The Physical, Sexual "god" of the Mormons.

[Janice Bower]

Very true. But that requires following him, not causing strife or reviling.

Joseph Smith chose to cause strife. You follow him instead of Jesus.

I don't hate you, though I wish you were more charitable and less judgmental.

Joseph Smith hated Christianity. Why do you follow him instead of Christ?

Are you saying someone is righteous because their stubborn?

I never said that.

true!

That's a message, but the greater message is to show how people can be saved from their sins through faith in Christ's atonement AND how to live all of life as a follower of God - and one way to do that, according to the beatitudes is not seek the mote in your brother's eye.

I'm not interested in finding a mote in a brother's eye. A brother would be a fellow Christian. You apparently believe people who aren't temple Mormons are brothers of Satan.

I never said I did. I was just relaying what the scriptures say.

I'm not interested in the "Gospel of Janice", thanks.

There is no gospel of Janice.

Galatians 1
6. . . .Evidently some people are troubling you and trying to distort the gospel of Christ.

8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be under a curse! 9As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be under a curse!

Galatians 1
10Am I now seeking the approval of men, or of God? Or am I striving to please men? If I were still trying to please men, I would not be a servant of Christ. 11For I certify to you, brothers,( and Mormons )that the gospel I preached was not devised by man.12I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.

Christ revealed truth to me. You are a follower of Joseph Smith and are apparently irritated by those who confront and disagree with his false teachings. So you pretend that my willingness to call a spade a spade is unchristian.

Ok. I can accept that. That's between you and God. Is there a reason why you can't grant me the same respect?


Yes. Those given authority to represent God were termed "gods" in the Old Testament. I suppose they'd be exalted in a certain way.

Eh, not as much as you think.


So, you're basically just ignoring everything I say, then? Ummm...ok. Is that the Christian thing to do?

The Christian thing to do is to NEVER be followers of false teachers, and not to be intimidated by their sweet talk. You talk about "the Christian thing to do" as if Mormonism is the Christian thing to do. It isn't. Behind closed doors Mormons don't respect non-Mormons and non-temple worthy Mormons.

Bonnie rule # 6.

I'm simply sharing my perspective of your judgmental words.
What your reasoning do you have that stimulates love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, or temperance in the words: "The Mormons arrogantly teach that we are members and/or followers of Satan's church. Mormons teach lies. Lies originate with Satan."

Do you enjoy being told that Mormonism is wrong? OF course not! Now read Joseph Smith's history in the Pearl of Great Price.

I've made a case in the opposite to extend you charity?

You think that you can portray charity while accepting Joseph Smith, an immoral conman and a wicked false prophet?

Ok. I can accept that. That's between you and God, not for me to judge. I hope that you can grant me the same respect.

I haven't hurt you or wished you harm. I wish very much for your conversion to Christ, but you choose to be offended instead of coming to Christ. I spent years in your false religion. I know so much about it, I will never condone its methods, and attempts to appear righteous while inwardly cultists are ravening wolves.

Yes. And? What exactly are you trying to say here?

As if you can't read 1 Nephi 14:10 for yourself.

 

[Janice Bower]

Huh? So, if you have the Holy Ghost there's no need for lesson manuals in Church?

You're the one who said the Holy Ghost teaches truth. Why would anyone need Mormon manuals?

How exactly would you structure Sunday school, or teach the gospel in the "Church of Janice" without any manuals or curriculum?

There never was nor will there ever be a "Church of Janice"! Why would you resort to sarcasm? Is your true character showing?

 

[Richard7]

You're the one who said the Holy Ghost teaches truth. Why would anyone need Mormon manuals?


There never was nor will there ever be a "Church of Janice"! Why would you resort to sarcasm? Is your true character showing?

Teach by the Spirit​

(Handbook 2: Administering the Church [2010], 5.5.4)

The Savior promised His disciples, “The Holy Ghost … shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you” (John 14:26). Only through the Holy Ghost can we accomplish the ultimate goal of gospel teaching—to build faith in Jesus Christ and help others become more like Him. The Holy Ghost bears witness of the truth, He testifies of Christ, and He changes hearts. No mortal teacher, no matter how skilled or experienced, can replace the Spirit. But we can be instruments in God’s hands to help His children learn by the Spirit. To do this, we invite the influence of the Spirit into our lives and encourage those we teach to do the same.

 

[Aaron32]

Joseph Smith chose to cause strife. You follow him instead of Jesus.

Joseph Smith hated Christianity. Why do you follow him instead of Christ?

All conjecture on your part. I follow Jesus Christ.

I never said that.

Then what are you saying?

I'm not interested in finding a mote in a brother's eye.

Your words illustrate otherwise.

A brother would be a fellow Christian.

No diff. In the beattitudes Jesus says to love your enemies.

You apparently believe people who aren't temple Mormons are brothers of Satan.

Huh?

There is no gospel of Janice.

Well, you're drawing your philosophies from somewhere, not the scriptures.

Galatians 1
6. . . .Evidently some people are troubling you and trying to distort the gospel of Christ.

8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be under a curse! 9As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be under a curse!

Galatians 1
10Am I now seeking the approval of men, or of God? Or am I striving to please men? If I were still trying to please men, I would not be a servant of Christ. 11For I certify to you, brothers,( and Mormons )that the gospel I preached was not devised by man.12I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.

He also said:
12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
Which you would probably call the "false Jesus" if he didn't agree with you.

Christ revealed truth to me.

Again, I'm happy for you. Please respect that people have different views than you, and you are not the arbiter of truth.

You are a follower of Joseph Smith and are apparently irritated by those who confront and disagree with his false teachings.

Again, I'm happy for you.

So you pretend that my willingness to call a spade a spade is unchristian.

No, you're not calling a spade a spade. I don't see the phrase "No Moroni" anywhere in the Bible. That's simply your bias.

The Christian thing to do is to NEVER be followers of false teachers, and not to be intimidated by their sweet talk.

How does one exactly get intimidated by sweet talk?
Apparently, no mormon can even be kind without you feeling threatened in some way. Sad.

You talk about "the Christian thing to do" as if Mormonism is the Christian thing to do. It isn't. Behind closed doors Mormons don't respect non-Mormons and non-temple worthy Mormons.

So stereotyping and bigotry is the "Christian thing to do then?"

Do you enjoy being told that Mormonism is wrong? OF course not! Now read Joseph Smith's history in the Pearl of Great Price.

You didn't answer my question.
However, I actually enjoy my beliefs challenged. That's one of the reasons I come here.
But the shallow statement of "You're wrong because I say so with no justification whatsoever" is rather annoying.
Joseph Smith History doesn't put forth that argument. I find his search for truth is very relatable.

You think that you can portray charity while accepting Joseph Smith, an immoral conman and a wicked false prophet?

Your opinions of Joseph Smith are yours, not mine. And yes, I believe I can portray charity.
Is there a reason why this couldn't be possible? If people believe truth or falsehoods has no bearing on one's ability to be charitable.

I haven't hurt you or wished you harm. I wish very much for your conversion to Christ, but you choose to be offended instead of coming to Christ.

I never claimed that you hurt me or wished me harm, nor have I claimed offense.
I simply requested that you can respect my beliefs as I respect yours, and yet you continue to judge me as if you consider yourself more vindicated the more you believe I haven't received Christ. This is the harm of having a testimony that focuses on the falsehood or evil or something or someone.

I spent years in your false religion. I know so much about it, I will never condone its methods, and attempts to appear righteous while inwardly cultists are ravening wolves.

I'm not asking you to condone anything, but rather to simply recognize that my experience is different than yours. That's it.

As if you can't read 1 Nephi 14:10 for yourself.

Ummmm....I certainly can. Given the context of the scriptures I previously posted, I don't see where the problem is.

 

[Aaron32]

You're the one who said the Holy Ghost teaches truth. Why would anyone need Mormon manuals?

It still doesn't follow.
The Holy Ghost teaches truth, therefore, mormons don't need any manuals at Church?
How would you teach structure learning in a church without some form of curriculum?

There never was nor will there ever be a "Church of Janice"! Why would you resort to sarcasm? Is your true character showing?

No sarcasm intended. I'm just trying to understand your reasoning here.
If you led a church, how would you teach your members? Expect mind-reading? or what?

 

[Janice Bower]

All conjecture on your part. I follow Jesus Chri

You claim to be Mormon. Mormons follow Joseph Smith and other false prophets.

Then what are you saying?

Your words illustrate otherwise.

Everyone has an opinion.

No diff. In the beattitudes Jesus says to love your enemies.

I never said I don't love my enemies. Are you trying to say I don't? Everyone has an opinion.

Huh?

Well, you're drawing your philosophies from somewhere, not the scriptures.

Most certainly not Joseph Smith's false scriptures. Why are you not showing tolerance?

He also said:
12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
Which you would probably call the "false Jesus" if he didn't agree with you.

Again, I'm happy for you. Please respect that people have different views than you, and you are not the arbiter of truth.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life --- not Joseph Smith or Janice.

Again, I'm happy for you.

That's doubtful. You don't act very happy.

No, you're not calling a spade a spade. I don't see the phrase "No Moroni" anywhere in the Bible. That's simply your bias.

You either have a comprehension problem or just want to gripe. You are right about one thing: Moroni is not in the Bible.

How does one exactly get intimidated by sweet talk?
Apparently, no mormon can even be kind without you feeling threatened in some way. Sad.

I'm NOT intimidated by Mormon sweet talk. Capisci? I'm not threatened.

So stereotyping and bigotry is the "Christian thing to do then?"

So jumping to conclusions and criticism is your christian thing to do?

You didn't answer my question.
However, I actually enjoy my beliefs challenged. That's one of the reasons I come here.
But the shallow statement of "You're wrong because I say so with no justification whatsoever" is rather annoying.
Joseph Smith History doesn't put forth that argument. I find his search for truth is very relatable.

None of these statements surprise me.

Your opinions of Joseph Smith are yours, not mine. And yes, I believe I can portray charity.
Is there a reason why this couldn't be possible? If people believe truth or falsehoods has no bearing on one's ability to be charitable.

Thinking highly of oneself is also possible.

I never claimed that you hurt me or wished me harm, nor have I claimed offense.

I didn't say you claimed that.

I simply requested that you can respect my beliefs as I respect yours, and yet you continue to judge me as if you consider yourself more vindicated the more you believe I haven't received Christ. This is the harm of having a testimony that focuses on the falsehood or evil or something or someone.

Well, If I respect lies I am guilty of sin. You shouldn't expect acceptance by Christians of Smith's lies. Smith wrote 1 Nephi 14:10.

I'm not asking you to condone anything, but rather to simply recognize that my experience is different than yours. That's it.

I am well aware that everyone has different experiences. Most people are aware of that.

You know what? You're wasting a lot of my time. Go get your kicks somewhere else.

 

[Richard7]

You claim to be Mormon. Mormons follow Joseph Smith and other false prophets.


Everyone has an opinion.


I never said I don't love my enemies. Are you trying to say I don't? Everyone has an opinion.



Most certainly not Joseph Smith's false scriptures. Why are you not showing tolerance?

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life --- not Joseph Smith or Janice.


That's doubtful. You don't act very happy.


You either have a comprehension problem or just want to gripe. You are right about one thing: Moroni is not in the Bible.


I'm NOT intimidated by Mormon sweet talk. Capisci? I'm not threatened.


So jumping to conclusions and criticism is you christian thing to do?



None of these statements surprise me.

Thinking highly of oneself is also possible.


I didn't say you claimed that.


Well, If I respect lies I am guilty of sin. You shouldn't expect acceptance by Christians of Smith's lies. Smith wrote 1 Nephi 14:10.


I am well aware that everyone has different experiences. Most people are aware of that.

You know what? You're wasting a lot of my time. Go get your kicks somewhere else.

So rhetorical and booooooooooring.

 

[Bonnie]

So rhetorical and booooooooooring.

Sorry you find truth boring, Richard.

 

[brotherofJared]

Christians have only one God.

You mean the one that is his own father?

 

[Theo1689]

You mean the one that is his own father?

No, that's NOT what we believe.

But once again, Mormons can't defend their bankrupt and indefensible theology, so they have to try to attack Christianity by MISREPRESENTING it.

"Our beliefs and actions may differ from those of others, but we, as good Christians, do not criticize other religions or their adherents."
-- Elder Joseph B. Wirthlin of the Quorum of Twelve Apostles,
"Christians in Belief and Action", Ensign, Nov. 1996

According to Elder Wirthlin, you're not a "good Christian".
What do you have to say about that?

 

[Bonnie]

You mean the one that is his own father?

No, that would be your very own Book of Mormon with its modalism:

Mosiah 15:1-4 — “And now Abinadi said unto them: I would that ye should understand that God himself shall come down among the children of men, and shall redeem his people. And because he dwelleth in flesh he shall be called the Son of God, and having subjected the flesh to the will of the Father, being the Father and the Son — The Father, because he was conceived by the power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son — And they are one God, yea, the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth.”

Mosiah 16:15 — “Teach them that redemption cometh through Christ the Lord, who is the very Eternal Father. Amen.”

Alma 11:38-40 — “Now Zeezrom saith again unto him: Is the Son of God the very Eternal Father? And Amulek said unto him: Yea, he is the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth, and all things which in them are; he is the beginning and the end, the first and the last; and he shall come into the world to redeem his people; and he shall take upon him the transgressions of those who believe on his name; and these are they that have eternal life, and salvation cometh unto none else.”

Ether 3:14 — “Behold, I am he who was prepared from the foundation of the world to redeem my people. Behold I am Jesus Christ. I am the Father and the Son. In me shall all mankind have light, and that eternally, even they who shall believe on my name; and they shall become my sons and my daughters.”

Ether 4:8, 12 — “And he that will contend against the word of the Lord, let him be accursed; and he that shall deny these things, let him be accursed; for unto them will I show no greater things, saith Jesus Christ; for I am he who speaketh. . .For behold, I am the Father, I am the light, and the life, and the truth of the world.

(compiled by mrm.org, though I have seen and marked these in my own BoM)

 

[brotherofJared]

That's an interesting question. I would challenge your premise which I bolded.
Per the sacramental prayer that renews our baptismal covenant, one must only be willing to:

• Take upon them the name of Jesus Christ,
• always remember him,
• and keep his commandments which he has given

It's the Holy Ghost that teaches us all things that we should do. Assuming your conscience hasn't been seared (1 Tim 4:2), it shouldn't be difficult to know what you need to repent of to feel His influence in greater capacity

Great post. In other words, what one needs to do to be more Worthy of the influence of the Holy Ghost. And I certainly believe that what we do makes us more or less Worthy of that influence.

 

[brotherofJared]

You mean the one that is his own father?

Is jesus's own father? Come on you one godders, can't you answer that question you who believe that there is only one God?

 

[brotherofJared]

So rhetorical and booooooooooring.

Not to mention laughable. But not the entertaining kind of laughable. If it wasn't so pathetic.

 

[Theo1689]

Is jesus's own father? Come on you one godders, can't you answer that question you who believe that there is only one God?

1) We don't believe Jesus is HIs own Father.

2) Our beliefs are OFF-TOPIC for this forum. But since you can't defend your own bankrupt and indefensible beliefs, you have to DERAIL discussion and try to attack Christianity, all the while MISREPRESENTING what we believe.

Pathetic.

 

[Richard7]

No, that's NOT what we believe.

But once again, Mormons can't defend their bankrupt and indefensible theology, so they have to try to attack Christianity by MISREPRESENTING it.

"Our beliefs and actions may differ from those of others, but we, as good Christians, do not criticize other religions or their adherents."
-- Elder Joseph B. Wirthlin of the Quorum of Twelve Apostles,
"Christians in Belief and Action", Ensign, Nov. 1996

According to Elder Wirthlin, you're not a "good Christian".
What do you have to say about that?

That's just great since we never are allowed to criticize. By the way have you seen my last post in the proper forum?

 

[Theo1689]

That's just great since we never are allowed to criticize. By the way have you seen my last post in the proper forum?

According to your posting history, you haven't posted in ANY forum other than the Mormonism forum since at least the 1st of September.

So no, I haven't seen any non-existent posts by you.

 

[Bonnie]

Is jesus's own father? Come on you one godders, can't you answer that question you who believe that there is only one God?

I did so here in post no. 431, with quotes from your own BoM, which shows pretty blatant modalism, with Jesus being his very own father....

Sooooo, pot, meet kettle...

 

[brotherofJared]

1) We don't believe Jesus is HIs own Father.

You're going to have a hard time convincing me if that one. It fits right in with the rest of the unbelievable you guys claim to believe.

Pathetic

Now there's a point we can agree on. Such doctrine is exactly that.

 

[brotherofJared]

No, that would be your very own Book of Mormon with its modalism:

LOL. Once again, that obviously is not the correct interpretation. After seeing this, it's no wonder our critics can't support their claims.

I did so here in post no. 431, with quotes from your own BoM, which shows pretty blatant modalism, with Jesus being his very own father....

Sooooo, pot, meet kettle...

So, no. You didn't answer anything. You created a smoke screen to hid behind. The true id, you all haven't got a clue, but you are willing to continually bleat your "there is only one God" claim.

To be clear, God is one. They are not one being. Nothing in the Bible even remotely suggests that they are one being. Paul made this quite clear, indeed that ARE MANY GODS and perhaps that would work for you on the premise that he was referring to idols, but he makes it clear when he named the One God and it wasn't Jesus Christ.

Sorry, you have a completely untenable religion that comes nowhere near the gospel that Paul taught.