Who Killed the Fish

JDS

Well-known member
This is a question for the folks who seem to think and teach that, because of a blood sacrifice, the temple in Ezekiel could not be after the resurrection of Jesus Christ, which it clearly is. There are clearly blood sacrifices offered during the millennial reign of Christ. Death is not destroyed until the great white throne judgement, where the wicked dead will be raised out of hell and judged for their works and then cast into the lake of fire, which is the transition into the eternal state in the new heaven and the new earth for the saved. This is the "day after the sabbath," the eighth day, the "day of God." It is an eternal day. There will be no night there. A day of new things.

Re 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

1Co 15:26 The last enemy [that] shall be destroyed [is] death.

Death reigned from beginning to end in this world.

Here is the fish. Who killed it and ate it?

John 21:1 After these things Jesus shewed himself again to the disciples at the sea of Tiberias; and on this wise shewed he [himself].
2 There were together Simon Peter, and Thomas called Didymus, and Nathanael of Cana in Galilee, and the [sons] of Zebedee, and two other of his disciples.
3 Simon Peter saith unto them, I go a fishing. They say unto him, We also go with thee. They went forth, and entered into a ship immediately; and that night they caught nothing.
4 But when the morning was now come, Jesus stood on the shore: but the disciples knew not that it was Jesus.
5 Then Jesus saith unto them, Children, have ye any meat? They answered him, No.
6 And he said unto them, Cast the net on the right side of the ship, and ye shall find. They cast therefore, and now they were not able to draw it for the multitude of fishes.
7 Therefore that disciple whom Jesus loved saith unto Peter, It is the Lord. Now when Simon Peter heard that it was the Lord, he girt [his] fisher’s coat [unto him], (for he was naked,) and did cast himself into the sea.
8 And the other disciples came in a little ship; (for they were not far from land, but as it were two hundred cubits,) dragging the net with fishes.
9 As soon then as they were come to land, they saw a fire of coals there, and fish laid thereon, and bread.
10 Jesus saith unto them, Bring of the fish which ye have now caught.
11 Simon Peter went up, and drew the net to land full of great fishes, an hundred and fifty and three: and for all there were so many, yet was not the net broken.
12 Jesus saith unto them, Come [and] dine (on the fish and bread). And none of the disciples durst ask him, Who art thou? knowing that it was the Lord.
13 Jesus then cometh, and taketh bread, and giveth them, and fish likewise.
14 This is now the third time that Jesus shewed himself to his disciples, after that he was risen from the dead.
15 ¶ So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs.

One poster on this forum is advancing the heretical teaching that the resurrection is not a physical resurrection but that they are spiritual creatures.This puts him in the camp of those who deny the Lord Jesus Christ.
 

Truth7t7

Active member
This is a question for the folks who seem to think and teach that, because of a blood sacrifice, the temple in Ezekiel could not be after the resurrection of Jesus Christ, which it clearly is. There are clearly blood sacrifices offered during the millennial reign of Christ. Death is not destroyed until the great white throne judgement, where the wicked dead will be raised out of hell and judged for their works and then cast into the lake of fire, which is the transition into the eternal state in the new heaven and the new earth for the saved. This is the "day after the sabbath," the eighth day, the "day of God." It is an eternal day. There will be no night there. A day of new things.

Re 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

1Co 15:26 The last enemy [that] shall be destroyed [is] death.

Death reigned from beginning to end in this world.

Here is the fish. Who killed it and ate it?

John 21:1 After these things Jesus shewed himself again to the disciples at the sea of Tiberias; and on this wise shewed he [himself].
2 There were together Simon Peter, and Thomas called Didymus, and Nathanael of Cana in Galilee, and the [sons] of Zebedee, and two other of his disciples.
3 Simon Peter saith unto them, I go a fishing. They say unto him, We also go with thee. They went forth, and entered into a ship immediately; and that night they caught nothing.
4 But when the morning was now come, Jesus stood on the shore: but the disciples knew not that it was Jesus.
5 Then Jesus saith unto them, Children, have ye any meat? They answered him, No.
6 And he said unto them, Cast the net on the right side of the ship, and ye shall find. They cast therefore, and now they were not able to draw it for the multitude of fishes.
7 Therefore that disciple whom Jesus loved saith unto Peter, It is the Lord. Now when Simon Peter heard that it was the Lord, he girt [his] fisher’s coat [unto him], (for he was naked,) and did cast himself into the sea.
8 And the other disciples came in a little ship; (for they were not far from land, but as it were two hundred cubits,) dragging the net with fishes.
9 As soon then as they were come to land, they saw a fire of coals there, and fish laid thereon, and bread.
10 Jesus saith unto them, Bring of the fish which ye have now caught.
11 Simon Peter went up, and drew the net to land full of great fishes, an hundred and fifty and three: and for all there were so many, yet was not the net broken.
12 Jesus saith unto them, Come [and] dine (on the fish and bread). And none of the disciples durst ask him, Who art thou? knowing that it was the Lord.
13 Jesus then cometh, and taketh bread, and giveth them, and fish likewise.
14 This is now the third time that Jesus shewed himself to his disciples, after that he was risen from the dead.
15 ¶ So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs.

One poster on this forum is advancing the heretical teaching that the resurrection is not a physical resurrection but that they are spiritual creatures.This puts him in the camp of those who deny the Lord Jesus Christ.
The very verse you quote shows you (The End) blinded by the magicians wand of dispensationalism

Before your eyes, Jesus Christ is the firstfruit of the resurrection, then at his coming those who died in faith, then comes (The End) there is no Millennial Kingdom on Earth found between verses 23-24 below

Then in verse 52, the dead shall be raised incorruptible, verse 54 death is swallowed up in victory.

You believe and teach this is a pre-trib rapture, when it's the second coming, last day resurrection (The End)

1 Corinthians 15:23-24 & 52-54KJV

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end
, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
 

Timtofly

Member
1 Corinthians 15:23-24 & 52-54KJV
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end
, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power
The end is after the 1000 year reign of Christ on earth. Verse 24 is not about the Second Coming.

Those at His Second Coming are souls in living physical corruptible bodies (dead sinful flesh).

Christ the firstfruits includes the whole church in Paradise both OT and NT. Those in Christ are in Christ physically, even in Paradise. They have the same permanent incorruptible body as the resurrected body of Jesus Christ.
 

Truth7t7

Active member
The end is after the 1000 year reign of Christ on earth. Verse 24 is not about the Second Coming.

Those at His Second Coming are souls in living physical corruptible bodies (dead sinful flesh).

Christ the firstfruits includes the whole church in Paradise both OT and NT. Those in Christ are in Christ physically, even in Paradise. They have the same permanent incorruptible body as the resurrected body of Jesus Christ.
The scripture below is very clear, it shows at the (Coming Of Jesus Christ) Then Cometh The End.

There Isn't A 1,000 Year Kingdom On This Earth Found Between Verses 23-24 Below.

Christ At His Coming (Millennium) Then Cometh The End

I Dont See A Millennium Below, Will You Add To Scripture

1 Corinthians 15:23-24 & 52-54KJV

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end
, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power
 

JDS

Well-known member
The scripture below is very clear, it shows at the (Coming Of Jesus Christ) Then Cometh The End.
It shows no such thing. It shows the end is

after

his coming and the text does not deal with the many events and the years between his coming and the end. If you were honest with the text you would see that.

For a perspective on the passage I offer some clarity.

This letter was written in AD 54. The creation of the world was in 4004 BC. That was the beginning of the world. After 1656 years, God destroyed the world with water, except for 8 people. He raised up a nation near the beginning of this new world and dealt with them under the principle of the written law of Moses for the last 1500 of the 2500 of those years until Jesus Christ came the first time. Through these people and their prophets he spoke and made many prophecies about what the world will be like and what he would accomplish through this people and the Messiah that he told them about. He told about how wicked that nation of his would become, as well as all the other nations of the world, until they would be as bad as the first world that he destroyed with water.

So, when the Messiah came the world was wicked and controlled by the devil and his nation refused to receive their Messiah and follow him into righteousness. The world of nations were completely against righteousness and they all deserved to be destroyed like before. However, God in mercy this time, instead of punishing the whole world because of sin and rebellion, delivered one man and spared the rest, God did it just the opposite. He punished one man for all sins and delivered the world of sinners. This put the mercy of God on open display for all the world to see, along with other of his attributes of divinity, like his long-suffering and, because he offered salvation to a world that deserved to die through the blood of that sinless one man to all men, his grace was openly displayed.

This age is not the subject of prophecy of the OT writers to Israel. God is dealing with the nations and not Israel during these times. The NT writers describes this age, which is defined as a mystery because it was not foreseen by OT prophets. Israel has been incorporated into the nations and have been persecuted by them God is jealous for them and will deal with the nations for their wickedness and for their failure to grasp hold of his forgiveness through Jesus Christ and he will bring this age to an end with a severe judgement that will leave but just a few, but only after he delivers those among the nations who have advantaged themselves of his mercy and grace. he will then begin once again to deal with his people, his nation, Israel, and sift them like gold in a refiners fire until all the dross is eliminated and they are pure. He will do this with four things. The nations, the animal kingdom, the climate, and pestilences. At the end of this short time, 7 years, he will send Jesus Christ to destroy those rebels that are left in his world and to establish divine rule over the earth for one thousand years. However, during those one thousand years new rebels will be born and at the end he will once again do some serious killing of rebels and end this series of 7000 years in which he has fully explained and revealed his entire character to the world of men. The last enemy to be destroyed is death when all the wicked of all the ages are resurrected to be judged at the great white throne judgement and cast into the lake of fire with the devil where they will be forever. This is called the second death. The righteous will enter into the new heaven and the new earth and there will be no more death.

The world would have been judged 3 times during the 7000 years according to the trinitarian God.
The first world saw God the Father and his works of righteousness.
The second world saw God the Son and his works of righteousness
the third world saw the Holy Ghost and his works of righteousness
And the new heaven and new earth will have God being all in all just like 1 Cor 15:28 says.

1 Cor 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

Where are we in this play? Well we are not to the place where Jesus rules and reigns and all enemies are not put under his feet yet. When it is over, all men in heaven and earth will have God indwelling their bodies as a permanent member of their trinitarian being.

This is the truth of the scriptures on March 8, 2021.
 
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Timtofly

Member
The scripture below is very clear, it shows at the (Coming Of Jesus Christ) Then Cometh The End.

There Isn't A 1,000 Year Kingdom On This Earth Found Between Verses 23-24 Below.

Christ At His Coming (Millennium) Then Cometh The End

I Dont See A Millennium Below, Will You Add To Scripture

1 Corinthians 15:23-24 & 52-54KJV

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end
, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power
He delivers up the kingdom after ruling it for 1000 years. The last 1990 years of the church is not mentioned in verse 23, should we just assume the last 1990 years did not exist either?

If you can prove to me this is not 2021, I will point out in 3021, you were correct and the last 1000 years did not exist as well.
 

Bob Carabbio

Well-known member
The question is: who killed the fish? Do you have an answer?
A totally obvious answer - Jesus killed and cleaned the fish, started the fire, and was in the process of cooking some. A Better question (requiring some thought) would be: Where did Jesus get the fish HE was preparing before the boys got there??
 

Timtofly

Member
A totally obvious answer - Jesus killed and cleaned the fish, started the fire, and was in the process of cooking some. A Better question (requiring some thought) would be: Where did Jesus get the fish HE was preparing before the boys got there??
They came out of the water and obediently lay down on the hot coals.
 

Bob Carabbio

Well-known member
They came out of the water and obediently lay down on the hot coals.
ONE of the possibilities - Maybe He SPOKE them into existence already dressed and cleaned. The possibilities are endless. I wonder if HIS fish tasted better that the disciple's (chuckle).
 

JDS

Well-known member
ONE of the possibilities - Maybe He SPOKE them into existence already dressed and cleaned. The possibilities are endless. I wonder if HIS fish tasted better that the disciple's (chuckle).
The point is there will be sacrifices made in the millennial kingdom and the glorified Jesus does not have a problem with killing and death, as has been assumed by one arrogant poster on this forum.

Ezekiel 44:11
Yet they shall be ministers in my sanctuary, having charge at the gates of the house, and ministering to the house: they shall slay the burnt offering and the sacrifice for the people, and they shall stand before them to minister unto them.

What do you think? Do you think Ezekiel's temple is a preexisting temple or maybe Herod's temple, which was a yet future temple in Ezekiel's day?
 

Bob Carabbio

Well-known member
The point is there will be sacrifices made in the millennial
AN assumption, like ALL "Eschatology".
Jesus does not have a problem with killing and death,
He is God, after all, and killing and death is no stranger to Him.

What do you think? Do you think Ezekiel's temple is a preexisting temple or maybe Herod's temple, which was a yet future temple in Ezekiel's day?
SInce "Eschatology" is just another word for "Rank SPeculation" I wouldn't know. There would be NO NEED for "Offerings" since there's only ONE Offering that was needed and THAT was 2000 years ago. Offerings now or in the future would be meaningless.
 

JDS

Well-known member
AN assumption, like ALL "Eschatology".

He is God, after all, and killing and death is no stranger to Him.


SInce "Eschatology" is just another word for "Rank SPeculation" I wouldn't know. There would be NO NEED for "Offerings" since there's only ONE Offering that was needed and THAT was 2000 years ago. Offerings now or in the future would be meaningless.
You are admitting to knowing more than you are letting on. You know what is meaningless and what is not in the future. Are you a prophet? Do you think these offerings could have another purpose than they did before the cross?
 

Bob Carabbio

Well-known member
You are admitting to knowing more than you are letting on. You know what is meaningless and what is not in the future. Are you a prophet? Do you think these offerings could have another purpose than they did before the cross?
There IS NO other purpose for a blood offering. Jesus provided the PERFECT Sin Offering once, and for all.
 

Truth7t7

Active member
It shows no such thing. It shows the end is

after

his coming and the text does not deal with the many events and the years between his coming and the end. If you were honest with the text you would see that.

For a perspective on the passage I offer some clarity.

This letter was written in AD 54. The creation of the world was in 4004 BC. That was the beginning of the world. After 1656 years, God destroyed the world with water, except for 8 people. He raised up a nation near the beginning of this new world and dealt with them under the principle of the written law of Moses for the last 1500 of the 2500 of those years until Jesus Christ came the first time. Through these people and their prophets he spoke and made many prophecies about what the world will be like and what he would accomplish through this people and the Messiah that he told them about. He told about how wicked that nation of his would become, as well as all the other nations of the world, until they would be as bad as the first world that he destroyed with water.

So, when the Messiah came the world was wicked and controlled by the devil and his nation refused to receive their Messiah and follow him into righteousness. The world of nations were completely against righteousness and they all deserved to be destroyed like before. However, God in mercy this time, instead of punishing the whole world because of sin and rebellion, delivered one man and spared the rest, God did it just the opposite. He punished one man for all sins and delivered the world of sinners. This put the mercy of God on open display for all the world to see, along with other of his attributes of divinity, like his long-suffering and, because he offered salvation to a world that deserved to die through the blood of that sinless one man to all men, his grace was openly displayed.

This age is not the subject of prophecy of the OT writers to Israel. God is dealing with the nations and not Israel during these times. The NT writers describes this age, which is defined as a mystery because it was not foreseen by OT prophets. Israel has been incorporated into the nations and have been persecuted by them God is jealous for them and will deal with the nations for their wickedness and for their failure to grasp hold of his forgiveness through Jesus Christ and he will bring this age to an end with a severe judgement that will leave but just a few, but only after he delivers those among the nations who have advantaged themselves of his mercy and grace. he will then begin once again to deal with his people, his nation, Israel, and sift them like gold in a refiners fire until all the dross is eliminated and they are pure. He will do this with four things. The nations, the animal kingdom, the climate, and pestilences. At the end of this short time, 7 years, he will send Jesus Christ to destroy those rebels that are left in his world and to establish divine rule over the earth for one thousand years. However, during those one thousand years new rebels will be born and at the end he will once again do some serious killing of rebels and end this series of 7000 years in which he has fully explained and revealed his entire character to the world of men. The last enemy to be destroyed is death when all the wicked of all the ages are resurrected to be judged at the great white throne judgement and cast into the lake of fire with the devil where they will be forever. This is called the second death. The righteous will enter into the new heaven and the new earth and there will be no more death.

The world would have been judged 3 times during the 7000 years according to the trinitarian God.
The first world saw God the Father and his works of righteousness.
The second world saw God the Son and his works of righteousness
the third world saw the Holy Ghost and his works of righteousness
And the new heaven and new earth will have God being all in all just like 1 Cor 15:28 says.

1 Cor 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

Where are we in this play? Well we are not to the place where Jesus rules and reigns and all enemies are not put under his feet yet. When it is over, all men in heaven and earth will have God indwelling their bodies as a permanent member of their trinitarian being.

This is the truth of the scriptures on March 8, 2021.
We Will Strongly Disagree :)

The Scripture Is Very Clear, At The Second Coming The Resurrection Takes Place, When Death Is Swallowed Up In Victory, The Last Enemy Death Is Destroyed (The End)

I'm Well Aware You Want A 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom On Earth "After" The Second Coming, But It Aint Gonna Happen, A (Fact)

The scripture below is very clear, it shows at the (Coming Of Jesus Christ) Then Cometh The End.

There Isn't A 1,000 Year Kingdom On This Earth Found Between Verses 23-24 Below.

Christ At His Coming (Millennium) Then Cometh The End

I Dont See A Millennium Below, Will You Add To Scripture

1 Corinthians 15:23-26 & 52-54KJV

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end
, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
 

Truth7t7

Active member
The point is there will be sacrifices made in the millennial kingdom and the glorified Jesus does not have a problem with killing and death, as has been assumed by one arrogant poster on this forum.

Ezekiel 44:11
Yet they shall be ministers in my sanctuary, having charge at the gates of the house, and ministering to the house: they shall slay the burnt offering and the sacrifice for the people, and they shall stand before them to minister unto them.

What do you think? Do you think Ezekiel's temple is a preexisting temple or maybe Herod's temple, which was a yet future temple in Ezekiel's day?
Ezekiel chapters 40-46 represents the 2nd Zerubbabel temple completed in 536BC after the Babylonian Captivity, where animal sacrifice for sin is seen, prior to the cross of Calvary.

Ezekiel 43:21-22KJV

21 Thou shalt take the bullock also of the sin offering, and he shall burn it in the appointed place of the house, without the sanctuary.
22 And on the second day thou shalt offer a kid of the goats without blemish for a sin offering; and they shall cleanse the altar, as they did cleanse it with the bullock.

Hey House Of Israel, My Name Is Ezekiel A Prophet Of God, We Have Been In Babylon For 25 Years Now, God Has Shown Me A Vision Of A New Temple, And Instructed Me To Let You Know?

Its Going To Be Built Thousands Of Years In The Future, Do I Get An Amen?:oops:

Ezekiel 1:1-6KJV

1 In the five and twentieth year of our captivity, in the beginning of the year, in the tenth day of the month, in the fourteenth year after that the city was smitten, in the selfsame day the hand of the Lord was upon me, and brought me thither.
2 In the visions of God brought he me into the land of Israel, and set me upon a very high mountain, by which was as the frame of a city on the south.
3 And he brought me thither, and, behold, there was a man, whose appearance was like the appearance of brass, with a line of flax in his hand, and a measuring reed; and he stood in the gate.
4 And the man said unto me, Son of man, behold with thine eyes, and hear with thine ears, and set thine heart upon all that I shall shew thee; for to the intent that I might shew them unto thee art thou brought hither: declare all that thou seest to the house of Israel.
5 And behold a wall on the outside of the house round about, and in the man's hand a measuring reed of six cubits long by the cubit and an hand breadth: so he measured the breadth of the building, one reed; and the height, one reed.
6 Then came he unto the gate which looketh toward the east, and went up the stairs thereof, and measured the threshold of the gate, which was one reed broad; and the other threshold of the gate, which was one reed broad.
 
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