What believers in God refers to and denotes.

Tercon

Well-known member
Lol. That's a really silly question. Obviously the answer is no.

I wonder what utter nonsense you will try to infer from that answer.

Evasion.

If it is true that the truth can't be known to you outside of or without a believing mind, then does this infer anything about the truth and a believing mind?
 

TeabagSalad

Well-known member

How is it evasion when I provided an answer to your question?

Are we going to have to add the word evasion to the list of words that you clearly don't know the meaning of?

If it is true that the truth can't be known to you outside of or without a believing mind, then does this infer anything about the truth and a believing mind?

No.
 

Tercon

Well-known member

TeabagSalad

Well-known member
You are trying to evade the truth.

Which truth? Remember to be specific.

More strawmanning. Evade means to try to 'escape or avoid, especially by cleverness or trickery'.

Where in my reply did I:
1) Build an incorrect version of your argument and then argue against that? Remember to be specific.
2) I gave you a specific answer to your question, so please point where I attempted to avoid answering your question? Remember to be specific.

Does it infer belief must occur before the truth is known to you?
No.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
Which truth? Remember to be specific.

You know; the stuff you are always evade. Like the truth and reality exists. And if the truth and reality is only knowable in and with a believing mind, then the truth and reality must be the product of a believing mind, because a believing mind is the only thing that exists that is capable of accommodating the truth and reality. That kind of truth.

Where in my reply did I:
1) Build an incorrect version of your argument and then argue against that? Remember to be specific.
2) I gave you a specific answer to your question, so please point where I attempted to avoid answering your question? Remember to be specific.

The below is your strawman misrepresentation.

Are we going to have to add the word evasion to the list of words that you clearly don't know the meaning of?

More strawmanning. Evade means to try to 'escape or avoid, especially by cleverness or trickery'.

Because I do in fact know what 'evasion" means and I am using it in the correct way. And you saying otherwise is a strawman.


Well how do you know the truth before you believe it, when belief is necessary and must occur in reality before the truth and reality is known to you? What do you think necessary means in regards to belief's necessity?
 

mikeT

Well-known member
Actually, the real problem is that you're only interested in declaring your opinions as truth, and then ignoring everything which calls them into question.

You're the one not interested in the truth in-and-of itself.
Not true. I am interested in how and why the truth and reality is known to us.
By your own words, you prove me right: you're interested in something other than the truth in-and-of itself

Thank you.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
By your own words, you prove me right: you're interested in something other than the truth in-and-of itself

Thank you.

If you don't even know that you have to believe before the truth and reality is known to you, then you obviously don't know what makes she truth and reality known to you.
 

Whatsisface

Well-known member
If you don't even know that you have to believe before the truth and reality is known to you, then you obviously don't know what makes she truth and reality known to you.
So, you should believe every possibility to make sure you believe in the ones that actually correspond to reality?
 

Tercon

Well-known member
So, you should believe every possibility to make sure you believe in the ones that actually correspond to reality?

Strawman.

Okay. Let us at least look at something that the both of us believe is a real belief in reality; 'Trump was president in 2019'.
Now, doesn't this belief "actually correspond to reality"?
It is illogical to say the word "belief" without that 'belief" 'corresponding to reality'.
 

Whatsisface

Well-known member
Strawman.

Okay. Let us at least look at something that the both of us believe is a real belief in reality; 'Trump was president in 2019'.
Now, doesn't this belief "actually correspond to reality"?
It is illogical to say the word "belief" without that 'belief" 'corresponding to reality'.
Strawman.
 

mikeT

Well-known member
If you don't even know that you have to believe before the truth and reality is known to you, then you obviously don't know what makes she truth and reality known to you.
You're the one not interested in the truth in-and-of itself.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
Strawman.

If a belief in reality is necessary in order to make the truth and reality known to you, then you can't refer to belief and be denoting "false beliefs" in reality in your arguments, because if you can't know the truth by using "false beliefs", then why are you deliberately sabotaging your own reasoning by doing just that? You do know that "false beliefs" can't get you to the truth and reality right?

That's why we need to use in our dealings with reality real beliefs in reality; 'Trump was president in 2019'.

It is illogical and dishonest to say the word "belief" without that 'belief" denoting and 'corresponding to reality'.
 

mikeT

Well-known member
It is illogical and dishonest to say the word "belief" without that 'belief" denoting and 'corresponding to reality'.
Actually, it is illogical and dishonest to say the word "belief" always correlates-with and corresponds-to reality.

No dictionary ever says this. That's because everyone knows real beliefs can be false.
 

Temujin

Well-known member
Actually, it is illogical and dishonest to say the word "belief" always correlates-with and corresponds-to reality.

No dictionary ever says this. That's because everyone knows real beliefs can be false.
Not quite everyone apparently...
 

Tercon

Well-known member
But belief in reality doesn't make the truth and reality known to you, facts and evidence do that.

You're just kicking the can down the road so you don't have to deal with the truth and reality. As if you believe those "facts and evidence" to be true as well, then those "facts and evidence" are also beliefs too.

It's possible to have false beliefs.

Strawman. But do "false beliefs" make the truth and reality known to anyone?
 
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