When the Creator became heir of his own creation

Our Lord's God

Well-known member
1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in a son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the ages. 3 And he is the radiance of His glory and the representation of his being, upholding all things by the word of his power having had made purification of sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become as much superior to the angels, as he has inherited a more excellent name than them.

In Trinity world, that means the Son is the Creator.

Let's read what else it says about this divine Creator.

1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in a son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. 3 And he is the radiance of His glory and the representation of his being, upholding all things by the word of his power having had made purification of sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become as much superior to the angels, as he has inherited a more excellent name than them.

Wow, look at that. The Creator was made heir of all things when he became superior to his own angels and inherited a better name than them.

The Creator had to made heir to his own estate and had to inherit his own creation?

That's quite a contraption those Trinitarians have there.
 

Tanachreader

Active member
1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in a son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the ages. 3 And he is the radiance of His glory and the representation of his being, upholding all things by the word of his power having had made purification of sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become as much superior to the angels, as he has inherited a more excellent name than them.

In Trinity world, that means the Son is the Creator.

Let's read what else it says about this divine Creator.

1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in a son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. 3 And he is the radiance of His glory and the representation of his being, upholding all things by the word of his power having had made purification of sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become as much superior to the angels, as he has inherited a more excellent name than them.

Wow, look at that. The Creator was made heir of all things when he became superior to his own angels and inherited a better name than them.

The Creator had to made heir to his own estate and had to inherit his own creation?

That's quite a contraption those Trinitarians have there.
Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

So bozo when see and hear Yeshua are you going to say show us GOD
 

Our Lord's God

Well-known member
Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

So bozo when see and hear Yeshua are you going to say show us GOD

Do you says "Show us the Father" at John 20:28? How can you say "Show us the Father"? He who sees Jesus has seen the Father.

WHO then did Thomas see?
 

Tanachreader

Active member
And WHO did he see?
Thomas said to Jesus and was unrebuked, uncondemned, by the risen Lord," MY LORD AND MY GOD!
The Logos which was God" and "with God," and the Creator of all things, and "the Light and Life," had "become flesh.

The disciples understood.
Thomas saw his God.
Your apparently blind and can not see.
 

Our Lord's God

Well-known member
Thomas said to Jesus and was unrebuked, uncondemned, by the risen Lord," MY LORD AND MY GOD!
The Logos which was God" and "with God," and the Creator of all things, and "the Light and Life," had "become flesh.

The disciples understood.
Thomas saw his God.
Your apparently blind and can not see.

Did Thomas see the Father at John 20:28?
 

Tanachreader

Active member
Did Thomas see the Father at John 20:28?
Thomas saw Jesus. It was all about seeing Jesus himself or he would not believe. The Father was not crucified.
Jesus is God
What part of Jesus is not God as you claim. You have not seen or believed. “My Lord and my God”

The Logos which was God" and "with God," and the Creator of all things, and "the Light and Life," had "become flesh.
 
Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

So bozo when see and hear Yeshua are you going to say show us GOD
And like usual you failed to include the part that actually destroys your idea that Jesus was calling himself equally God with the Father in this text, so I will again do it for you so that others can see what Jesus truly meant by this.

First off, Jesus was not speaking his own words but those of the Father in the part where he replies to Philipp, "have I been so long with you and yet you don't know me Philipp and the proof of t his is in the rest of the words of Jesus in verse 10, so let's see what Jesus said again.

John 14:10, "The words that I speak unto you, I speak not of myself, it is the Father who dwells within me, he is doing the works".

Therefore first, Jesus was giving Philip the words of the Father who was dwelling within Jesus and not speaking for himself and secondly therefore, the reason why when they saw Jesus they also saw the Father, is because the Father was dwelling within Jesus and manifesting himself through Jesus unto them.

Whether you like it or not, this is what Jesus gave as an explanation of what he meant by everything he said unto them.

So who is the real bozo dude?
 
Thomas saw Jesus. It was all about seeing Jesus himself or he would not believe. The Father was not crucified.
Jesus is God
What part of Jesus is not God as you claim. You have not seen or believed. “My Lord and my God”

The Logos which was God" and "with God," and the Creator of all things, and "the Light and Life," had "become flesh.
Indeed the Father was not crucified, however Thomas's lack of faith involved the Father as well as Jesus and being it was the Father who raised Jesus from the dead and Thomas was doubting the word of the Lord Jesus that the Father would raise him from the dead on the third day after he died.

Furthermore, you will not find any other occurrence in the NT where any disciples speaking directly unto Jesus, ever addressed Jesus himself as being "the God of them" and yet you will jump through hoops to believe that Thomas is doing it here and when really he wasn't at all.

Part of the proof that he wasn't also, is the fact that Thomas used the definite article for both his Lord "the Lord of Me" and then for his God, " and the God of Me" and also used the word "and" in between the two and if Thomas had been speaking only to Jesus as both his Lord and God he would have just said, "The Lord and God of me, or my Lord and God".

The definite articles used for both Lord and God in the passage simply makes no sense for any other reason than that Thomas was speaking to two different persons when he said this.
 
1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in a son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the ages. 3 And he is the radiance of His glory and the representation of his being, upholding all things by the word of his power having had made purification of sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become as much superior to the angels, as he has inherited a more excellent name than them.

In Trinity world, that means the Son is the Creator.

Let's read what else it says about this divine Creator.

1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in a son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. 3 And he is the radiance of His glory and the representation of his being, upholding all things by the word of his power having had made purification of sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become as much superior to the angels, as he has inherited a more excellent name than them.

Wow, look at that. The Creator was made heir of all things when he became superior to his own angels and inherited a better name than them.

The Creator had to made heir to his own estate and had to inherit his own creation?

That's quite a contraption those Trinitarians have there.
This is a good argument for certain.
 

Tanachreader

Active member
And like usual you failed to include the part that actually destroys your idea that Jesus was calling himself equally God with the Father in this text, so I will again do it for you so that others can see what Jesus truly meant by this.

First off, Jesus was not speaking his own words but those of the Father in the part where he replies to Philipp, "have I been so long with you and yet you don't know me Philipp and the proof of t his is in the rest of the words of Jesus in verse 10, so let's see what Jesus said again.


John 14:10, "The words that I speak unto you, I speak not of myself, it is the Father who dwells within me, he is doing the works".

Therefore first, Jesus was giving Philip the words of the Father who was dwelling within Jesus and not speaking for himself and secondly therefore, the reason why when they saw Jesus they also saw the Father, is because the Father was dwelling within Jesus and manifesting himself through Jesus unto them.

Whether you like it or not, this is what Jesus gave as an explanation of what he meant by everything he said unto them.


So who is the real bozo dude?
Who did he see bozo #2

Jesus saith unto him, have I been so long time with you,.... Conversing familiarly with you, instructing you by my ministry, and performing so many miraculous works among you, for so long a time; see Heb 5:11
and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? Surely you cannot be so ignorant as this comes to; as you have seen me with your bodily eyes, as a man, you must, know that I am God by the doctrines I have taught you, and the miracles I have wrought among you: and

he that hath seen me; not with the eyes of his body, but with the eyes of his understanding; he that has beheld the perfections of the Godhead in me:

hath seen the Father; the perfections which are in him also; for the same that are in me are in him, and the same that are in him are in me: I am the very image of him, and am possessed of the same nature, attributes, and glory, that he is; so that he that sees the one, sees the other:

and how sayest thou then show us the Father? such a request is a needless one, and betrays great weakness and ignorance.
 
Who did he see bozo #2

Jesus saith unto him, have I been so long time with you,.... Conversing familiarly with you, instructing you by my ministry, and performing so many miraculous works among you, for so long a time; see Heb 5:11
and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? Surely you cannot be so ignorant as this comes to; as you have seen me with your bodily eyes, as a man, you must, know that I am God by the doctrines I have taught you, and the miracles I have wrought among you: and

he that hath seen me; not with the eyes of his body, but with the eyes of his understanding; he that has beheld the perfections of the Godhead in me:

hath seen the Father; the perfections which are in him also; for the same that are in me are in him, and the same that are in him are in me: I am the very image of him, and am possessed of the same nature, attributes, and glory, that he is; so that he that sees the one, sees the other:

and how sayest thou then show us the Father? such a request is a needless one, and betrays great weakness and ignorance.
LOL and right after Jesus said that what did Jesus also tell Philip?

This is what he said "the words that I speak, I speak not of myself, it is the Father who dwells within me, he is doing the works".

So when the Father dwelling within Jesus heard Philip asked "show us the Father and that will be sufficient for us, Jesus received the words to speak in answer to what Philip asked and therefore replied with not his own words but those of the Father dwelling within him "have I been so long time with you and yet you have not known me Philip"?


Then Jesus spoke his own words to express that the disciples have indeed seen the Father as manifested through his life and said "he who has seen me, has seen the Father also".

By the way, unless you believe Jesus was the Father, where in anything that Jesus said do you draw a conclusion that Jesus was calling himself God in this passage?

For Jesus attributes their seeing God in him only because the Father was dwelling within him and not because he himself is also God and that Sir is the truth of what was said by Jesus whether you like it or not.


All that Jesus said is "I am in the Father and the Father is in me" and that he was not speaking his own words but those of the Father who was dwelling within him and doing his works through Jesus.

Incidentally this is exactly what Peter said in Acts 2:22 likewise.

Acts 2:22 New International Version

22 “Fellow Israelites, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know.

Then Paul also said this "To wit that God was in Christ reconciling the world unto himself".

Notice the world "himself" and the fact that Paul didn't say that Christ was God or God was Christ but rather that God was in Christ instead and then that God was in him reconciling the world unto himself.

Very clearly God is revealed in this verse as one person and Christ as another and in whom God dwelt.

If I were you therefore, I would be careful about who you want to call "bozo".

 

Our Lord's God

Well-known member
Thomas saw Jesus. It was all about seeing Jesus himself or he would not believe. The Father was not crucified.
Jesus is God
What part of Jesus is not God as you claim. You have not seen or believed. “My Lord and my God”

The Logos which was God" and "with God," and the Creator of all things, and "the Light and Life," had "become flesh.

So you say Thomas did not see the Father.
Jesus said Thomas did see the Father.

Why are you contradicting Jesus? Have you no regard for what he taught?
 

Tanachreader

Active member
So you say Thomas did not see the Father.
Jesus said Thomas did see the Father.

Why are you contradicting Jesus? Have you no regard for what he taught?
He was literally looking at, speaking with the risen Jesus, the Son of God. No contradiction.
He is one with His Father, the fullness of Him speaking and doing His will.
 

Our Lord's God

Well-known member
He was literally looking at, speaking with the risen Jesus, the Son of God. No contradiction.
He is one with His Father, the fullness of Him speaking and doing His will.

Why do you deny that Thomas saw the Father when Jesus said that he did? Why do you deny Jesus?
 

Tanachreader

Active member
Why do you deny that Thomas saw the Father when Jesus said that he did? Why do you deny Jesus?
So you believe the Father rose from the grave?

Read the following. Who below did Thomas see.

And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
29 ¶ Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
...
But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

Jesus is the true mirror image of God, since He is both God and man.
He shows us His Father by showing Himself.
 

Our Lord's God

Well-known member
So you believe the Father rose from the grave?

Read the following. Who below did Thomas see.
T
So you believe the Father rose from the grave?

Read the following. Who below did Thomas see.

And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
29 ¶ Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
...
But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

Jesus is the true mirror image of God, since He is both God and man.
He shows us His Father by showing Himself.

So you believe the Father rose from the grave?

Read the following. Who below did Thomas see.

And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
29 ¶ Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
...
But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have lifethat through his name.

Jesus is the true mirror image of God, since He is both God and man.
He shows us His Father by showing Himself.

Do you think it is a good idea to deny Jesus by denying what he taught on the matter?
 

Tanachreader

Active member
Do you think it is a good idea to deny Jesus by denying what he taught on the matter?
So you don’t believe Jesus was doing His Fathers will but it was all the Father. Denial!
Read again His prayer in the Garden to His Dad.
Must bother you that you preach a false gospel, don’t know Jesus and haven’t had the Baptism promised by the Lord.

More snake pooh from yooh
 
So you don’t believe Jesus was doing His Fathers will but it was all the Father. Denial!
Read again His prayer in the Garden to His Dad.
Must bother you that you preach a false gospel, don’t know Jesus and haven’t had the Baptism promised by the Lord.

More snake pooh from yooh
You must be taking lessons from your boy Donald J. Trump, for you have a nasty mouth just like he does also and like him, you don't seem to care about what kind of witness that you have by it either.
 
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