True non canonical prophet

[BJ Bear]

Hi BJ Bear,

No, I wasn't referring to that particular text, but that's certainly something relevant to the discussion. Let's read it with a little more context:

Ephesians 4:11-13​

11 So Christ himself gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the pastors and teachers, 12 to equip his people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up 13 until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.​

So in the list above we see that Christ gave these specific groups "to equip His people for works of service." Since no one can supply a "use by" date for the end of any of these groups, then for one to arbitrarily attempt to excise any group from the list is brazen and irresponsible.

Have "we all reach[ed] unity in the faith"? Have "we all ... become mature, attaining the whole measure of the fullness of Christ"? If not then the "until" aspect of Paul's affirmation is still in effect.

1 Corinthians 12:28​

And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues.​

Say it with me: "God has placed IN THE CHURCH ... PROPHETS" Paul then goes on to admonish us to "eagerly desire the greater gifts." What specific gift do you think he wants us to especially "desire"?

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

Taking the passage out of context doesn't change the undefined type of action indicated by, "gave," in Ephesians 4:11.

The epistle to the Ephesians is an actual letter to intended first century recipients, the church at Ephesus. The first person plural pronoun, "we," in the passage you cite refers to first century persons.

 

[YeshuaFan]

Taking the passage out of context doesn't change the undefined type of action indicated by, "gave," in Ephesians 4:11.

The epistle to the Ephesians is an actual letter to intended first century recipients, the church at Ephesus. The first person plural pronoun, "we," in the passage you cite refers to first century persons.

The writer of hebrfews agrees with you, as he stated that there were signs and wonders confirming Jesus-as the messiah and His gospel by the Apostles, and in the past to his time!

 

[Icyspark]

Taking the passage out of context doesn't change the undefined type of action indicated by, "gave," in Ephesians 4:11.

The epistle to the Ephesians is an actual letter to intended first century recipients, the church at Ephesus. The first person plural pronoun, "we," in the passage you cite refers to first century persons.

Hi BJ Bear,

So I'm surmising that nothing Paul or any of the New Testament authors wrote has any relevance to you unless your name is specifically mentioned in their writings? If that's the case then you can't even acknowledge being a Christian or what being a Christian even means.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

 

[Common Tater]

Hi BJ Bear,

So I'm surmising that nothing Paul or any of the New Testament authors wrote has any relevance to you unless your name is specifically mentioned in their writings? If that's the case then you can't even acknowledge being a Christian or what being a Christian even means.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

On the other hand, if you think everything that God has spoken to a specific people also applies to you, you're going to find yourself dragging a "stubborn and rebellious son" outside the city where you live and stoning him to death. Or if you find out that someone has lit his fireplace on a certain day of the week, you and your other church members are going to have to kill the offending person.

 

[YeshuaFan]

On the other hand, if you think everything that God has spoken to a specific people also applies to you, you're going to find yourself dragging a "stubborn and rebellious son" outside the city where you live and stoning him to death. Or if you find out that someone has lit his fireplace on a certain day of the week, you and your other church members are going to have to kill the offending person.

And IF any Sda member was actually alive during OT times, would have been killed, as only Jesus ever kept the Sabbath fully!

 

[JonHawk]

And IF any Sda member was actually alive during OT times, would have been killed, as only Jesus ever kept the Sabbath fully!

For both He who sanctifies and those who are sanctified are all of One Father; Heb 2:11
At that day you will know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you. John 14:20

 

[Buzzard]

[

On the other hand, if you think everything that God has spoken to a specific people also applies to you, you're going to find yourself dragging a "stubborn and rebellious son" outside the city where you live and stoning him to death. Or if you find out that someone has lit his fireplace on a certain day of the week, you and your other church members are going to have to kill the offending person.

Common Tater;
Michael has told us 2-3 times that him and his buddies have god given authority to do such;

 

[JonHawk]

Taking the passage out of context doesn't change the undefined type of action indicated by, "gave," in Ephesians 4:11.

The epistle to the Ephesians is an actual letter to intended first century recipients, the church at Ephesus. The first person plural pronoun, "we," in the passage you cite refers to first century persons.

You don't have to scratch out the entire book since you're not the first century recipient, just read it the way you normally do:

One Lord, one faith, one water ritual.​

(Ephesians 4:4-5)​

JonHawk:
The reason I came baptizing with water was that He might be revealed to Israel. John 1:31

Afterward Jesus appeared in a different form to two of them ...These returned and reported it to the rest; but they did not believe them either.
Later Jesus appeared to them as they were eating; he rebuked them for their lack of faith and their stubborn refusal to believe those who had seen him after he had risen.
And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. He who believes and is baptized [with the Holy Spirit]
will be saved....

But he who does not believe will be condemned. Mark 16:12-16

If they had been of us, they would have remained with us; but they went out, so that it would be evident that they all are not of us.
But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth. 1 John 2-18-20 (And the truth will set you free; John 8:32)

So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty. For judgment is without mercy to the one who has shown no mercy.
Mercy triumphs over judgment. James 2:12-13

 

[BJ Bear]

Hi BJ Bear,

So I'm surmising that nothing Paul or any of the New Testament authors wrote has any relevance to you unless your name is specifically mentioned in their writings? If that's the case then you can't even acknowledge being a Christian or what being a Christian even means.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

Hi Icyspark,

That guess would be incorrect since there are numerous passages which don't mention me by name yet apply directly to all men, which necessarily includes me. For example, “He is the payment for our sins, and not only for our sins, but also for the sins of the whole world.” (1Jo 2:2, GodsWord)

Of course that doesn't mean all of Scripture or all of a portion of Scripture is written about me or to me.

 

[BJ Bear]

You don't have to scratch out the entire book since you're not the first century recipient, just read it the way you normally do:

That is utter nonsense since no one has scratched out the entire book and because a normal reading of the book leads to the necessary conclusion that it's intended recipients are first century people.

The immediate context rules.

 

[YeshuaFan]

Hi BJ Bear,

So I'm surmising that nothing Paul or any of the New Testament authors wrote has any relevance to you unless your name is specifically mentioned in their writings? If that's the case then you can't even acknowledge being a Christian or what being a Christian even means.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

No, we hold that the Apostles were gifted and sent by God with the NT, but that Ellen White was a false prophetess!

 

[YeshuaFan]

Do woman see wear head coverings, and do all still have long hair?

 

[Common Tater]

Hi BJ Bear,

No, I wasn't referring to that particular text, but that's certainly something relevant to the discussion. Let's read it with a little more context:

Ephesians 4:11-13​

11 So Christ himself gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the pastors and teachers, 12 to equip his people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up 13 until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.​

So in the list above we see that Christ gave these specific groups "to equip His people for works of service." Since no one can supply a "use by" date for the end of any of these groups, then for one to arbitrarily attempt to excise any group from the list is brazen and irresponsible.

Have "we all reach[ed] unity in the faith"? Have "we all ... become mature, attaining the whole measure of the fullness of Christ"? If not then the "until" aspect of Paul's affirmation is still in effect.

1 Corinthians 12:28​

And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues.​

Say it with me: "God has placed IN THE CHURCH ... PROPHETS" Paul then goes on to admonish us to "eagerly desire the greater gifts." What specific gift do you think he wants us to especially "desire"?

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

Two or three prophets should speak, and the others should weigh carefully what is said. And if a revelation comes to someone who is seated, the first speaker should stop. For you can all prophesy in turn so that everyone may be instructed and encouraged. 1Corinthians 14:29-31

According to Paul, you'll see two or three prophets at a time in one meeting. How come Seventh-day Adventism has only had one they acknowledge in their entire church history?

 

[JonHawk]

Two or three prophets should speak, and the others should weigh carefully what is said. ... 1Corinthians 14:29-31

For God is not the author of confusion but of peace, as in all the churches of the saints. 1 Cor 14:33

 

[YeshuaFan]

Two or three prophets should speak, and the others should weigh carefully what is said. And if a revelation comes to someone who is seated, the first speaker should stop. For you can all prophesy in turn so that everyone may be instructed and encouraged. 1Corinthians 14:29-31

According to Paul, you'll see two or three prophets at a time in one meeting. How come Seventh-day Adventism has only had one they acknowledge in their entire church history?

And if ANY so called prophet speaks forth theology and doctrines that contradict the scriptures, not of God, and both Joseph Smith and Ellen White failed that test!

 

[JonHawk]

He remembers his covenant forever, the promise he made, for a thousand generations; Psalm 105:8-10

And if ANY so called prophet speaks forth theology and doctrines that contradict the scriptures, not of God, and both Joseph Smith and Ellen White failed that test!

But if they confess their iniquity and the iniquity of their fathers, with their unfaithfulness in which they were unfaithful to Me, and that they also have walked contrary to Me, then I will remember My covenant with Jacob, and My covenant with Isaac and My covenant with Abraham; Lev 26:40-42

 

[Common Tater]

Um, Ellen said it was horrible for you.

This Major Health Benefit of Coffee Was Just Proven True in a New Study

Ready to wake up and smell the coffee? Research suggests that coffee has major health benefits, lowering risk of heart disease and death.

bestlifeonline.com

 

[Buzzard]

'

That is utter nonsense since no one has scratched out the entire book and because a normal reading of the book leads to the necessary conclusion that it's intended recipients are first century people.

The immediate context rules.

1Cor.10:11
and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

 

[JonHawk]

You don't have to scratch out the entire book since you're not the first century recipient, just read it the way you normally do:

One Lord, one faith, one water ritual.​

(Ephesians 4:4-5)​

JonHawk:
The reason I came baptizing with water was that He might be revealed to Israel. John 1:31

Afterward Jesus appeared in a different form to two of them ...These returned and reported it to the rest; but they did not believe them either.
Later Jesus appeared to them as they were eating; he rebuked them for their lack of faith and their stubborn refusal to believe those who had seen him after he had risen.
And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. He who believes and is baptized [with the Holy Spirit]
will be saved....

But he who does not believe will be condemned. Mark 16:12-16

If they had been of us, they would have remained with us; but they went out, so that it would be evident that they all are not of us.
But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth. 1 John 2-18-20

That is utter nonsense since no one has scratched out the entire book and because a normal reading of the book leads to the necessary conclusion that it's intended recipients are first century people.

What part of one Lord one Faith one baptism are you having a problem with?

In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace 8 which He made to abound toward us in all wisdom;

The greatness of God’s power towards us believers is according to the same mighty power 20 which He worked in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly places, 21 far above all principality and power and might and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age but also in that which is to come.
22 And He put all things under His feet, and gave Him to be head over all things to the church, 23 which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all. Eph 1

The immediate context rules.

Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, since as members of one body you were called to peace. And be thankful. Col 3:15

 

[BJ Bear]

'

1Cor.10:11
and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

Indeed, but what Paul referrs to isn't Paul's letter and the word our didn't refer to you or others who are not the initial intended recipients.