The "one Lord" in reference to Jesus being YHWH (1 Corinthians 8:6)

J

johnny guitar

Well-known member
Yahchristian said:
I asked Jesus and this was his reply...

“He that hath seen me hath seen the Father.”

So those who saw the human nature of Jesus (since that is all that is visible) can be said to have seen the Father.

I believe the name “the Father” refers to YHWH in transcendence and “Jesus” refers to YHWH incarnate. So to see YHWH incarnate is to see YHWH who is transcendent.

When YOU asked Jesus to show you the Father, did he give you a different answer than he gave Philip?
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Evasion. You did NOT answer the question.
 
F

Fred

Well-known member
Yahchristian said:
I asked Jesus and this was his reply...

“He that hath seen me hath seen the Father.”

So those who saw the human nature of Jesus (since that is all that is visible) can be said to have seen the Father.

I believe the name “the Father” refers to YHWH in transcendence and “Jesus” refers to YHWH incarnate. So to see YHWH incarnate is to see YHWH who is transcendent.

When YOU asked Jesus to show you the Father, did he give you a different answer than he gave Philip?
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Jesus is not the Father in that plural pronouns are used to describe them (John 14:23).

In answer to your question:
https://forums.carm.org/threads/what-did-jesus-mean.7406/#post-504281
 
F

Fred

Well-known member
JNelson said:
If Jesus isn’t the God mentioned in John 20:17 then he isn’t that God he is a different God.
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If Jesus isn't God mentioned in John 20:17 then He isn't the Father, but He is still God (John 20:28).

Fixed it for you.
 
JNelson

JNelson

Well-known member
Fred said:
If Jesus isn't God mentioned in John 20:17 then He isn't the Father, but He is still God (John 20:28).

Fixed it for you.
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You can play word games by saying he isn’t the Father but the fact is, if he is the same God as the Father then when he says “my God” he cannot exclude himself or else he is not the same God.
 
F

Fred

Well-known member
JNelson said:
You can play word games by saying he isn’t the Father but the fact is, if he is the same God as the Father then when he says “my God” he cannot exclude himself or else he is not the same God.
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You are the one playing word games. "My God" is used in reference to the Lord Jesus in John 20:28 and this expression is always used by believers in the Bible to refer to the Almighty.
 
JNelson

JNelson

Well-known member
Fred said:
You are the one playing word games. "My God" is used in reference to the Lord Jesus in John 20:28 and this expression is always used by believers in the Bible to refer to the Almighty.
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You keep splitting up the one God. Jesus says “my God” and if he doesn’t refer to all 3 persons then all 3 can’t be the one God.
 
F

Fred

Well-known member
JNelson said:
I deny your false interpretation that my God referred to Jesus.
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You can deny the truth, but it won't change that "my God" is used in reference to Jesus in John 20:28.

1. BDAG (3rd Edition): Concerning John 20:28 states that theos "certainly refers to Christ" (theos, page 450).
2. A Greek and English Lexicon of the New Testament: Of the Logos, who is declared to be ho theos, e.g. John 1:1...also in the exclamation of Thomas, John 20:28. - So Christ is called ho theos (theos, page 334)
3. New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology (NIDNTT): Jn. 20:28 contains the unique affirmation of Thomas addressing the Risen Christ as God: "My Lord and my God [ho kyrios mou kai ho theos mou]." (2:81, God, J. Schneider).
4. Theological Dictionary of the New Testament (TDNT): the Risen Lord discloses Himself to Thomas, and the astonished disciple exclaims: ho kurios mou kai ho theos mou (Jn. 20:28). In Jn. 1:1 we have Christology: He is God in Himself. Here we have the revelation of Christ: He is God for believers. (3:105-106, theos, Stauffer)
5. Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words: Thomas, when he realized the significance of the presence of a mortal wound in the body of a living man, immediately joined with it the absolute title of Deity, saying, 'My Lord and my God,' John 20:28 . (Lord)
http://www.studylight.org/ dictionaries/ved/view.cgi?n= 1705
 
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JNelson

JNelson

Well-known member
You keep avoiding John 20:17. Jesus is not the God mentioned there and you keep arguing that John 20:28 is about Jesus so you have two different Gods.

Fred said:
You can deny the truth, but it won't change what that "my God" is used in reference to Jesus in Jhn 20:28.


1. BDAG (3rd Edition): Concerning John 20:28 states that theos "certainly refers to Christ" (theos, page 450).
2. A Greek and English Lexicon of the New Testament: Of the Logos, who is declared to be ho theos, e.g. John 1:1...also in the exclamation of Thomas, John 20:28. - So Christ is called ho theos (theos, page 334)
3. New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology (NIDNTT): Jn. 20:28 contains the unique affirmation of Thomas addressing the Risen Christ as God: "My Lord and my God [ho kyrios mou kai ho theos mou]." (2:81, God, J. Schneider).
4. Theological Dictionary of the New Testament (TDNT): the Risen Lord discloses Himself to Thomas, and the astonished disciple exclaims: ho kurios mou kai ho theos mou (Jn. 20:28). In Jn. 1:1 we have Christology: He is God in Himself. Here we have the revelation of Christ: He is God for believers. (3:105-106, theos, Stauffer)
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Neither your opinion or the opinions of those men are true. Do you believe those men are infallible, yes or no?
 
F

Fred

Well-known member
JNelson said:
You keep avoiding John 20:17. Jesus is not the God mentioned there and you keep arguing that John 20:28 is about Jesus so you have two different Gods.


Neither your opinion or the opinions of those men are true. Do you believe those men are infallible, yes or no?
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The words of the Bible are properly defined one way, but your heresy teaches the exact opposite.

You are a man and offer your opinion. So by your own standards I should not believe you.
 
JNelson

JNelson

Well-known member
Fred said:
The words of the Bible are properly defined one way, but your heresy teaches the exact opposite.
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You’re confusing definitions with interpretations.
Fred said:
You are a man and offer your opinion. So by your own standards I should not believe you.
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Yes, I can be wrong and I admit that but apparently you and those men you quote are infalible and cannot be wrong. Do you admit you and those men can be wrong?
 
JNelson

JNelson

Well-known member
Fred said:
When it refutes your heresy then it is an interpretation, right?

Get real.
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You don’t seem to know the difference between a definition and an interpretation.

Once again, do you believe you and those men are infalible?
 
JNelson

JNelson

Well-known member
Fred said:
Only God is infallible.
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Exactly, and since those men you keep citing are not God nor were they inspired by God like the biblical authors, their opinions don’t prove anything.
Fred said:
Go ahead with your next ridiculous point.
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My only point remains the same. You admitted the God mentioned in John 20:17 is not Jesus so clearly Jesus and the Father are not the same God. This confirms you are a polytheist.
 
F

Fred

Well-known member
JNelson said:
Exactly, and since those men you keep citing are not God nor were they inspired by God like the biblical authors, their opinions don’t prove anything.
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Neither then does your opinion mean anything so no one should believe it.
 
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