Well meant offer?

Theo1689

Well-known member
Your random shotgun approach to interpretation does not produce much of value.
You should learn how to keep in context and on track with ideas

All I did was work through the passage and "follow the pronouns".
That's how you do proper exegesis.

Your "shotgun approach" is nothing but empty trash-talk, because you can't address the passage.
 

Reformedguy

Well-known member
Yes Jesus was 100% successful. He paid for sin and He soothed God's anger.
That was the plan and that was what He accomplished.

But the cross did not force people to come and drink
No one said the cross forces anything. Nice strawman. You need then though don't you.

So would it be safe to say that if your not saved He did not die for your sins or you would be saved? Think now
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Since you refuse to ever quote Scripture to support your bogus teachings, we may never know.

Luke 2:9 And an angel of the Lord suddenly stood before them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them; and they were terribly frightened. 10 But the angel said to them, “Do not be afraid; for behold, I bring you good news of great joy which will be for all the people;

What does "all the people" mean, here?
Does it mean, "all the INDIVIDUALS"?
Or does it mean, "all the GROUPS of people"?

This is not the same as "all men" ("pantes anthropoi"), it uses the term "laos" ("people"), which is a more generalized term.

Now, we can either simply ASSUME a particular meaning (which just happens to match our theology), as the non-Calvinists do, or we can look at the CONTEXT of the passage to see if it gives any clue as to the meaning.

Luke 2:11 for today in the city of David there has been born for you a Savior, who is Christ the Lord. 12 “This will be a sign for you: you will find a baby wrapped in cloths and lying in a manger.” 13 And suddenly there appeared with the angel a multitude of the heavenly host praising God and saying, 14 “Glory to God in the highest, And on earth peace among men with whom He is pleased.”

Is God pleased with "every single individual"?
Certainly not.
yes, the good news is for all people.
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
No one said the cross forces anything. Nice strawman. You need then though don't you.

So would it be safe to say that if your not saved He did not die for your sins or you would be saved? Think now
So all the time before a person gets saved, while they had not yet been regenerated, Christ had not died for them
Once they are saved, then Christ had died for them?
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
So all the time before a person gets saved, while they had not yet been regenerated, Christ had not died for them
Once they are saved, then Christ had died for them?

Why do you keep dodging questions by "answering" questions with irrelevant straw-man questions?
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
If God paid for all sin, then why does He force people to pay for those SAME sins again in torment in hell?
I don't think He does, But you know there is a sin which Christ did not die for which cannot be forgiven, people who commit that sin will not be saved
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
So why are they in hell, if not for paying their sins?



What does that have to do with anything?
And how does one commit "that din"?
Calvinists claim there are sins He didn't die for. that's how that comes into play, Jesus said there is a sin which will not be forgiven.
But every other sin was paid for. Now the way is open for you to come and drink
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
Calvinists claim there are sins He didn't die for. that's how that comes into play, Jesus said there is a sin which will not be forgiven.
But every other sin was paid for. Now the way is open for you to come and drink

Wrong again.
The Bible NEVER says, "every other sin was paid for".
And you STILL haven't explained why the unsaved have to suffer for their sins in hell, when (you claim) they've already been paid for.

That's called, "double jeopardy".
Your god is unjust.
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Moderate Calvinist...
Fair
Wrong again.
The Bible NEVER says, "every other sin was paid for".
And you STILL haven't explained why the unsaved have to suffer for their sins in hell, when (you claim) they've already been paid for.

That's called, "double jeopardy".
Your god is unjust.
For grins and giggles

Do you have a verse which states Chrisdt paid for sins of the elect ?
 
G

guest1

Guest
You betray yourself. When you read my post and claim this is what I said, it explains how you can read the Bible and claim what you do about it
His life was laid down for us all. That is what the Bible says and it is what I say
No He laid down His life for the sheep and gave Himself / His life for His bride- the church. See John 10 and Eph 5.

So get your biblical facts straight for once

next
 
T

TomFL

Guest
If God paid for all sin, then why does He force people to pay for those SAME sins again in torment in hell?
If God paid for the sins of the unconditionally elect why must they believe before receiving remission of sin

Seems you got a double edge sword
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Faith is evidence of conversion, not the cause.

If you say it's the cause, then you believe you caused your salvation. (which you in fact do teach)

Are you claiming sins are remitted before one believes or repents

Prove that with scripture
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Faith is evidence of conversion, not the cause.

If you say it's the cause, then you believe you caused your salvation. (which you in fact do teach)
The question was

If God paid for the sins of the unconditionally elect why must they believe before receiving remission of sin

you did not answer it

and if you believe one is converted before faith provide a verse stating that

BTW ignore previous reply with the technical difficulties I am having i was unable to edit it
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Wrong again.
The Bible NEVER says, "every other sin was paid for".
And you STILL haven't explained why the unsaved have to suffer for their sins in hell, when (you claim) they've already been paid for.

That's called, "double jeopardy".
Your god is unjust.
They reject Christ, so his sacrifice does not cover. Standard Christianity
 
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