What I went through because of Christianity.

I'm not sure what comfort the Bible offers to those who don't get healed
Oh.
I thought you'd know since you asked me to quiz you on the basic knowledge of the Bible.

...but I'm hoping that the courts will start awarding hefty settlements to those who were harmed financially or medically by Christians. And personally, to see more churches close down due to lack of support from those who wise up would comfort me greatly.
Well, as I was getting at before, any lawyer who knows the Bible would prevent any court from awarding a settlement to someone who didn't get healed by God but who was told they would. It's only those who don't know the Bible that think God heals any and all people who ask that think they could sue when that doesn't happen.
 
I take it you have a personal issue with Christian morality.
I'm convinced all atheists do. That seems to be the reason they are atheists. They can't accept the Bible's definition and condemnation of sin. And they use foolish arguments to hide that and attempt to discredit God instead.

What they don't get is the truth about sin and judgement is God's way of sorting out those who will love righteousness when given the chance, and who will not. While they demand proof that God is real, God is proving who will love righteousness and who will not by sending the truth about sin and judgment and righteousness into the world. They think they are testing God when really God is testing them.
 
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That's obviously a loaded question. You want to distance yourself from the Christians who practice faith healing which as we all know originated in the New Testament. The basis for my belief in faith healing was rooted in my study of the Bible. I read in the Gospels that Jesus was a faith healer as were his apostles.

Anyway, you can free yourself from guilt easily enough. Just repudiate belief in God healing people. Set people straight telling them that it doesn't work. That way more people need not suffer and die from that kind of quackery.

In regard to belief in miraculous healing, like I just got done saying it doesn't work. And since it doesn't work, then people waste their time and money on it forgoing legitimate health care. Doing so can worsen their condition and even kill them.

You are correct. Which is why its taught in the bible. multiple places, here is a few.

15Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food. 16If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it? 17In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.

Faith just means trust, confidence, reliance.

There are Christians out there who would flat out kill us and drink the koolaid.
There are also atheists who would flat out kill us and drink the koolaid too.

1 john 4
8Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.
-
God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in them. -- 1 John 4.

Do you think it is possible for Love to have ever been a motivating factor for healing someone else?


Would like verses with Jesus saying you need a doctor for sick people?

One of the worst things you could pick up from any group is bigotry. That us vs them mentality.

Do you think there is NO GOD at all or there might be and the Christian one certainly isn't it?
 
That's obviously a loaded question. You want to distance yourself from the Christians who practice faith healing which as we all know originated in the New Testament. The basis for my belief in faith healing was rooted in my study of the Bible. I read in the Gospels that Jesus was a faith healer as were his apostles.

The NT informs us that it was God the Father doing these things through the man Jesus.

Today's faith healers construe faith as if it were some kind of causal power. It isn't.

Anyway, you can free yourself from guilt easily enough. Just repudiate belief in God healing people. Set people straight telling them that it doesn't work. That way more people need not suffer and die from that kind of quackery.

You really need to learn how to separate the ways of men from the Scriptures. They are not the same thing.

In regard to belief in miraculous healing, like I just got done saying it doesn't work.

God doesn't heal anyone through fakers. It makes Him look bad.

And since it doesn't work, then people waste their time and money on it forgoing legitimate health care. Doing so can worsen their condition and even kill them.

Forgoing good health care is not a good idea.
 
I'm convinced all atheists do. That seems to be the reason they are atheists. They can't accept the Bible's definition and condemnation of sin. And they use foolish arguments to hide that and attempt to discredit God instead.

What they don't get is the truth about sin and judgement is God's way of sorting out those who will love righteousness when given the chance, and who will not. While they demand proof that God is real, God is proving who will love righteousness and who will not by sending the truth about sin and judgment and righteousness into the world. They think they are testing God when really God is testing them.
The bible is for unbelievers.

31But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

Vilifying someone else doesn't make us cleaner.

4 Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, rejoice. 5 Let your reasonableness[d] be known to everyone. The Lord is at hand; 6 do not be anxious about anything, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God. 7 And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus.

But the wisdom from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, open to reason, full of mercy and good fruits, impartial and sincere.

We don't take sides because we don't have to.

Christian to Atheist in the face of spiritual terrorism of being unsaved takes a lot of guts. Many have to deal with daddy issues like abuse/abandonment.

We also have to put up with anthropomorphisms on God, so now he's an angry old man with a white beard in the sky.

Some go Christian to ashiest, to no one is right, to everyone is right, to "I don't know".


Is demanding proof that God is real unreasonable? Scripture says its perfectly fine.

But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect,
 
I'm not sure what comfort the Bible offers to those who don't get healed,

I guess you don't understand what "comfort" means.
One does not need to be in perfect shape or perfect health to be "comforted".

It frequently means to accept your situation.
Just listen to a few talks by Nicholas Vujicic ("Life without limbs") or Joni Eareckson Tada (paraplegic).

but I'm hoping that the courts will start awarding hefty settlements to those who were harmed financially or medically by Christians.

Nobody forced you to believe their claims.
Nobody forced you to donate any money.
You continue to refuse to accept responsibility for your OWN decisions.

But you have a good idea....

I would LOVE to see the courts start going after large settlements to mothers and doctors who murder little innocent babies in the womb, on the daily. That's MURDER.

I would LOVE to see the courts start going after large settlements to parents and doctors who sexually molest their children by allowing them to medically "transition", removing perfectly healthy body parts from them, and in many cases removing any hope for them to ever experience sexual pleasure. And they should go after doctors who transition adults, too.
 
Man if heaven is just folks like you, he probably dodged a bullet.

Many say that in jest... But one day you'll be like the rich man in Luke 16, who begged for Lazarus to be sent down to warn the man's brothers.

Stick up your nose in pride now, but Christ will humble you one day, probably after it is too late.

Where can he find a "PERFECT" understanding of scripture AS you understand it? He already tried bible alone.

Nobody claimed to have a "perfect" understanding.
But most of it is pretty straightforward.

I always like to teach atheists this verse:

Of course you do.
Too bad you refuse to learn the meaning before you do so.

2 timothy 2 : 24
And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful.

Well, 1 Timothy, 2 Timothy, and Titus are referred to as the "pastoral" epistles. They are designed to give qualifications and responsibilities to church leaders. In 1 Timothy, Paul is explicitly giving responsibilities to church "elders" and "deacons", leaders of the church.

Since Mr. "Unknown Soldier" isn't a member of the church (and is, in fact, very hostile towards it), 2 Tim. 2:24 is NOT a command for us to "teach" someone who SHOWS ZERO INTEREST in being taught.

It is not the job of any Christian, or even an elder, to put up with mockers and scoffers, running around with big fat chips on their shoulders, constantly putting up with insults and attacks.

Quite the contrary, Jesus gives us different instructions for those of your ilk:

Matt. 7:6 “Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.
Matt. 10:14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet.

I guess that rules you out as a servant of the lord.

I've literally read dozens of @Judges13:18 's posts. And nothing I have ever read him say is contrary to the true meaning of 2 Tim. 2:24.

If you are going to get upset with something as simple as an atheist, obviously not cut out for it.

I didn't see any indication of him getting the least bit, "upset".
Gaslight much?

You should be joyful, happy to teach.

He is.
I've seen him.

He's shaking up your faith

<Chuckle>
I've seen no evidence of that.

that's why you are becoming combative.

Um, nope.
He hasn't been the least bit "combative".
That's what your side is doing.
And I've seen no evidence that his response is based on your imaginary thought that he allegedly feels his faith is harmed in any way whatsoever.

You can never get anyone to believe something you don't believe yourself, like plenty of Christians who don't believe the above verse.

I'm sure @Judges13:18 believes it, as do I.
It's you who doesn't understand it.

Since Unknown Soldier is not part of the Christian church (by his own choice), 2 Tim. 2:24 doesn't apply to him.

Have a nice day!
 
Many say that in jest... But one day you'll be like the rich man in Luke 16, who begged for Lazarus to be sent down to warn the man's brothers.

Stick up your nose in pride now, but Christ will humble you one day, probably after it is too late.



Nobody claimed to have a "perfect" understanding.
But most of it is pretty straightforward.



Of course you do.
Too bad you refuse to learn the meaning before you do so.



Well, 1 Timothy, 2 Timothy, and Titus are referred to as the "pastoral" epistles. They are designed to give qualifications and responsibilities to church leaders. In 1 Timothy, Paul is explicitly giving responsibilities to church "elders" and "deacons", leaders of the church.

Since Mr. "Unknown Soldier" isn't a member of the church (and is, in fact, very hostile towards it), 2 Tim. 2:24 is NOT a command for us to "teach" someone who SHOWS ZERO INTEREST in being taught.

It is not the job of any Christian, or even an elder, to put up with mockers and scoffers, running around with big fat chips on their shoulders, constantly putting up with insults and attacks.

Quite the contrary, Jesus gives us different instructions for those of your ilk:

Matt. 7:6 “Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.
Matt. 10:14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet.



I've literally read dozens of @Judges13:18 's posts. And nothing I have ever read him say is contrary to the true meaning of 2 Tim. 2:24.



I didn't see any indication of him getting the least bit, "upset".
Gaslight much?



He is.
I've seen him.



<Chuckle>
I've seen no evidence of that.



Um, nope.
He hasn't been the least bit "combative".
That's what your side is doing.
And I've seen no evidence that his response is based on your imaginary thought that he allegedly feels his faith is harmed in any way whatsoever.



I'm sure @Judges13:18 believes it, as do I.
It's you who doesn't understand it.

Since Unknown Soldier is not part of the Christian church (by his own choice), 2 Tim. 2:24 doesn't apply to him.

Have a nice day!
Judge can speak for himself. Let me hear him say he wasn't combative.

Looking for Loopholes for petty and spitefulness doesn't work with God.

OH he qualifies as every man, unless of course calvinist he can change meanings every certain all kinds or whatever gibberish they use to twist it.

14But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled; 15But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear: 16Having a good conscience; that, whereas they speak evil of you, as of evildoers, they may be ashamed that falsely accuse your good conversation in Christ. 17For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing. 18For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

24And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. 25Opponents must be gently instructed, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, 26and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will.

Opponents must be gently instructed, if there ever was one how does it not apply? The intent and the loopholes to avoid being kind and gentle is very telling.
 
Judge can speak for himself. Let me hear him say he wasn't combative.

Hmmm....

Looking for Loopholes for petty and spitefulness doesn't work with God.

It appears that you are trying very hard to use emotionally-charged words to try to insult Christians.

Why don't you try to de-escalate, and take it down a few hundred notches?

OH he qualifies as every man, unless of course calvinist he can change meanings every certain all kinds or whatever gibberish they use to twist it.

First of all, I have no idea what you think "calvinist" has to do with anything.

But again, you need to try to de-escalate.
Of course, I think it's very clear that you are intentionally using emotionally charged words and accusations to try to push our buttons and try to get us to react negatively.

So sad.

14But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled; 15But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:

Oh, okay!
Thanks for clarifying!

You want us to give you a reason for the hope that we have!
So you are ignorant of the gospel!
Fair enough.

So here's the gospel:

1) God is holy.
2) Men are sinners.
3) The wages of sin is death.
4) God sent His son to atone for sin.
5) Those who trust in Christ will be saved.

That is the gospel.
I've now fulfilled 1 Pet. 3:15.
Have a great day!

24And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful.

That's for church leaders in a church environment.
It is not a mandate to try to force us to answer to mockers and scoffers who only want to insult, attack, and make trouble.

Once again, here are my instructions from Jesus in that context:

Matt. 7:6 “Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.
Matt. 10:14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet.

Opponents must be gently instructed,

That doesn't say anything about "opponents".
And there is nothing in the Bible which requires Christians wasting their time with people who have no DESIRE to be "instructed".

The intent and the loopholes to avoid being kind and gentle is very telling.

That truly is a HUGE chip on your shoulder.
But I'm not interested in knocking it off.
Sorry to disappoint you.
 
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Hmmm....



It appears that you are trying very hard to use emotionally-charged words to try to insult Christians.

Why don't you try to de-escalate, and take it down a few hundred notches?



First of all, I have no idea what you think "calvinist" has to do with anything.

But again, you need to try to de-escalate.
Of course, I think it's very clear that you are intentionally using emotionally charged words and accusations to try to push our buttons and try to get us to react negatively.

So sad.



Oh, okay!
Thanks for clarifying!

You want us to give you a reason for the hope that we have!
So you are ignorant of the gospel!
Fair enough.

So here's the gospel:

1) God is holy.
2) Men are sinners.
3) The wages of sin is death.
4) God sent His son to atone for sin.
5) Those who trust in Christ will be saved.

That is the gospel.
I've now fulfilled 1 Pet. 3:15.
Have a great day!



That's for church leaders in a church environment.
It is not a mandate to try to force us to answer to mockers and scoffers who only want to insult, attack, and make trouble.

Once again, here are my instructions from Jesus in that context:

Matt. 7:6 “Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.
Matt. 10:14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet.



That doesn't say anything about "opponents".
And there is nothing in the Bible which requires Christians wasting their time with people who have no DESIRE to be "instructed".



That truly is a HUGE chip on your shoulder.
But I'm not interested in knocking it off.
Sorry to disappoint you.
Pick your poison:

New International Version
Opponents must be gently instructed, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth,

New Living Translation
Gently instruct those who oppose the truth. Perhaps God will change those people’s hearts, and they will learn the truth.

English Standard Version
correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth,

Berean Standard Bible
He must gently reprove those who oppose him, in the hope that God may grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth.

Berean Literal Bible
in gentleness disciplining those opposing, lest ever God may give them repentance unto a knowledge of the truth,

King James Bible
In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

New King James Version
in humility correcting those who are in opposition, if God perhaps will grant them repentance, so that they may know the truth,

New American Standard Bible
with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth,

NASB 1995
with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth,

NASB 1977
with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth,


Basic Christianity

3For at one time we too were foolish, disobedient, misled, and enslaved to all sorts of desires and pleasures—living in malice and envy, being hated and hating one another.

Everyone of you might as well be Jesus Christ.

“The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’
 
New International Version
Opponents must be gently instructed, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth,

Clearly you have already been "instructed".
You refuse the instruction.
So be it. That's on you.

After you've been instructed our instructions going forward are this:

Matt. 7:6 “Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.

Matt. 10:14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet.

If you truly wanted to learn, I'd gladly invest dozens of hours to help you. But you clearly have no interest in learning. You simply have great animosity towards Christianity, and want to use Christians as your own personal plaything and "punching bag", to goad us into arguing with you so you can get your jollies. We're not required to do that.

Indeed, the most loving thing we can do for you is walk away and not enable you to attack Christ, because by doing so you heap up further coals for your own destruction.

Have a nice day.
 
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Jesus is the perfect example to follow.

Amen!


Well, there is no such thing as "Calvinist Jesus". There is only Jesus.

But it is God the Father who gets to choose:

Mal. 1:2 “I have loved you,” says the LORD.
“But you ask, ‘How have you loved us?’
“Was not Esau Jacob’s brother?” declares the LORD. “Yet I have loved Jacob, 3 but Esau I have hated, and I have turned his hill country into a wasteland and left his inheritance to the desert jackals. ”
Rom. 9:11 Yet, before the twins were born or had done anything good or bad —in order that God’s purpose in election might stand: 12 not by works but by him who calls—she was told, “The older will serve the younger.” 13 Just as it is written: “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.”
Rom. 9:16 It does not, therefore, depend on human desire or effort, but on God’s mercy. 17 For Scripture says to Pharaoh: “I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.” 18 Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.
Rom. 9:22 What if God, although choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath—prepared for destruction? 23 What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory — 24 even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles?
 
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I'm convinced all atheists do. That seems to be the reason they are atheists. They can't accept the Bible's definition and condemnation of sin. And they use foolish arguments to hide that and attempt to discredit God instead.
Atheists lack all humility, which manifests itself in refusal to accept (a) God's sovereignty, (b) they can be at fault and are accountable, (b) God has the right to make continuing demands on them.

The superficial attitude of Simon Magus comes to mind who appears to have rejected Christianity after discovering that God hadn't given him the power of being able to confer the Holy Spirit on people, as had been given to the apostles. This argument about not being healed is just a variation on this theme of not immediately getting what you want from Christianity.

What they don't get is the truth about sin and judgement is God's way of sorting out those who will love righteousness when given the chance, and who will not. While they demand proof that God is real, God is proving who will love righteousness and who will not by sending the truth about sin and judgment and righteousness into the world. They think they are testing God when really God is testing them.
Repentance is often proved not to be genuine. Yet there is a difference between faithlessness and disowning Christ, the former manifesting itself perhaps in unjustified anger against God and consequent sin (e.g. Peter disowning Christ after being challenged to confess him at a time and occasion when he didn't desire to, due to being afraid), the latter in a premeditated and ongoing resolve to reject God.
 
The most UNBIBLICAL teaching is that things MUST BE BIBLICAL.
I'm pretty sure that, by definition, an un-Biblical teaching would be one that is not in the Bible or is not supported by the Bible.

For any person, the things they accept as being of God must be taught by or supported by the Bible. Anything that contradicts the Bible can be thrown out. A double minded person will receive nothing from God (James 1:7-8).
 
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Who are you to judge? everyone especially in these forums are doing the best they can with what they got.
Everyone in Christ has the God given right and responsibility to discern people and situations. As @Theo1689 has shown, this is an entirely Biblical truth. The problem is most people receive that as Christians hating them. This is what John (regarded as the Apostle of love) said:

2 John 1:10-11
10If anyone comes to you but does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your home or even greet him. 11Whoever greets such a person shares in his evil deeds.


Was John telling us to be unloving and hateful, or telling us to beware of those who resist the truth?
 
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everyone especially in these forums are doing the best they can with what they got.
I would have to say that is not true. Most atheists I've talked to have their minds thoroughly made up. They are not doing the best they can with what they got. They are not open to discussion and examination of their claims.
 
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Man if heaven is just folks like you, he probably dodged a bullet.
The harsh reality is there is no fellowship between light and darkness, righteousness and unrighteousness:

2 Corinthians 6:14-15
14Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership can righteousness have with wickedness? Or what fellowship does light have with darkness? 15What harmony is there between Christ and Belial?c Or what does a believer have in common with an unbeliever?


Fellowship depends on a common experience of fellowship with the Spirit of God:

Philippians 2:1-2
1Therefore if you have any encouragement in Christ, if any comfort from His love, if any fellowship with the Spirit, if any affection and compassion, 2then make my joy complete by being like-minded, having the same love, being united in spirit and purpose.


Unbelievers simply do not have the Spirit for us to be united with them in spirit and purpose. That doesn't mean we hate them. It means we have nothing in common with them to form a relationship on.
 
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Where can he find a "PERFECT" understanding of scripture AS you understand it?
There is no perfect understanding of scripture as a whole, because there are things in scripture that aren't fully explained/revealed. But these things don't have any consequence on being able to live for and enjoy God. Peter told us this regarding the sufficiency of the knowledge God has given us about himself:

2 Peter 1:3
3His divine power has given us everything we need for life and godliness through the knowledge of Him who called us by His owna glory and excellence.


He already tried bible alone.
His problem wasn't that he tried the Bible alone. His problem was he wasn't aware of the whole counsel of the Bible. That would have prevented him from being tossed about by the doctrinal winds of clever and cunning men and their deceitful schemes (Ephesians 4:13-14).
 
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2 timothy 2 : 24
And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful.


I guess that rules you out as a servant of the lord.
1 Corinthians 4:3-5
3I care very little, however, if I am judged by you or by any human court. In fact, I do not even judge myself. 4My conscience is clear, but that does not vindicate me. It is the Lord who judges me.

5Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait until the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men’s hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God.
 
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