Upon this rock/Keys

balshan

Well-known member
Yes, and scripture says that the Holy Spirit will guide us into all the truth. Scripture doesn't limit all Christian beliefs to scripture.
The HS does not work with the wolves in sheep's clothing who lead your institution. In fact, let us be honest the RCs don't believe in the HS leading people, just the bad tree the RCC. There is a difference. The us for the RCC is just the RCC and not a real us.
 

Bonnie

Super Member
I discerned from careful reading and studying of scripture that Jesus gave authority to the Pope.

Then you need to reread Scripture, because nowhere is there a pope even mentioned in the Bible. But first take off your Catholic glasses before reading and read Scripture as if it really had something to say to you, as a child would, reading it for the first time.
So if we want to know what we are to believe as Christians we look to the one who has been given authority. The CCC is the official teaching of the Catholic Church and sense they have been given the authority the CCC is what we should be listening to if we really want to understand scripture and the Christian faith. There is no confusion at all.
Oh, what a lot of twaddle! If we want to look to an authority as to what to believe, we look to the Bible, God's holy and inerrant word. NOT to corrupt popes and unbiblical teachings found in the ultra long and complicated CCC. Your church has robbed its membership of the simplicity that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
 

dingoling.

Well-known member
Then you need to reread Scripture, because nowhere is there a pope even mentioned in the Bible. But first take off your Catholic glasses before reading and read Scripture as if it really had something to say to you, as a child would, reading it for the first time.

Oh, what a lot of twaddle! If we want to look to an authority as to what to believe, we look to the Bible, God's holy and inerrant word. NOT to corrupt popes and unbiblical teachings found in the ultra long and complicated CCC. Your church has robbed its membership of the simplicity that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Actually, as a nCCs, I took my nCCs "glasses" off and read scriptures as if it really had something to say to me, as a child would, reading it for the first time. It was then that I realized that the CC was correct.
 

Bonnie

Super Member
Actually, as a nCCs, I took my nCCs "glasses" off and read scriptures as if it really had something to say to me, as a child would, reading it for the first time. It was then that I realized that the CC was correct.
OH! Well ,then you must have found Mary's IC, PV, and Assumption into heaven, within the pages of the NT....right? Not to mention her as being co-Mediatrix with Jesus Christ--right?

And you must have clearly read about Purgatory, praying to angels, and saints dead in the Lord for help, succor, and faith within the pages of the Bible--Correct?

If so, I wish you would point me to where in the Bible I can find those doctrines clearly laid out, or strongly implied....
 

dingoling.

Well-known member
OH! Well ,then you must have found Mary's IC, PV, and Assumption into heaven, within the pages of the NT....right? Not to mention her as being co-Mediatrix with Jesus Christ--right?

And you must have clearly read about Purgatory, praying to angels, and saints dead in the Lord for help, succor, and faith within the pages of the Bible--Correct?

If so, I wish you would point me to where in the Bible I can find those doctrines clearly laid out, or strongly implied....
Jesus gave Peter and his successors authority. The emphasis is on the fact that the authority is from Jesus.
 

dingoling.

Well-known member
Jesus gave ALL of His disciples authority, not just Peter. Paul had great authority, equal to Peter's, since he was able to rebuke Peter to his face for his hypocrisy. Remember?
You asked me to answer your questions. I answered them.

It is not just what scripture teaches, not all Christians beliefs are found in scripture alone.

You can believe what ever you want about whether Jesus gave Peter authority over the church, but we do see it in scripture and throughout history.

We don't see scripture alone in scripture or throughout history.
 
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organgrinder

Well-known member
Jesus gave Peter and his successors authority. The emphasis is on the fact that the authority is from Jesus.
Another diversion and failure to answer the questions Bonnie posed. Here is her post:
Bonnie said:
OH! Well ,then you must have found Mary's IC, PV, and Assumption into heaven, within the pages of the NT....right? Not to mention her as being co-Mediatrix with Jesus Christ--right?

And you must have clearly read about Purgatory, praying to angels, and saints dead in the Lord for help, succor, and faith within the pages of the Bible--Correct?

If so, I wish you would point me to where in the Bible I can find those doctrines clearly laid out, or strongly implied....
 

organgrinder

Well-known member
You asked me to answer your questions. I answered them.

It is not just what scripture teaches, not all Christians beliefs are found in scripture alone.

You can believe what ever you want about whether Jesus gave Peter authority over the church, but we do see it in scripture and throughout history.

We don't see scripture alone in scripture or throughout history.
Of course you don't. And yet what did Jesus do when tempted by Satan? Can you answer that question or ignore it?
 

Nondenom40

Super Member
You asked me to answer your questions. I answered them.

It is not just what scripture teaches, not all Christians beliefs are found in scripture alone.

You can believe what ever you want about whether Jesus gave Peter authority over the church, but we do see it in scripture and throughout history.

We don't see scripture alone in scripture or throughout history.
If Peter had all this alleged authority why were the disciples arguing over who would be greatest in the kingdom? Why isn't anyone falling down at Peters feet? Why don't any of the churches Paul established appeal to Peter for any decision? Why isn't Paul? Why did James make the final judgement in Acts 15? I can go on and on. You have one shaky verse you hang your hat on and even that doesn't say what you want it to say. The rock petra, isn't Peter. Its Jesus.
 

dingoling.

Well-known member
Another diversion and failure to answer the questions Bonnie posed. Here is her post:
Bonnie said:
OH! Well ,then you must have found Mary's IC, PV, and Assumption into heaven, within the pages of the NT....right? Not to mention her as being co-Mediatrix with Jesus Christ--right?

And you must have clearly read about Purgatory, praying to angels, and saints dead in the Lord for help, succor, and faith within the pages of the Bible--Correct?

If so, I wish you would point me to where in the Bible I can find those doctrines clearly laid out, or strongly implied....
They can be discerned from scripture, but they are not explicitly found in scripture or strongly implied.

But they don't have to be because scripture alone isn't the final/sole authority for the Christian faith.

When the issue of circumcision of the Gentiles came up in the early church did scripture explicitly state or was it strongly implied that the Gentiles believers needed to be circumcised?
 

organgrinder

Well-known member
They can be discerned from scripture, but they are not explicitly found in scripture or strongly implied.

But they don't have to be because scripture alone isn't the final/sole authority for the Christian faith.

When the issue of circumcision of the Gentiles came up in the early church did scripture explicitly state or was it strongly implied that the Gentiles believers needed to be circumcised?
Exactly the point. Not in scripture nor strongly implied. Philosophical reasoning. Paul addressed the issue. Go back and read what he said. It was a subject that was discussed, unlike the IC, perpetual virginity of Mary, mediatrix, etc. which were never even hinted at.
 

dingoling.

Well-known member
Exactly the point. Not in scripture nor strongly implied. Philosophical reasoning. Paul addressed the issue. Go back and read what he said. It was a subject that was discussed, unlike the IC, perpetual virginity of Mary, mediatrix, etc. which were never even hinted at.

Paul addressed the issue? Paul didn't address the issue, him and Barnabas with others went up to Jerusalem to discuss it with the other apostles and elders...
 

organgrinder

Well-known member
The decision was made by the council in Jerusalem. Paul didn't have the authority to settle the issue that is why he and the others went to Jerusalem.
Paul had all the authority he needed-- from Jesus. He went to the council to show them what was happening and that Judaizers claiming to have come from Jerusalem said the Gentiles needed to be circumcised. Paul knew it wasn't true and got a letter affirming that fact. It didn't change his teaching. And the other letters show that.

The point being circumcision was discussed. Nothing about the IC, perpetual virginity, purgatory, etc. You always attempt to divert from the topic at hand. That is why you are a troll.
 

dingoling.

Well-known member
Paul had all the authority he needed-- from Jesus. He went to the council to show them what was happening and that Judaizers claiming to have come from Jerusalem said the Gentiles needed to be circumcised. Paul knew it wasn't true and got a letter affirming that fact. It didn't change his teaching. And the other letters show that.

The point being circumcision was discussed. Nothing about the IC, perpetual virginity, purgatory, etc. You always attempt to divert from the topic at hand. That is why you are a troll.
The issue of circumcision of Gentiles was settled by the council and it was not settled by scripture. There is nothing in the scriptures the Christians had at the time that says the Gentile Christians did not need to be circumcised.
 
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