When?

Open Heart

Well-known member
That means that if a person reckoned seven days in a strictly mathematical männer without adjustments then the seventh day would cycle through the days of the week as the years progress.
BTW this makes absolutely no sense. The first day of the week would always be the first day. The seventh day of the week would always be shabbat. I honestly am wondering whether you have the common sense to carry on a discussion about this.
 

BJ Bear

Well-known member
BTW this makes absolutely no sense. The first day of the week would always be the first day. The seventh day of the week would always be shabbat. I honestly am wondering whether you have the common sense to carry on a discussion about this.
The disconnect is that you don't yet recognize that the first day of the week of the first week of the month doesn't always immediately follow the last day of the previous month.

Like all despisers and deniers of the Promise of God, the Messiah for all men, all they are left with is the shadows, types, or parables of the law. So you cling and strive for a misinterpretation, or even in other cases to a right interpretation which at best can only provide a righteousness that is according to the law, a righteousness that will not stand before God.

The purpose of the law is to teach all men of their sin and consequently lead them to the Promise of God for you, the Messiah for you. As the Psalmist wrote, judge me according to your Righteousness.

The Savior saves.
 

BJ Bear

Well-known member
Which is why weeks function independently of both. I don't know why you don't get this. It's not exactly rocket science.

To be sure, I did try googling when and why the calendar was changed, looking for anything remotely suggesting that there were extra days added onto the last week of the month. Absolutely NOTHING came up. So no, this is not "common knowledge."
Let's make this really simple and consider the matter from your real life experience.

If you converted more than a year ago then has the common western Gentile name of the day upon which the Sabbath is observed changed? For example, if it was more than a year ago and the Sabbath was observed on Saturdays did it then change to a Friday or Sunday after the year changed?

And if it was more than two years ago then has it continued to cycle in the same direction such that it is now on a Thursday or Monday? And if it is more than four years ago did the common western Gentile name of the day change because of the extra day in a leap year?

If you answered no to any of the questions above then you have been considering the matter in an alien context and anachronistic manner.
 

BJ Bear

Well-known member

Open Heart

Well-known member
The disconnect is that you don't yet recognize that the first day of the week of the first week of the month doesn't always immediately follow the last day of the previous month.
Actually *I* am the one who says that the weeks run independently of the month. The first day of the the first full week in hte month can fall on up to seven different calendar dates.
 

Open Heart

Well-known member
If you converted more than a year ago then has the common western Gentile name of the day upon which the Sabbath is observed changed? For example, if it was more than a year ago and the Sabbath was observed on Saturdays did it then change to a Friday or Sunday after the year changed?
Not sure why you are bringing up my conversion. My conversion is entirely unrelated to teh Jewish calendar.

As I've said over and over, the shabbat is determined by the Jewish calendar. It is coincidental that the seventh day on the Jewish calendar matches up with the seventh day on the Gregorian calendar. As far as I know, the Jewish shabbat has always fallen at Friday night sundown to Saturday twilight, for as long as the Gregorian calendar has existed.
 

BJ Bear

Well-known member
I scanned this website, and I didn't see anywhere that it addressed the issue of the sabbath/seven day week, much less proposed that at one time the first day of the first week always fell on the first of the month.
If you read the page linked then you will find how the days are counted.
 

BJ Bear

Well-known member
Not sure why you are bringing up my conversion. My conversion is entirely unrelated to teh Jewish calendar.

As I've said over and over, the shabbat is determined by the Jewish calendar. It is coincidental that the seventh day on the Jewish calendar matches up with the seventh day on the Gregorian calendar. As far as I know, the Jewish shabbat has always fallen at Friday night sundown to Saturday twilight, for as long as the Gregorian calendar has existed.
Your conversion was referenced to provide you with a real life reference. As was noted previously, the adjustment to the solar calendar only delays the inevitable slip between calendars.
 

Open Heart

Well-known member
You say it in a different way.
Excuse me, but we do not agrree. You think there is a week longer than seven days at the end of the month, so that the first day of the first week falls on day one of the month. And that's preposterous, because it would violate sabbath.
 

Jewjitzu

Well-known member
When did the Jews change the determination of the seventh day sabbath to Saturday of the Julian Gregorian calendar from being determined by the lunar cycle like the rest of the feasts God commanded in the book of Leviticus?
We didn't. There are two points here - 1) The sanctification of the month based on the lunar cycle, and 2) The sanctification of the week which is based on the Sabbath.
 

Jewjitzu

Well-known member
Your conversion was referenced to provide you with a real life reference. As was noted previously, the adjustment to the solar calendar only delays the inevitable slip between calendars.
No, because the overarching Jewish calendar is based on a solar-lunar cycle which takes any slips into account.
 

Jewjitzu

Well-known member
Not sure why you are bringing up my conversion. My conversion is entirely unrelated to teh Jewish calendar.

As I've said over and over, the shabbat is determined by the Jewish calendar. It is coincidental that the seventh day on the Jewish calendar matches up with the seventh day on the Gregorian calendar. As far as I know, the Jewish shabbat has always fallen at Friday night sundown to Saturday twilight, for as long as the Gregorian calendar has existed.
The Shabbat has never changed. It's ironic that an SDA would question this since they're supposed to worship on the Sabbath.
 

Open Heart

Well-known member
The Shabbat has never changed. It's ironic that an SDA would question this since they're supposed to worship on the Sabbath.
I'm finding the whole conversation absolutely bizarre. What he is saying just doesn't make any sense. I don't really know how to respond when someone is being completely irrational.
 

Jewjitzu

Well-known member
I'm finding the whole conversation absolutely bizarre. What he is saying just doesn't make any sense. I don't really know how to respond when someone is being completely irrational.
It's quite ridiculous. It's no different than the current secular calendar with months that have different length of days (Jan, Feb, Mar - 31, 28/29, 30, respectively), and the day of the week (Sun, Mon, Tue...). One overlays the other.
 

BJ Bear

Well-known member
Excuse me, but we do not agrree. You think there is a week longer than seven days at the end of the month, so that the first day of the first week falls on day one of the month. And that's preposterous, because it would violate sabbath.
Yes, we do not agree. That is why I wrote something like you say it differently.

No, I am not saying that there are sevens longer than seven. It appears that you are reading the current common calendar paradigm of weeks into the calendar of the ancient Hebrew calendar.

The bottom line is the way the ancient Hebrew calendar was reckoned is not the way Rabbinic Judaism has come to reckon their calendar.
 

BJ Bear

Well-known member
The Shabbat has never changed. It's ironic that an SDA would question this since they're supposed to worship on the Sabbath.
The poster apparently knows Scripture and history better than you and the SDA assembly or church.
 

BJ Bear

Well-known member
It's quite ridiculous. It's no different than the current secular calendar with months that have different length of days (Jan, Feb, Mar - 31, 28/29, 30, respectively), and the day of the week (Sun, Mon, Tue...). One overlays the other.
That is the current Rabbinic tradition, but it wasn't always so.
 
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