let the games beginIf the passover lamb was slaughtered but they didn't bother to paint the lintels of their houses with its blood and consume it's flesh of remembrance... would there have been a passover at all?
The games began with the OP.let the games begin
Reply #1
A question to a question.
from theOP:
What is the salvific effect of today's Mass?
If you did not go to Mass today and did not partake of the Eucharist:
How is your salvation affected?
If all the Masses stopped for....one day:
Is anyone's salvation affected?
reply #2The games began with the OP.
Is the bread a remembrance or is the bread salvific?We go to Mass because Paul told us this... 1 Cor 11 23 For I received from the Lord what I also handed on to you, that the Lord Jesus on the night when he was betrayed took a loaf of bread, 24 and when he had given thanks, he broke it and said, “This is my body that is for[f] you. Do this in remembrance of me.” 25 In the same way he took the cup also, after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood. Do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of me.” 26 For as often as you eat this bread and drink the cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until he comes.
To us those are incredibly powerful words meant to be observed perpetually and never neglected. Make of them what you will as far as our salvation. We follow them out of obedience.
Draw from Scripture what you may.Is the bread a remembrance or is the bread salvific?
reply #3We go to Mass because Paul told us this... 1 Cor 11 23 For I received from the Lord what I also handed on to you, that the Lord Jesus on the night when he was betrayed took a loaf of bread, 24 and when he had given thanks, he broke it and said, “This is my body that is for[f] you. Do this in remembrance of me.” 25 In the same way he took the cup also, after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood. Do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of me.” 26 For as often as you eat this bread and drink the cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until he comes.
To us those are incredibly powerful words meant to be observed perpetually and never neglected. Make of them what you will as far as our salvation. We follow them out of obedience.
What salvific properties?the Bread and Drink spoken of by Paul has some serious salvific properties.
How many Catholics have unworthily taken the bread in remembrance and dropped dead?Draw from Scripture what you may.
1 Cor 11 27 Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be answerable for the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Examine yourselves, and only then eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For all who eat and drink without discerning the body eat and drink judgment against themselves.
Is there any other food that could damn you? No, so you must acknowledge that the Bread and Drink spoken of by Paul has some serious salvific properties.
Your questions just don't make sense. You obviously envisage the Catholic Eucharist as something that is completely foreign to me. Maybe like a power outlet that when it is turned off drains 'salvation' away. Or maybe as a magic ritual of some sort.reply #3
still avoiding the question
i didn't ask why you went to Mass
What salvific properties?
What is the salvific effect of today's Mass?
If you did not go to Mass today and did not partake of the Eucharist:
How is your salvation affected?
If all the Masses stop for....one day:
Is anyone's salvation affected?
This is how my questions are relatable
Do you see how your questions aren't relatable?
What is the salvific effect of today's Mass?This is how my questions are relatable
In checking out the Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC)., The Catholic Encyclopedia, and The Council of Trent, we find the following: The Eucharist is referred to in several ways.
- As a sacrifice
- “the holy sacrifice of the Eucharist,” (CCC, 1055) and “the Eucharist is also a sacrifice,” (CCC, 1365).
- As a divine sacrifice
- “For it is in the liturgy, especially in the divine sacrifice of the Eucharist, that “the work of our redemption is accomplished,” (CCC, 1068).
- As a representation of the sacrifice of Christ
- “The Eucharist is thus a sacrifice because it re-presents (makes present) the sacrifice of the cross,” (CCC, 1366).
- Is ‘one single sacrifice’ with Christ’s sacrifice
- “The sacrifice of Christ and the sacrifice of the Eucharist are one single sacrifice,” (CCC, 1367).
- It is the same sacrifice of Christ
- “And since in this divine sacrifice which is celebrated in the Mass, the same Christ who offered himself once in a bloody manner on the altar of the cross is contained and is offered in an unbloody manner,” (CCC, 1367).
- It is propitiatory (removes the wrath of God)
- ” . . . this sacrifice is truly propitiatory,” (CCC, 1367).
- To all who deny its propitiatory nature Trent pronounces anathema
- “If any one saith, that the sacrifice of the mass is only a sacrifice of praise and of thanksgiving; or, that it is a bare commemoration of the sacrifice consummated on the cross, but not a propitiatory sacrifice; or, that it profits him only who receives; and that it ought not to be offered for the living and the dead for sins, pains, satisfactions, and other necessities; let him be anathema.” (Trent: On the Sacrifice of the Mass: Canon 3);
- It is called the sacrifice of Christ which is offered via the priest’s hands
- “The sacrifice of Christ the only Mediator, which in the Eucharist is offered through the priests’ hands,” (CCC, 1369).
- It is capable of making reparation of sins
- “As sacrifice, the Eucharist is also offered in reparation for the sins of the living and the dead,” (CCC, 1414).
- It is to be considered a true and proper sacrifice
- “The Church intends the Mass to be regarded as a ‘true and proper sacrifice,'” (The Catholic Encyclopedia, topic: “Sacrifice of the Mass”).
So I ask:
What is the salvific effect of today's Mass?
If you did not go to Mass today and did not partake of the Eucharist:
How is your salvation affected?
If all the Masses stop for....one day:
Is anyone's salvation affected?
Oh the question made complete sense.Your questions just don't make sense. You obviously envisage the Catholic Eucharist as something that is completely foreign to me. Maybe like a power outlet that when it is turned off drains 'salvation' away. Or maybe as a magic ritual of some sort.
The Mass is a communion and a community. It is congress with Christ and our neighbor. From the CCC...
1324 The Eucharist is "the source and summit of the Christian life."136 "The other sacraments, and indeed all ecclesiastical ministries and works of the apostolate, are bound up with the Eucharist and are oriented toward it. For in the blessed Eucharist is contained the whole spiritual good of the Church, namely Christ himself, our Pasch."137
1325 "The Eucharist is the efficacious sign and sublime cause of that communion in the divine life and that unity of the People of God by which the Church is kept in being. It is the culmination both of God's action sanctifying the world in Christ and of the worship men offer to Christ and through him to the Father in the Holy Spirit."138
1326 Finally, by the Eucharistic celebration we already unite ourselves with the heavenly liturgy and anticipate eternal life, when God will be all in all.139
1327 In brief, the Eucharist is the sum and summary of our faith: "Our way of thinking is attuned to the Eucharist, and the Eucharist in turn confirms our way of thinking."
Do you see how your questions aren't relatable?
In regards to the overall relationship, is reading the Bible daily more or less effective than the daily communion?...
The communion is part of an overall relationship that spans the period of our life on earth. A single moment doesn't determine the final outcome.
...
Interesting question.In regards to the overall relationship, is reading the Bible daily more or less effective than the daily communion?
Communion is an act of love or it should be. 1 Cor 13 ranks what is important very clearly...In regards to the overall relationship, is reading the Bible daily more or less effective than the daily communion?
In regards to the overall relationship, is reading the Bible daily more or less effective than the daily communion or 1Cor 13?Communion is an act of love or it should be. 1 Cor 13 ranks what is important very clearly...
If I speak in the tongues of humans and of angels but do not have love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 And if I have prophetic powers and understand all mysteries and all knowledge and if I have all faith so as to remove mountains but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 If I give away all my possessions and if I hand over my body so that I may boast but do not have love, I gain nothing.
A religion built on a few grossly misinterpreted verses. And demeans the atonement of Christ. And has the gall to call itself "the one true church.This is how my questions are relatable
In checking out the Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC)., The Catholic Encyclopedia, and The Council of Trent, we find the following: The Eucharist is referred to in several ways.
- As a sacrifice
- “the holy sacrifice of the Eucharist,” (CCC, 1055) and “the Eucharist is also a sacrifice,” (CCC, 1365).
- As a divine sacrifice
- “For it is in the liturgy, especially in the divine sacrifice of the Eucharist, that “the work of our redemption is accomplished,” (CCC, 1068).
- As a representation of the sacrifice of Christ
- “The Eucharist is thus a sacrifice because it re-presents (makes present) the sacrifice of the cross,” (CCC, 1366).
- Is ‘one single sacrifice’ with Christ’s sacrifice
- “The sacrifice of Christ and the sacrifice of the Eucharist are one single sacrifice,” (CCC, 1367).
- It is the same sacrifice of Christ
- “And since in this divine sacrifice which is celebrated in the Mass, the same Christ who offered himself once in a bloody manner on the altar of the cross is contained and is offered in an unbloody manner,” (CCC, 1367).
- It is propitiatory (removes the wrath of God)
- ” . . . this sacrifice is truly propitiatory,” (CCC, 1367).
- To all who deny its propitiatory nature Trent pronounces anathema
- “If any one saith, that the sacrifice of the mass is only a sacrifice of praise and of thanksgiving; or, that it is a bare commemoration of the sacrifice consummated on the cross, but not a propitiatory sacrifice; or, that it profits him only who receives; and that it ought not to be offered for the living and the dead for sins, pains, satisfactions, and other necessities; let him be anathema.” (Trent: On the Sacrifice of the Mass: Canon 3);
- It is called the sacrifice of Christ which is offered via the priest’s hands
- “The sacrifice of Christ the only Mediator, which in the Eucharist is offered through the priests’ hands,” (CCC, 1369).
- It is capable of making reparation of sins
- “As sacrifice, the Eucharist is also offered in reparation for the sins of the living and the dead,” (CCC, 1414).
- It is to be considered a true and proper sacrifice
- “The Church intends the Mass to be regarded as a ‘true and proper sacrifice,'” (The Catholic Encyclopedia, topic: “Sacrifice of the Mass”).
So I ask:
What is the salvific effect of today's Mass?
If you did not go to Mass today and did not partake of the Eucharist:
How is your salvation affected?
If all the Masses stop for....one day:
Is anyone's salvation affected?
Sanctification of believers, spiritual health and spiritual nourishment.What is the salvific effect of today's Mass?
Salvation comes at Baptism. The purpose of the Mass is for spiritual nourishment, sanctification, and the maintain spiritual health.If you did not go to Mass today and did not partake of the Eucharist: How is your salvation affected?
You mean like on Good Friday--when no Mass is celebrated anywhere in the world? You mean like that?If all the Masses stop for....one day:
Depends on what you mean "affected." See above.Is anyone's salvation affected?