The Value of Evangelism in Reform Theology

brightfame52

Well-known member
Sorry previous to salvation all have worked iniquity
So you believe God loved no one ?

The issue comes down to how one defines the characteristic of love.

According to Paul, “love does not seek its own,” and thus it is best described as “self-sacrificial” rather than “self-serving” (1 Cor. 13:5). As Jesus taught, “Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends.” It seems safe to say that love at its very root is self-sacrificial. Anything less than that should not be called “love.” One may refer to “kindness” or “care” in reflection of some common provisions for humanity, but unless it reaches the level of self-sacrifice it does not seem to meet the biblical definition of true love.

Given that biblical definition of love as “self-sacrifice,” let us consider Christ’s command to love our enemies. Is this an expectation Christ himself is unwilling to fulfill? As we asked in the beginning, is He being hypocritical in this command? Of course not. The very reason He told His followers to love their enemies is “in order that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven…” (Matt. 5:45).

The meaning is undeniable. We are to love our enemies because God loves His enemies. He loves both “the righteous and the unrighteous” in exactly the same way we are told to love our enemies. The greatest commandment instructs us to “love our neighbor as ourselves” (Lev. 19:18; Matt. 22:37-38). “And who is our neighbor?” (Lk. 10:29). The pagan Samaritans, who were detested as enemies of God.
You can't deny it, there's people God hates!
 

TomFL

Well-known member
You can't deny it, there's people God hates!
Once again sacrifical concerning for others is the characteristic of love

God loves his enemies and commands us to do likewise


Matthew 5:38–48 (KJV 1900)
38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: 39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. 40 And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloke also. 41 And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain. 42 Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.
43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. 44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; 45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. 46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? 47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? 48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Doing so marks one as a child of the Father
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Sorry previous to salvation all have worked iniquity
So you believe God loved no one ?

The issue comes down to how one defines the characteristic of love.

According to Paul, “love does not seek its own,” and thus it is best described as “self-sacrificial” rather than “self-serving” (1 Cor. 13:5). As Jesus taught, “Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends.” It seems safe to say that love at its very root is self-sacrificial. Anything less than that should not be called “love.” One may refer to “kindness” or “care” in reflection of some common provisions for humanity, but unless it reaches the level of self-sacrifice it does not seem to meet the biblical definition of true love.

Given that biblical definition of love as “self-sacrifice,” let us consider Christ’s command to love our enemies. Is this an expectation Christ himself is unwilling to fulfill? As we asked in the beginning, is He being hypocritical in this command? Of course not. The very reason He told His followers to love their enemies is “in order that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven…” (Matt. 5:45).

The meaning is undeniable. We are to love our enemies because God loves His enemies. He loves both “the righteous and the unrighteous” in exactly the same way we are told to love our enemies. The greatest commandment instructs us to “love our neighbor as ourselves” (Lev. 19:18; Matt. 22:37-38). “And who is our neighbor?” (Lk. 10:29). The pagan Samaritans, who were detested as enemies of God.
God does not hate all sinners before salvation. Some He Loved prior to salvation Rom 5:8! Obviously they are a different group of sinners called the election. But they are not the same group He hates PS 5:5
 

TomFL

Well-known member
God does not hate all sinners before salvation. Some He Loved prior to salvation Rom 5:8! Obviously they are a different group of sinners called the election. But they are not the same group He hates PS 5:5

Did you not just contradict your own verse

Psalm 5:5 (ESV)
5 The boastful shall not stand before your eyes;
you hate all evildoers.

False doctrine always leads to contradiction
 

TomFL

Well-known member
You can't deny it, there's people God hates!

You cannot deny you have God loving and sending Christ to die for those your verse Psa 5:5 stated he hated

Obviously your understanding is defective

Nor can you deny God sent Christ to save the world
 

TomFL

Well-known member
God does not hate all sinners before salvation. Some He Loved prior to salvation Rom 5:8! Obviously they are a different group of sinners called the election. But they are not the same group He hates PS 5:5
You have a major problem

Psa 5:5 says he hates ALL not some workers of iniquity

Why do you quote a verse you obviously do not believe as written
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
You cannot deny you have God loving and sending Christ to die for those your verse Psa 5:5 stated he hated

Obviously your understanding is defective

Nor can you deny God sent Christ to save the world
Fabrication. Those God hates Christ didn't die for.
 
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