The twelve behind COVID misinformation

CrowCross

Super Member
A bad flu with an elevated death rate is what covid is,
How true.

Now we have spike proteins raging through the veins of those who have been jabbed.....and will line up for the booster.

But they find a left wing fact checker who tells them that's nonsense...and feel that attacking a platform rather than checking out the science is the way to get better.
 

Whateverman

Well-known member
Disagree - for the simple reason that this partisanship being promulgated by the media has not helped. In fact, the situation has worsened.
We need to change where we focus our attention if we hope to beat this thing.
Blaming red voters may not be the problem - I know a 49y.o. staunch blue voting black guy who vehemently rejects the vaccines.
I've seen believable stories of blue voter vaccine hesitancy. Just this morning, there was one about a pregnant woman who'd already lost a baby previously, and was deathly-afraid of getting vaccinated during her current pregnancy because of it. Actually, I'd say this theme is fairly common, as I've seen a bunch of women (independent of politics) have the same concerns.

I also saw a poll several weeks ago which listed (R) vs (D) responses to questions like "how likely are you to get vaccinated". I was surprised when I saw that something like 12% of Democrats responded "never / not-at-all" (while the (R) percentage was triple that amount).

So when it comes to vax hesitancy, it's clear that the phenomenon isn't purely partisan.

---

However, it appears to be primarily-so.

Is it that you disagree with this, or are you disagreeing that reporting on this is important/useful/interesting?
 

Furion

Well-known member
The US has long mandated vaccines under different circumstances and against many different pathogens. This one is no different.

And yes, people who would chose, for political or conspiracy-based reasons, to not get vaccinated should suffer some consequences. Some might lose their jobs, and others might just have to find different places to shop or homeschool their kids.
I already know you want them to suffer vibise. In fact there is little you would stop against those ignorant and foolish people.
 

inertia

Super Member
...

You really think nutrition and exercise are pseudoscience?

...

What?

Unlike pseudoscience, legitimate scientific procedures have demonstrated results that work for the vast majority of people. Pseudoscience is based on a house of cards lacking scientific integrity and produces a cult-like following. Proper nutrition and exercise by themselves will not and cannot stop a virus even though they are recommended and helpful for overall health.

- People that advertise pseudoscience promote misinformation such as 5G mobile networks are linked with the virus

- Pseudoscience promoters also spread rumors such as the "pandemic is a conspiracy", that injections "magnetize" people, and that "psychological factors are the cause of illness", that polio was not eradicated by vaccines, and that vitamin C and D are finally adopted as coronavirus treatment"

- Pseudoscience promoters sell fake "cures" such as coffee enemas for depression, and homeopathy


 

Bonnie

Super Member
Just stop. These sources you name are corrupt.
Why? Because you don't like what they have to say? Sorry, I will believe THEM over GP, NN, Tucker Carlson, and stuff on Brighteon and Bitchute any nanosecond of any day.

If you want corruption, you can go to that link to Columbia University's Graduate School of Journalism, where they list all of the known fake news/biased/conspiracy theory-pushing websites, and see if Reuters, AJC, et. al. are on that list....
 

Bonnie

Super Member
How true.

Now we have spike proteins raging through the veins of those who have been jabbed.....and will line up for the booster.

But they find a left wing fact checker who tells them that's nonsense...and feel that attacking a platform rather than checking out the science is the way to get better.
How about posting stuff from legitimate news and medical sources that say the spike proteins generated by the vaccine act differently than the ones on the actual virus, and do not last that long in the body, thus, not "raging" through it? Is that okay? As I have done?
 

Bonnie

Super Member
I already know you want them to suffer vibise. In fact there is little you would stop against those ignorant and foolish people.
Actually I don't think anyone should suffer because of a refusal to get the vaccine. That is a bit much. Our pastor today actually had a mini-sermon on this, after the service had ended. He said he had noted that there have been some disparaging comments in our congregation about those who won't get the vaccine. He pointed out that there ARE legitimate medical, ethical, and conscience reasons for not taking the vaccine, that have nothing to do with conspiracy theories. He said it is a private decision and no one should be shamed or disparaged for not getting it, even if for the wrong reasons. We are to treat each other with courtesy and respect, even with the vaccination issue. Our own synod leadership has stated it is a private decision, between us and God.
 

HouOz

Well-known member
I've seen believable stories of blue voter vaccine hesitancy. Just this morning, there was one about a pregnant woman who'd already lost a baby previously, and was deathly-afraid of getting vaccinated during her current pregnancy because of it. Actually, I'd say this theme is fairly common, as I've seen a bunch of women (independent of politics) have the same concerns.

I also saw a poll several weeks ago which listed (R) vs (D) responses to questions like "how likely are you to get vaccinated". I was surprised when I saw that something like 12% of Democrats responded "never / not-at-all" (while the (R) percentage was triple that amount).

So when it comes to vax hesitancy, it's clear that the phenomenon isn't purely partisan.

---

However, it appears to be primarily-so.

Is it that you disagree with this, or are you disagreeing that reporting on this is important/useful/interesting?
I'm saying the reporting on this is politically motivated, inaccurate and counterproductive.
While ever this political gamesmanship that the media is irresponsibly engaging in continues, the chances of making real progress against Covid will be hamstrung and the division we see in this country will continue.
 

Whateverman

Well-known member
I'm saying the reporting on this is politically motivated, inaccurate and counterproductive.
While ever this political gamesmanship that the media is irresponsibly engaging in continues, the chances of making real progress against Covid will be hamstrung and the division we see in this country will continue.
OK. I may not entirely agree with you on this, but I definitely sympathize with what you're saying; focusing on the political aspect of vaccine resistance wont in any way convince the resistant to behave differently.
 

vibise

Well-known member
...

However, the RNA sequence in the Moderna & Pfizer vaccine is supposedly programmable for how they are dealing with the virus rather than the usual way of making the vaccine by building that vaccine off of a part of the virus.

To inject an RNA sequence into the DNA to fight the virus is questionable. To supplant the immune system of the DNA with an artificial one is just asking for trouble. We already see that booster shots may be necessary. Problem is, what if by supplanting the body's immune system with an artificial one, the compromised body becomes the immune system to the virus since the virus' system is not compromised for why they are adapting and producing variants from some individuals??

Vaccines have had some odd and rare side effects on people. Those vaccinated has been reported in getting the Covid-19 again. Some vaccinated have been reported getting the variant for why booster shots are needed.

...
The construct used in the mRNA vaccine is a vector into which is inserted the sequence for spike protein. The inserted sequence can be easily replaced with a different one for a different viral protein or for a variant of spike. This might be done if covid variants evolve that are not recognized by antibodies against the original spike protein.

There is nothing questionable about injecting an mRNA. This does not remotely supplant the immune system encoded by the host DNA. The way the immune system works is that when the body is first exposed to a new antigen, the system is primed so that it is prepared to mount a major response at the next exposure. Priming can be achieved by injecting a viral protein, or by injecting an mRNA which then directs the body's cells to produce that protein which then elicits the same response as the injected viral protein. The mRNA does not alter the person's DNA or compromise the immune system.

Yes vaccines have odd and rare side effects, but infection with covid can elicit more common negative side effects.
Vaccination does not prevent the initial infection. It inhibits spread of the virus after infection, so that disease, if it develops at all, is mild. that person may, however, be shedding virus that could infect others.
So far the discussion about booster shots is focused on people with compromised immune systems in which the two shot regimen did not elicit a strong enough response.
 

vibise

Well-known member
Control group? Where is yours? For your claims about unvaccinated and hospitalized? How many are hospitalized in Chicago for gunshot wounds since all that is a weekly occurrence?

They still corroborate each other. Besides you are doing a double standard with your unvaccinated and hospitalized as if it is all written in stone and moving the goalposts to any counterfactual stats which dispute your unscientific pro vacc advocacy.
Hospitals are reporting on the covid patients they have and their vaccination status. The comparison is between the number of hospitalized with and without vaccination.

The VAERs and Euro systems do not corroborate anything other than the fact that people are reporting any adverse medical event that occurs after vaccination. These reports do not demonstrate causation, they only provide a database of cases that could warrant investigation.
 

Hark

Well-known member
The construct used in the mRNA vaccine is a vector into which is inserted the sequence for spike protein. The inserted sequence can be easily replaced with a different one for a different viral protein or for a variant of spike. This might be done if covid variants evolve that are not recognized by antibodies against the original spike protein.

There is nothing questionable about injecting an mRNA. This does not remotely supplant the immune system encoded by the host DNA. The way the immune system works is that when the body is first exposed to a new antigen, the system is primed so that it is prepared to mount a major response at the next exposure. Priming can be achieved by injecting a viral protein, or by injecting an mRNA which then directs the body's cells to produce that protein which then elicits the same response as the injected viral protein. The mRNA does not alter the person's DNA or compromise the immune system.

Yes vaccines have odd and rare side effects, but infection with covid can elicit more common negative side effects.
Vaccination does not prevent the initial infection. It inhibits spread of the virus after infection, so that disease, if it develops at all, is mild. that person may, however, be shedding virus that could infect others.
So far the discussion about booster shots is focused on people with compromised immune systems in which the two shot regimen did not elicit a strong enough response.
Thanks for sharing.
 

vibise

Well-known member
Disagree - for the simple reason that this partisanship being promulgated by the media has not helped. In fact, the situation has worsened.
We need to change where we focus our attention if we hope to beat this thing.
Blaming red voters may not be the problem - I know a 49y.o. staunch blue voting black guy who vehemently rejects the vaccines.
How do you solve the undervaccination problem if you don't first determine who the people are who refuse to get vaccinated?

While you may know one Dem black guy who refuses vaccination, all of the evidence shows that it is Trump supporters who are the least likely to get vaccinated.
 

Carol

Well-known member
What?

Unlike pseudoscience, legitimate scientific procedures have demonstrated results that work for the vast majority of people. Pseudoscience is based on a house of cards lacking scientific integrity and produces a cult-like following. Proper nutrition and exercise by themselves will not and cannot stop a virus even though they are recommended and helpful for overall health.

A healthy body is better able to deal with a virus.

ETA- are you aware how little is taught about nutrition in med school?

- People that advertise pseudoscience promote misinformation such as 5G mobile networks are linked with the virus

- Pseudoscience promoters also spread rumors such as the "pandemic is a conspiracy", that injections "magnetize" people, and that "psychological factors are the cause of illness", that polio was not eradicated by vaccines, and that vitamin C and D are finally adopted as coronavirus treatment"

- Pseudoscience promoters sell fake "cures" such as coffee enemas for depression, and homeopathy



The panic has been exaggerated.

Not all who have reservations about this "vaccine" promote homeopathy or accupuncture.

Why did you snip the rest of my post?
 
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vibise

Well-known member
Fearmongering.

Not all unvaccinated have the bug, and some have already had it and have natural immunity.
And some vaccinated still catch and spread it.
But:

1 - The vaccinated are less likely to get sick from a covid infection.
2 - The unvaccinated are more likely to carry higher viral loads and therefore be more dangerous to be around.
3 - Vaccination clearly protects.
4 - Since it is possible to get infected from anyone you encounter, it is best to be vaccinated and also take secondary mitigation measures like masking and social distancing.
 

vibise

Well-known member
Covid-19 is the only sars virus?

Bonnie, all you do is criticize platforms. The opinion of the left is getting old.
Maybe you could respond to the criticisms of those platforms, explaining why you think they provide accurate information that is scientifically and medically sound.
 

Harry Leggs

Super Member
Hospitals are reporting on the covid patients they have and their vaccination status. The comparison is between the number of hospitalized with and without vaccination.
Where is the independent corroboration? What are they not reporting? You keep ignoring that and spamming the same talking points.
The VAERs and Euro systems do not corroborate anything
Actually, they do. it is called corroboration. It means if the VAERS system has any validity then it should be predicted the EURO system would produce similar results since they are independent of each other. And they do.
other than the fact that people are reporting any adverse medical event that occurs after vaccination.
Three days? Hospitalization and deaths? What about the under 40 crowd and heart problems after receiving the injections?
These reports do not demonstrate causation,
They can. You are not an objective source since you are partisan and not objective. So why believe you?
they only provide a database of cases that could warrant investigation.
Independent investigation and not an investigation by compromised sources. Fox guarding the henhouse-type sources.
 

vibise

Well-known member
I'm saying the reporting on this is politically motivated, inaccurate and counterproductive.
While ever this political gamesmanship that the media is irresponsibly engaging in continues, the chances of making real progress against Covid will be hamstrung and the division we see in this country will continue.
What is inaccurate about the claim that those who are refusing vaccination are mostly Trump supporters?
Can you show data that the majority of Trump supporters are vaccinated?
 

vibise

Well-known member
A healthy body is better able to deal with a virus.



The panic has been exaggerated.

Not all who have reservations about this "vaccine" promote homeopathy or accupuncture.

Why did you snip the rest of my post?
Everyone does not have a healthy body, often through no fault of their own. People are disease-prone due to genetics or environmental toxins, for example.

When ICUs are full of covid patients, the problem is not exaggerated.

Unfortunately, may who reject the vaccine are taking no precautions to prevent infection.
 

vibise

Well-known member
Where is the independent corroboration? What are they not reporting? You keep ignoring that and spamming the same talking points.

Actually, they do. it is called corroboration. It means if the VAERS system has any validity then it should be predicted the EURO system would produce similar results since they are independent of each other. And they do.

Three days? Hospitalization and deaths? What about the under 40 crowd and heart problems after receiving the injections?

They can. You are not an objective source since you are partisan and not objective. So why believe you?

Independent investigation and not an investigation by compromised sources. Fox guarding the henhouse-type sources.
If the VAERs and Euro systems both report that 10% of their reports are strokes, but it turns out that an age-matched cohort in the general population would be expected to get strokes at 10%, then there is no vaccine correlation.

At this point you are claiming that scientific and medical experts are lying as well as hospitals treating covid patients. If your claims are based on unsupported accusations of lying by any and all experts and medical personnel then I don't think you have a leg to stand on.
 
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