True non canonical prophet
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Christian SDA
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Actually, the trustee of the EGW Estate wrote the following:
D.A. DELAFIELD: "INSOFAR AS ELLEN WHITE'S ROLE IN THE CHURCH IS CONCERNED-- WHETHER PASTORAL OR CANONICAL- I think we must here give pause and rethink the acceptance with ease of Ford" proposition. In his forum talk at P.U.C. HE INDICATED THAT ELLEN WHITE'S ROLE WAS PASTORAL NOT CANONICAL. This is a gross perversion of the truth...The real conflict and issue today is this: ARE SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTISTS BEING CONDITIONED TO VIEW ELLEN WHITE AS PASTORAL AND NOT CANONICAL? Shall we accept the view that a Seventh-day Adventist theologian is more dependable than a Seventh-day Adventist prophet? I highly respect many of our Seventh-day Adventist theologians. I have sat at their feet and been taught by them. I admire and respect them highly. I would like to remind you, however, that you can search the Bible from Genesis to Revelation and you will not find a single text marking out theologians as having the gift of the Holy Sprit. The Scriptures indicate however, that prophets have a gift of the Holy Spirit. ELLEN WHITE HAD THAT GIFT AND SHE WAS CANONICAL INSOFAR AS DOCTRINAL INTERPRETATION AUTHORITY IS CONCERNED..." -- Letter from D. A. Delafiel trustee of the EGW Estate, to P. C. Drewer, June 24, 1981. Note: Delafield's letter was tampered with and the phrase that EGW was "canonical insofar as doctrinal interpretation" was deleted.
D.A. DELAFIELD: "INSOFAR AS ELLEN WHITE'S ROLE IN THE CHURCH IS CONCERNED-- WHETHER PASTORAL OR CANONICAL- I think we must here give pause and rethink the acceptance with ease of Ford" proposition. In his forum talk at P.U.C. HE INDICATED THAT ELLEN WHITE'S ROLE WAS PASTORAL NOT CANONICAL. This is a gross perversion of the truth...The real conflict and issue today is this: ARE SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTISTS BEING CONDITIONED TO VIEW ELLEN WHITE AS PASTORAL AND NOT CANONICAL? Shall we accept the view that a Seventh-day Adventist theologian is more dependable than a Seventh-day Adventist prophet? I highly respect many of our Seventh-day Adventist theologians. I have sat at their feet and been taught by them. I admire and respect them highly. I would like to remind you, however, that you can search the Bible from Genesis to Revelation and you will not find a single text marking out theologians as having the gift of the Holy Sprit. The Scriptures indicate however, that prophets have a gift of the Holy Spirit. ELLEN WHITE HAD THAT GIFT AND SHE WAS CANONICAL INSOFAR AS DOCTRINAL INTERPRETATION AUTHORITY IS CONCERNED..." -- Letter from D. A. Delafiel trustee of the EGW Estate, to P. C. Drewer, June 24, 1981. Note: Delafield's letter was tampered with and the phrase that EGW was "canonical insofar as doctrinal interpretation" was deleted.
SDAchristian
Well-known member
Prologue:
AV Mt 25:45-46 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did [it] not to one of the least of these, ye did [it] not to me. 46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
Start killing sabbath keepers, like Jesus was, is and will be a sabbath keeper, see how much respect GOD gives to sin, Right ???
AV Hb 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
Jesus Christ in the flesh, is "the same yesterday" in walking on earth, "to day" walking in heaven "and for ever" walking in Heaven in life eternal with all the saints.
Go ahead and deny Jesus' 'righteous'ness in the living saints. Many(demographically) might as well, murdered Jesus yourselves too.
All true prophets understood GOD's will in "my holy day". Sort accordingly !!!
The dig about "Joseph Smith" is, The Book of Mormon(modern writing) talks about keeping sabbath. Hypocrites, Right ???
AV Mt 7:13-16 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. 15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
AV Mt 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
This is so simple, look at the majority versus the minority.
It is easy to spot non-believers of Jesus' righteousness of being on earth. DUH !!!
This is so ironic demographically, that is coming true before our very eyes and ears.
Yours in Christ, Michael
AV Mt 25:45-46 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did [it] not to one of the least of these, ye did [it] not to me. 46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
Start killing sabbath keepers, like Jesus was, is and will be a sabbath keeper, see how much respect GOD gives to sin, Right ???
AV Hb 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
Jesus Christ in the flesh, is "the same yesterday" in walking on earth, "to day" walking in heaven "and for ever" walking in Heaven in life eternal with all the saints.
Go ahead and deny Jesus' 'righteous'ness in the living saints. Many(demographically) might as well, murdered Jesus yourselves too.
AV Mt 10:32-34 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven. 33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven. 34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
All true prophets understood GOD's will in "my holy day". Sort accordingly !!!
They are first/sun day keepers, and not walking in Jesus' footsteps while on earth.
The dig about "Joseph Smith" is, The Book of Mormon(modern writing) talks about keeping sabbath. Hypocrites, Right ???
AV Mt 7:13-16 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. 15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
AV Mt 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
This is so simple, look at the majority versus the minority.
It is easy to spot non-believers of Jesus' righteousness of being on earth. DUH !!!
This is so ironic demographically, that is coming true before our very eyes and ears.
Yours in Christ, Michael
So no list then Michael.
Does that mean all those other prophets are true prophets?
Icyspark
Active member
Attention Lurkers: The Bible very clearly says, "God has placed IN THE CHURCH ... prophets ..." It also says that Christians are to "eagerly desire gifts of the Spirit, especially prophecy." Former Adventists and critics of Adventism deny these clear verities and thus cannot be expected to objectively, honestly and fairly examine anyone who claims to have the gift of prophecy.
You haven’t answered the post, nowhere in this post does it say anything about what your saying.
Still no list then?
Just trying to use a straw man argument to create a diversion.
The Bible explicitly states to test all things, so show a list of how EGW is a true non canonical prophet and a list of why those others I mentioned are not.
How can we tell if a prophet is a true prophet of God? Many people have said that God spoke to or through them. How do we discern that this is so?
Just wonderin',
--Rich
BTW, I am not a cessationist, per se.
Icyspark
Active member
Is my premise true with you? If reject ALL prophets then why do you require a list? It's a silly exercise in futility.
Icyspark
Active member
Hi RiJoRi,
Do you accept the two texts I shared in my first post? 👇
If you can acknowledge the ongoing nature of these two texts for "the church" then perhaps I'd be willing to engage with you in this discussion. Those who are deniers of this simple premise have no reason to pursue tests of prophets whom they've predetermined cannot exist.
God bless.
Still no list?
Icyspark
Active member
Still no acknowledgement that the gift of prophecy still exists for "the CHURCH"? Baby steps.
In fact, though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you the elementary truths of God’s word all over again. You need milk, not solid food!
Do you want to be a teacher? Then you need to learn the elementary truths of God's word all over again. You don't get to affirm and deny God's word in the same breath. Either the gift of prophecy remains "in the CHURCH" as Paul says, or as you says, it doesn't. As for me, I'll be going with Paul over your uninspired opinion every time. And if you can't acknowledge something so elementary as this simple truth, why would you expect to jump into deeper waters to explore specific aspects of prophets? If you reject ALL prophets outside the Bible, then there's no reason to to reason with you on this subject.
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I attended an indie Pentecostal church for many years after getting saved, so I don't have trouble with the idea of continuing spiritual gifts. That said, I find the general lack of spiritual discernment (1Cor 12:10) in the church to be appalling.
--Rich
SDAchristian
Well-known member
No !!! Besides, you missed the point with Joseph Smith, between believe of faith and works of faith.
AV 1Ti 2:14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
The serpent knows that mixing a lie with truth, is a whole lie. See Eve's deception as an example of "between believe of faith and works of faith" in sinning, another type of works and lack of faith to continue to sin. This technique("mixing a lie with truth, is a whole lie") is used by false prophets !!!
AV Mal 3:6 For I [am] the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.
AV Isa 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, [from] doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking [thine own] words:
Any prophet's disobedience of "nor speaking [thine own] words:" is obviously found between GOD's words of "I change not" and "the sabbath", this includes any prophet of GOD for your list as Number 1.
Yours in Christ, Michael
SDAchristian
Well-known member
Prologue:
AV Re 16:4-7 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood. 5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus. 6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy. 7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous [are] thy judgments.
As a side topic, "I heard another out of the altar say", Who are the Altar of Heaven ??? <<< Those of the Holy Spirit know !!!
Many will be guilty of "the blood of saints and prophets" in this plague. Their failure to identify "saints and prophets" is a MAJOR sign that they have no saving relationship with GOD or with GOD's Authority over righteousness and sin.
AV Mt 25:45-46 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did [it] not to one of the least of these, ye did [it] not to me. 46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
Just like those who killed Jesus !!!
Obviously not. Their as in many, spirit in residence, will not let them.
AV Ro 13:8-10 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. 9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if [there be] any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love [is] the fulfilling of the law.
Thought for discussion: Does GOD's prophets distinguish between killing Jesus as a sabbath keeper from killing other sabbath keepers in GOD's Perpetual Truth, Today ???
Yours in Christ, Michael
AV Re 16:4-7 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood. 5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus. 6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy. 7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous [are] thy judgments.
As a side topic, "I heard another out of the altar say", Who are the Altar of Heaven ??? <<< Those of the Holy Spirit know !!!
Many will be guilty of "the blood of saints and prophets" in this plague. Their failure to identify "saints and prophets" is a MAJOR sign that they have no saving relationship with GOD or with GOD's Authority over righteousness and sin.
AV Mt 25:45-46 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did [it] not to one of the least of these, ye did [it] not to me. 46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
Just like those who killed Jesus !!!
AV Mk 5:8 For he said unto him, Come out of the man, [thou] unclean spirit.
Obviously not. Their as in many, spirit in residence, will not let them.
AV Ro 13:8-10 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. 9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if [there be] any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love [is] the fulfilling of the law.
Thought for discussion: Does GOD's prophets distinguish between killing Jesus as a sabbath keeper from killing other sabbath keepers in GOD's Perpetual Truth, Today ???
Yours in Christ, Michael
So Joseph Smith is a false prophet?
SDAchristian
Well-known member
AV Re 2:14 But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication.
A hypocrite of GOD's own words, like "Balaam", Yes.
And because Jesus said it in the New Testament, did we learn our lesson from it ???
AV Num 22:27-28 And when the ass saw the angel of the LORD, she fell down under Balaam: and Balaam's anger was kindled, and he smote the ass with a staff. 28 And the LORD opened the mouth of the ass, and she said unto Balaam, What have I done unto thee, that thou hast smitten me these three times?
Some see "the angel of the LORD" and some don't. But they smite the other who does, with woeful words, because of their own personal opinions(like "Balaam") in context.
Yours in Christ, Michael
All of the founders and ruling authorities within the Sda put Ellen White on same par with the OT Prophets and NT Apostles!
So what is the Sda proof that she was a real prophet, while those as Smith and Muhammed were not?
SDAchristian
Well-known member
Prologue:
There are those, who can not discern GOD's Words in others, per Jesus.
I hope you do better in the judgment to come, to understand who are "the righteous".
Yours in Christ, Michael
AV Mt 25:45-46 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did [it] not to one of the least of these, ye did [it] not to me. 46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
There are those, who can not discern GOD's Words in others, per Jesus.
I hope you do better in the judgment to come, to understand who are "the righteous".
Yours in Christ, Michael