Was there over 3300 deaths from covid vaccines between Dec 2020 and April 2021?

LifeIn

Well-known member
People die every day from all sorts of causes. Not a single death has been shown to be caused by Pfizer or Moderna shots. It is funny that the same people who doubt the covid death statistics from reputable sources are so willing to believe vaccine death figures from totally trashy sources.
 

Bonnie

Super Member
Data comes from VAERS.

Just in Israel alone they’re seeing so many deaths from vaccines that they’re saying “vaccinations have caused more deaths than the coronavirus would have caused during the same period.”

Where from VAERS? Where is the link to this statistic from its website?

I have never heard of this Foreign Affairs website, but I did find this:


And here is more:

 

Bonnie

Super Member
Sigh....... another "Foreign Affairs Intelligence Council" baseless claim. If people don't vet their sources before posting (as seems to be the case), we readers must do our part to vet the sources we swallow, hook, line, and sinker.
That is what I have been trying to do. I have never even heard of this group and found little about it online. Why should I believe anything it says?
 

Faithoverbelief

Well-known member
That is what I have been trying to do. I have never even heard of this group and found little about it online. Why should I believe anything it says?
You shouldn't. They are so disingenuous when you Google it council of foreign Affairs pops up trying to trick you.
 

Bonnie

Super Member
Sigh....... another "Foreign Affairs Intelligence Council" baseless claim. If people don't vet their sources before posting (as seems to be the case), we readers must do our part to vet the sources we swallow, hook, line, and sinker.
Odd...I have been trying to find other sources to verify what this FAIC has claimed, and have come up with bupkiss. I couldn't even find the FAIC one. I did find two links showing why this is false, that I posted in another post.. Here is a one more:


I am on my tablet and the actual article's url is so long, that I can't put the whole link down on here. But it is easy to find in this link above. It is the second report down.
 
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shnarkle

Well-known member
Umm show me all the dead bodies in Israel. It is a big lie a dangerous lie.
Better yet, show us all ANYONE who has been able to actually isolate this so-called Covid 19 virus. So far, no one can affirm that they ever had an isolated virus. Again, given that the PCR test is useless in diagnosing anyone, there are no cases, nor can anyone legitimately conclude that anyone has died from this phantom virus.

Given that overall deaths are DOWN in 2020, there is no pandemic either.

Given that the CDC has now admitted that only 5% of all deaths are "Covid 19 only", that leaves us with somewhere around 30k Covid 19 deaths. Again, this doesn't come close to being a legitimate epidemic.
 

LifeIn

Well-known member
Better yet, show us all ANYONE who has been able to actually isolate this so-called Covid 19 virus.
Why should this be a pre-requisite to accepting what scientists and medical professionals say about covid-19?

Again, given that the PCR test is useless in diagnosing anyone...
It is useful in screening, so I wouldn't call it useless.

Given that overall deaths are DOWN in 2020
False. Overall deaths are UP in 2020.

Given that the CDC has now admitted that only 5% of all deaths are "Covid 19 only"
A ridiculous distinction. Why should we care any less about the death of a asthma suffered who contracts covid and dies than the death of an Olympic athletes in perfect health who contracts covid and dies? All deaths where covid was the immediate and most proximate cause are rightly counted in the pandemic.
 

vibise

Well-known member
Better yet, show us all ANYONE who has been able to actually isolate this so-called Covid 19 virus. So far, no one can affirm that they ever had an isolated virus. Again, given that the PCR test is useless in diagnosing anyone, there are no cases, nor can anyone legitimately conclude that anyone has died from this phantom virus.

Given that overall deaths are DOWN in 2020, there is no pandemic either.

Given that the CDC has now admitted that only 5% of all deaths are "Covid 19 only", that leaves us with somewhere around 30k Covid 19 deaths. Again, this doesn't come close to being a legitimate epidemic.
You are like a dog with a bone with this insistence that unless the virus is first "isolated" (whatever that means), then none of the covid research that has been done and the viral genomic sequence are not legit. Well, you are completely wrong on that.

Do you honestly think that vaccines would have been developed and administered to millions of people on the basis of an unreliable genetic sequence?

Do you honestly think that topnotch scientists would not be speaking up if there were serious issues with the research being done and published?

You keep finding fringe people with odd objections that don't matter or that are completely wrong.
 

shnarkle

Well-known member
So you are advocating that people not get vaccinated and take the chance of getting the virus?
NONE of the pharmaceutical companies are claiming ANY protection from infection or even immunity through use of their gene therapies. The chances of becoming infected are no better after receiving an injection than they were before.

I'm advocating that those who are mandating that whole populations be injected with an experimental gene therapy be indicted and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law for crimes against humanity. They're in blatant violation of the Geneva Convention's prohibitions against experimenting on human beings.
Your quotes are cherry-picked single sentences or parts of sentences.

They're quite relevant to my point which is why I posted them. Your job is to address what I actually posted, and if you think you can; refute it.
Here is a longer segment from your CDC link:


The article was presenting evidence of the safety and efficacy of the vaccine to support its administration to the general public.
Did you notice this gem:

the Moderna COVID-19 vaccine might also provide some protection against asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection"

LOL. GEE. Thanks Moderna, I was really worried about being protected from a virus that I didn't even know I had in the first place.
I see no reason to check the rest of your links.
You don't seem to see any reason to address what I've posted either. I guess I can safely assume you have no defense for your position, nor any desire to try and refute what I've posted.
 

shnarkle

Well-known member
You are like a <snip>
Ad Hominem attacks do not advance the discussion in any meaningful way.
the virus is first "isolated" (whatever that means),
It means that they have been able to conclusively identify not only a particular virus, but prove that the virus they have identified is in fact CAUSING the infection. It's called Science. When one simply assumes that the soup they are looking at must have a particular virus which they haven't identified at all, that's not science; that's nonsense which in this case has led to blatant propaganda.
the covid research that has been done and the viral genomic sequence are not legit.
Bingo!
Well, you are completely wrong on that.
Prove it. I've supplied numerous links which quite clearly prove that no one has been able to purify or isolate and identify this 30k sequenced corona virus.
Do you honestly think that vaccines would have been developed and administered to millions of people on the basis of an unreliable genetic sequence?
I know this is the case, and I supplied more than enough proof to back it up. They've all admitted that they didn't use an isolated specimen. They just patched pieces of them together and called it Covid 19.
Do you honestly think that topnotch scientists would not be speaking up if there were serious issues with the research being done and published?

Bingo!!! There are!!! In fact, 10,000 have signed their names to a lawsuit brought by 1,000 lawyers which has been received by the Hague charging these Pharmaceutical companies, governments, etc. with crimes against humanity.
You keep finding fringe people with odd objections that don't matter or that are completely wrong.
What fringe people???? I supplied links to the CDC, WHO, NIH etc. The inventor of the PCR test who no one in the medical field or government doubts their credibility?

Pray tell where are you getting these strange ideas from?
 

LifeIn

Well-known member
It means that they have been able to conclusively identify not only a particular virus, but prove that the virus they have identified is in fact CAUSING the infection. It's called Science.
The fact that you used the word "prove" and call that science shows that you do not even know what science is. In fact, scientific theories are never proven. They are only supported to a greater or lesser degree by observations. By this standard, the theory that the virus they have identified causes the syndrome called covid-19 has been supported to a very great degree.


When one simply assumes that the soup they are looking at must have a particular virus which they haven't identified at all
They don't simply assume it. They have evidence that the virus is the cause.


Prove it. I've supplied numerous links which quite clearly prove that no one has been able to purify or isolate and identify this 30k sequenced corona virus.
That proves nothing. You set up a meaningless standard of "purify and isolate" without showing that achieving this meaningless standard is somehow necessary for establishing the claims about covid-19.



I know this is the case, and I supplied more than enough proof to back it up. They've all admitted that they didn't use an isolated specimen. They just patched pieces of them together and called it Covid 19.
That's exactly how genomic sequencing has always worked. It always works by patching together substrings by matching overlapping portions with of the substrings. Did you really think that complete DNA sequencing was done by somehow reading each of the bases in a single unbroken strand?


Bingo!!! There are!!! In fact, 10,000 have signed their names to a lawsuit brought by 1,000 lawyers...
I have no doubt that lawyers want to bring a lawsuit. That's how they make money. And 10,000 names gathered from an online poll with no authentication does not constitute a group of authenticated clients.


What fringe people???? I supplied links to the CDC, WHO, NIH etc. The inventor of the PCR test who no one in the medical field or government doubts their credibility?
The inventor of the PCR test died before there was covid. It really is a stretch to count him as having a valid objection to the covid-19 test.
 

Bonnie

Super Member
Why should this be a pre-requisite to accepting what scientists and medical professionals say about covid-19?


It is useful in screening, so I wouldn't call it useless.


False. Overall deaths are UP in 2020.


A ridiculous distinction. Why should we care any less about the death of a asthma suffered who contracts covid and dies than the death of an Olympic athletes in perfect health who contracts covid and dies? All deaths where covid was the immediate and most proximate cause are rightly counted in the pandemic.
If the virus was never isolated, then how was its genome mapped out? And why do we know what it looks like? Its picture has been plastered all over the place for over a year now.

 
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DeSanto

Super Member
So you are advocating that people not get vaccinated and take the chance of getting the virus?
Yes! Take a chance! Life if full of danger. We could die at any moment. Why should we live in fear? Fear “the virus”??? Why? When the chances of dying from it is so low?

We been turned into a bunch of hypochondriacs.
No, actual experts are pretty easy to identify.

Infectious disease experts have degrees in that field, have trained in that field, have published scholarly papers in that field, and are recognized by the broader medical community as having expertise in that field.

People who are NOT actual experts on covid: Tucker Carlson, Donald Trump, Scott Atlas, Robert Kennedy.

And how do you decide that actual experts are not to be trusted because of some liberal agenda? What exactly is a liberal agenda when it comes to an infectious disease that has become a pandemic? Do you think taking the disease seriously is a sign of a liberal agenda?

Manufacturing Consent:

The Political Economy of the Mass Media is a 1988 book by Edward S. Herman and Noam Chomsky. It argues that the mass communication media of the U.S. "are effective and powerful ideological institutions that carry out a system-supportive propaganda function, by reliance on market forces, internalized assumptions, and self-censorship, and without overt coercion", by means of the propaganda model of communication. The title refers to consent of the governed, and derives from the phrase "the manufacture of consent" used by Walter Lippmann in Public Opinion. The book was honored with the Orwell Award. A 2002 revision takes account of developments such as the fall of the Soviet Union. A 2009 interview with the authors notes the effects and impact of the internet on the propaganda model.Wikipedia
 
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Carol

Well-known member
Yes! Take a chance! Life if full of danger. We could die at any moment. Why should we live in fear? Fear “the virus”??? Why? When the chances of dying from it is so low?

We been turned into a bunch of hypochondriacs.


Manufacturing Consent:

The Political Economy of the Mass Media is a 1988 book by Edward S. Herman and Noam Chomsky. It argues that the mass communication media of the U.S. "are effective and powerful ideological institutions that carry out a system-supportive propaganda function, by reliance on market forces, internalized assumptions, and self-censorship, and without overt coercion", by means of the propaganda model of communication. The title refers to consent of the governed, and derives from the phrase "the manufacture of consent" used by Walter Lippmann in Public Opinion. The book was honored with the Orwell Award. A 2002 revision takes account of developments such as the fall of the Soviet Union. A 2009 interview with the authors notes the effects and impact of the internet on the propaganda model.Wikipedia

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country."

Edward Bernays, "Propaganda"
 

vibise

Well-known member
NONE of the pharmaceutical companies are claiming ANY protection from infection or even immunity through use of their gene therapies. The chances of becoming infected are no better after receiving an injection than they were before.

I'm advocating that those who are mandating that whole populations be injected with an experimental gene therapy be indicted and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law for crimes against humanity. They're in blatant violation of the Geneva Convention's prohibitions against experimenting on human beings.


They're quite relevant to my point which is why I posted them. Your job is to address what I actually posted, and if you think you can; refute it.

Did you notice this gem:

the Moderna COVID-19 vaccine might also provide some protection against asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection"

LOL. GEE. Thanks Moderna, I was really worried about being protected from a virus that I didn't even know I had in the first place.

You don't seem to see any reason to address what I've posted either. I guess I can safely assume you have no defense for your position, nor any desire to try and refute what I've posted.
Yes, I think it is important to refute mischaracterizations of the CDC, WHO, etc. and I did that by posting an extended clip from the CDC document that you linked. That document was an explanation of why the CDC was convinced that the Moderna vaccine was safe and effective against covid. The sentence you pulled out gave a completely false impression of uncertainty and incomplete data calling into question whether this vaccine and others like it should be used.

And yes, it is important to counter virus infections in asymptomatic people, as those people can easily spread virus to other, more susceptible people.
 

vibise

Well-known member
Ad Hominem attacks do not advance the discussion in any meaningful way.

It means that they have been able to conclusively identify not only a particular virus, but prove that the virus they have identified is in fact CAUSING the infection. It's called Science. When one simply assumes that the soup they are looking at must have a particular virus which they haven't identified at all, that's not science; that's nonsense which in this case has led to blatant propaganda.

Bingo!

Prove it. I've supplied numerous links which quite clearly prove that no one has been able to purify or isolate and identify this 30k sequenced corona virus.

I know this is the case, and I supplied more than enough proof to back it up. They've all admitted that they didn't use an isolated specimen. They just patched pieces of them together and called it Covid 19.


Bingo!!! There are!!! In fact, 10,000 have signed their names to a lawsuit brought by 1,000 lawyers which has been received by the Hague charging these Pharmaceutical companies, governments, etc. with crimes against humanity.

What fringe people???? I supplied links to the CDC, WHO, NIH etc. The inventor of the PCR test who no one in the medical field or government doubts their credibility?

Pray tell where are you getting these strange ideas from?
You have proven nothing. Your claims against the science that has been done are nonsensical. And seriously, if you were right, you would not only upend covid research, but decades and decades of research on all human and animal pathogens. So why isn't the scientific community sitting up and taking notice.

You supplied links to the CDC, NIH, WHO with cherrypicked quotes that completely misrepresent those documents.

And who are these 10,000 "scientists" complaining to the Hague?
 

shnarkle

Well-known member
You have proven nothing.
Correction: You have not addressed or refuted my evidence and proof.
Your claims against the science that has been done are nonsensical.
They are the claims of the pharmaceutical companies themselves!
And seriously, if you were right, you would not only upend covid research, but decades and decades of research on all human and animal pathogens.
Not even close. I am simply pointing out some simple facts that are not being reported by the mainstream news outlets. The fact that the PCR test is useless in diagnostics doesn't negate the fact that it is still quite useful for its intended scientific purpose, i.e. research.
So why isn't the scientific community sitting up and taking notice.
They are!!!! So is the medical community!!!
You supplied links to the CDC, NIH, WHO with cherrypicked quotes
It's also called "the smoking gun", or the actual relevant quotations which are presented for the edification of those who don't feel like reading a wall of text. I supplied links so that YOU could go and look at them in context for yourself, and against all hope, respond with a coherent argument to address or refute the quoted texts.
that completely misrepresent those documents.
How is it a misrepresentation? Please don't hesitate to actually present us with an argument, evidence, proof, etc. if you think you can. Otherwise, claims made without evidence should always be dismissed without evidence. The fact is that I provided you with the relevant quotes AND the links from which they came from for your edification and to allow you to offer whatever arguments you would like to present. Ad Hominem, and baseless accusations don't cut it.
And who are these 10,000 "scientists" complaining to the Hague?
Don't forget the 1,000 lawyers as well. You want their names, credentials, etc., or are you just going to claim that I'm quote mining again? As if that was a rebuttal. smh.
 
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