.
God is omnipresent. We are not.
God is omnipotent. We are not.
God is Holy Holy Holy. We are not.
God is love. We are not.
God is the uncaused one. We are caused.
God is transcendent. We are not.
Wow, you come up with all that from me stating what Scripture says?

Does Scripture say that man was created in His image?
Does God say that if you eat of the tree, THIS DAY, you will die?
Adam lived over 900 years.
Is God a liar? He said THIS DAY you will die.
What died?
You tried to dance around it but even you post says that man did not have the same nature after the fall.

So how can you possible come up with what you wrote in you diatribe as if I said that?

Even cessationist heroes such as Augustine, Aquinas, Irenaeus, Luther, even Calvin alluded to as much.

The New Covenant is full of the Lord showing us that His nature is in us now and to let that be what comes out of us.
Just wow.
 
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Tallen

Well-known member
"1. Adam is born perfect with the nature and image of God."

Dispite the claim that this is what the scripture states, it is not. The following points are built upon a faulty supposition..., therefore bad theology results.

First, Adam was not born, he was created from earth and given life by the breath of YHWH. Since he is a created being, he is not YHWH, nor does he have the nature of the Eternal Uncreated Soveriegn. He is not a God in the sense that He possesses what YHWH nature is.

Secondly, nowhere in scripture does it tell us that Adam had the nature of YHWH. Scripture does compare him to the highest of the angelic beings, elohim, which are imagers and representatives of YHWH. Yet created lower.

Thirdly, being created in the image of God does not mean being created with His nature. What does it mean, it means that man reflects and represents the will of God, His desires and pleasures, His Law and teachings, to the rest of creation. Man is a representative, an ambassador of the Kingdom of God, he is the highest of the physical creation and made to keep and enlarge YHWH'S order in creation.

For starters.
 

Mikey1967

Member
"1. Adam is born perfect with the nature and image of God."
True. What is the image of God? It cannot be physical. So what?

Dispite the claim that this is what the scripture states, it is not. The following points are built upon a faulty supposition..., therefore bad theology results.
It does say it and church fathers for centuries have held to this.

First, Adam was not born, he was created from earth and given life by the breath of YHWH. Since he is a created being, he is not YHWH, nor does he have the nature of the Eternal Uncreated Soveriegn.
No one is saying any different.

He is not a God in the sense that He possesses what YHWH nature is.
So here is your issue. You are making an error in equating God's nature with divinity. Nothing of the sort is said but we, when we are born again are born with God's nature. That is Scripture, this is why Jesus said to us who are born again, do not call any man your father because you have one Father. "The one you came forth from."

Secondly, nowhere in scripture does it tell us that Adam had the nature of YHWH. Scripture does compare him to the highest of the angelic beings, elohim, which are imagers and representatives of YHWH. Yet created lower.
Nature of God = Image of God

Image of God in man does not = Divinity

Jesus was the expressed image of God. So we can see the nature of the Father in Him.

Thirdly, being created in the image of God does not mean being created with His nature. What does it mean, it means that man reflects and represents the will of God, His desires and pleasures, His Law and teachings, to the rest of creation. Man is a representative, an ambassador of the Kingdom of God, he is the highest of the physical creation and made to keep and enlarge YHWH'S order in creation.
Oh please, this is simply theological gymnastics to try to be right. You simply reduce man to be a higher form of an animal rather than a son of God. I expect better from those who claim superiority in exegesis.
 

Tallen

Well-known member
True. What is the image of God? It cannot be physical. So what?


It does say it and church fathers for centuries have held to this.
I'm noticing the absence of scripture for the claim.
No one is saying any different.
You did. I quoted you. You said, "Adam is born perfect..."

If No one is saying it, why are you saying it?
So here is your issue. You are making an error in equating God's nature with divinity. Nothing of the sort is said but we, when we are born again are born with God's nature. That is Scripture, this is why Jesus said to us who are born again, do not call any man your father because you have one Father. "The one you came forth from."
God's nature is Devine. He is God, a unique devine being.
Nature of God = Image of God
Nope. Nature is the characteristics of a person..., like human nature. Image is a reflection, not a nature. Man reflects God as I described earlier.
Image of God in man does not = Divinity
I agree.
Jesus was the expressed image of God. So we can see the nature of the Father in Him.
In other words, Jesus reflected the purpose and will of YHWH. expressed image means He reflected God's purpose.
Oh please, this is simply theological gymnastics to try to be right. You simply reduce man to be a higher form of an animal rather than a son of God. I expect better from those who claim superiority in exegesis.
Right..., all you're doing is ignoring, deflecting and minimizing. Poor tactic on your part.
 

Yodas_Prodigy

Well-known member
Wow, you come up with all that from me stating what Scripture says?

Does Scripture say that man was created in His image?
Does God say that if you eat of the tree, THIS DAY, you will die?
Adam lived over 900 years.
Is God a liar? He said THIS DAY you will die.
What died?
You tried to dance around it but even you post says that man did not have the same nature after the fall.

So how can you possible come up with what you wrote in you diatribe as if I said that?

Even cessationist heroes such as Augustine, Aquinas, Irenaeus, Luther, even Calvin alluded to as much.

The New Covenant is full of the Lord showing us that His nature is in us now and to let that be what comes out of us.
Just wow.

Mikey, your education has puffed you up... Where does scripture say that man has God's nature? Being an image bearer is much different than being an exact duplicate.... BTW, your comrade WOF hero's call man an exact duplicate of God... And too boot, one even calls us Little Machiach's (Messiah's) ...
 

Yodas_Prodigy

Well-known member
I'm noticing the absence of scripture for the claim.

You did. I quoted you. You said, "Adam is born perfect..."

If No one is saying it, why are you saying it?

God's nature is Devine. He is God, a unique devine being.

Nope. Nature is the characteristics of a person..., like human nature. Image is a reflection, not a nature. Man reflects God as I described earlier.

I agree.

In other words, Jesus reflected the purpose and will of YHWH. expressed image means He reflected God's purpose.

Right..., all you're doing is ignoring, deflecting and minimizing. Poor tactic on your part.

Yes... This is not a semantic issue either... Next on Mikey's agenda - Redefine Nature ... WOF does that stuff all the time...
 

CrowCross

Super Member
Is God a liar? He said THIS DAY you will die.
What died?
Perhaps the animal God used to make A&E garments from died in their place. You know, an innocent animal died and covered their sin. Kinda like what Jesus did.

Or, you may want to look at it this way...they began to die. Much like when you cut a flower and put it into a vase. The flower retains its fresh look for a couple of days then wilts.

Or, they died spiritually..but not physically.

What died?
 

Tallen

Well-known member
Elohim is an angel?

That's a new one.
Elohim are a class of beings. Not a new concept at all. It is plural in Hebrew.

For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels (elohim), And hast crowned him with glory and honour.
Psalm 8:5 KJV

According to scripture man is the image of YHWH, and created lower than the elohim.

We are also taught not to make images of the elohim for worship. They are not created for worship and are lower than YHWH.

Ye shall not make with me gods (elohim) of silver, neither shall ye make unto you gods (elohim) of gold.
Exodus 20:23 KJV

Meaning that YHWH'S people are not to make images of these spiritual beings for the sake of worship.

I recommend Dr. Michael Heiser's book, The Unseen Realm. Free at this link.


I'm glad I could bring to light something new to ya.
 

CrowCross

Super Member
Elohim are a class of beings. Not a new concept at all. It is plural in Hebrew.

For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels (elohim), And hast crowned him with glory and honour.
Psalm 8:5 KJV

According to scripture man is the image of YHWH, and created lower than the elohim.

We are also taught not to make images of the elohim for worship. They are not created for worship and are lower than YHWH.

Ye shall not make with me gods (elohim) of silver, neither shall ye make unto you gods (elohim) of gold.
Exodus 20:23 KJV

Meaning that YHWH'S people are not to make images of these spiritual beings for the sake of worship.

I recommend Dr. Michael Heiser's book, The Unseen Realm. Free at this link.


I'm glad I could bring to light something new to ya.
In the beginning God (elohim) created the heavens and the earth.

Then God (elohim) said, “Let Us make man in Our image, after Our likeness

You has said....According to scripture man is the image of YHWH....Elohim is used in Genesis

But thanks, I didn't know angels could be a nuance of the word Elohim
 

Tallen

Well-known member
In the beginning God (elohim) created the heavens and the earth.

Then God (elohim) said, “Let Us make man in Our image, after Our likeness

You has said....According to scripture man is the image of YHWH....Elohim is used in Genesis

But thanks, I didn't know angels could be a nuance of the word Elohim
Context matters... I'll stand by my statement. The one true God (Elohim), who is worshipped by His Israel (His people in all ages), created man in the Garden..., His name is YHWH.

Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, I am the LORD (YHWH) your God (Elohim).
Leviticus 18:2 KJV
 
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CrowCross

Super Member
Context matters... I'll stand by my statement. The one true God (Elohim), who is worshipped by His Israel (His people in all ages), created man in the Garden..., His name is YHWH.

Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, I am the LORD (YHWH) your God (Elohim).
Leviticus 18:2 KJV
You can stand by whatever you want to stand by....I looked it up and throughout Gen 1 Elohim is used in the original.
 

Tallen

Well-known member
In every instance where the word LORD appears in caps, it is the word YHWH. Read these verses. Scripture itself links creation to YHWH.

These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens, and every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground. But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground. And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul. And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed. And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
Genesis 2:4‭-‬9 KJV

My point is this, YHWH is the creator of man. He is the unique Creator Elohim whose name is YHWH. Originally my point was to show you that elohim speaks about a class of beings, having lower natures than YHWH. And, scripture clearly teaches us that man is created lower than the elohim. And before that, i was addressing the error of Adam being born with the nature of YHWH.
 

RiJoRi

Well-known member
FYI, years ago we studied the names of God in a Bible study, using a book titled - oddly enough - "Names of God" by Nathan Stone. 'Twas very interesting, and I believe it's still available. (Yes, Richy, we also used the Bible!)

HTH,
--Rich
 
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