Apostle John disagrees with you!
Why do SDA’s reject the words of the Bible?
- Thread starter Christian SDA
- Start date
Icyspark said:
Hi YeshuaFan,
As usual your comments are vacuous and don't engage the content of what you're responding to.
What day is the Lord's day? Here's a hint: It's not Sunday.
---------------- end quote
and don't give me
Rev.1:10
I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day,
and heard behind me a great voice,
as of a trumpet,
Rev is all about
"the Day of the Lord
The day of Battle and War
The sound of the 10 Trumpets in Leviticus
and the great Trumpet
the call to Judgement
Hi YeshuaFan,
As usual your comments are vacuous and don't engage the content of what you're responding to.
What day is the Lord's day? Here's a hint: It's not Sunday.
---------------- end quote
and where would that be
and don't give me
Rev.1:10
I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day,
and heard behind me a great voice,
as of a trumpet,
Rev is all about
"the Day of the Lord
The day of Battle and War
The sound of the 10 Trumpets in Leviticus
and the great Trumpet
the call to Judgement
The early churches started to assemble and worship on the Lords day of resurrection Sunday per the Apostles themselves!
Start ofthe new covenant and new era
CharismaticLady
Well-known member
Please reply to my response to you, #58 and thereafter. Why did you stop responding? You really need to read my posts; they have things you don't seem to know; or, maybe, just don't want to consider.
Icyspark
Active member
CharismaticLady
Well-known member
Respond to me. I can give you a scripture for everything I believe.
Icyspark
Active member
Hi CharismaticLady,
Sorry, but your rationale is based on a major misconception of what a covenant is. You continue to illustrate that you conflate the agreement/covenant with what was agreed upon. Thus you make the perfect, unchanging God of the Bible into an imperfect, changeable humanistic god of your own imagination. There's not much I can say when a person believes so strongly in what the spirit dwelling in them tells them to believe which is shown to be blatant heresy. I'm sure we'll talk more but there's only so much dismissal of what the Bible says on any particular topic before I have to allow the Spirit time to impress upon an individual the truths already presented.
God bless!
CharismaticLady
Well-known member
What I've said to you is God's Word. You are displaying what scripture says about your concept of the Old Covenant, and AGAINST Christ's New Covenant. The Covenant of the Spirit is understood by those with the Holy Spirit. You don't even believe in the covenant of the Spirit, thus you cling to the ministry of death, the laws engraved on stone.
2 Corinthians 3:
For until this day the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament, because the veil is taken away in Christ. 15 But even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart. 16 Nevertheless when one turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. 17 Now the Lord is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. 18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as by the Spirit of the Lord.
The Ten Commandments is for sinners. Why can't you understand that sinners are the very reason why Jesus came. To take their sin away!
Icyspark
Active member
Your nonsense transfers the fault from "the people" over to god. That's not the God I worship. It seems to me "the veil" is still in place for someone else.
Rev.1:10
I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day,
and heard behind me a great voice,
as of a trumpet,
Rev is all about
"the Day of the Lord
The day of Battle and War
The sound of the 10 Trumpets in Leviticus
and the great Trumpet
the call to Judgement
Hereafter what ??????????????
after what John was just shown in Ch's 2 and 3
after the lukewarn get spewed out
once again
-----The Parables---
Rev.1:10
I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day,
and heard behind me a great voice,
as of a trumpet,
and the "Trump of God"
shall be heard thru out the land
I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day,
and heard behind me a great voice,
as of a trumpet,
Rev is all about
"the Day of the Lord
The day of Battle and War
The sound of the 10 Trumpets in Leviticus
and the great Trumpet
the call to Judgement
Rev4:1
After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven:
and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me;
which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.
things which must be hereafterAfter this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven:
and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me;
which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.
Hereafter what ??????????????
after what John was just shown in Ch's 2 and 3
Rev.2:16
So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot,
I will spue thee out of my mouth.
So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot,
I will spue thee out of my mouth.
after the lukewarn get spewed out
once again
-----The Parables---
Matt.13:41
The Son of man shall send forth his angels,
and they shall gather out of his kingdom
all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
43 Then shall the righteous
shine forth as the sun
in the kingdom of their Father.
Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.
The Son of man shall send forth his angels,
and they shall gather out of his kingdom
all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
43 Then shall the righteous
shine forth as the sun
in the kingdom of their Father.
Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.
Rev.1:10
I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day,
and heard behind me a great voice,
as of a trumpet,
and the "Trump of God"
shall be heard thru out the land
CharismaticLady
Well-known member
Now you are just being evil. Proverbs 1:7 I've tried to be a friend to you and let you know I don't condemn you. And how do you respond? And you have the nerve to infer I belong to another spirit. Look in your own heart.
I've tried to help you and show you the Word of God on this subject. You think God never changes. God doesn't, but His laws do.
Garden of Eden - complete vegetarian
To Noah and the animals - can eat ANYTHING that moves.
To the Jews - can eat only the only meats that could previously be sacrificed to God, for they are separated from the other peoples. Lev. 11; Lev. 20:25-26.
God cleanses unclean meats. Acts 10:“What God has cleansed you must not call common.” Gospel now available to Gentiles.
1 Timothy 4: and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. 4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing is to be refused if it is received with thanksgiving; 5 for it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
1 Corinthians 6:12 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not helpful. All things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any. 13 Foods for the stomach and the stomach for foods, but God will destroy both it and them.
CharismaticLady
Well-known member
Then you haven't been listening. The "people" was ADAM. It was his willful sin that was at FAULT, NOT GOD, AND ADAM'S SIN damned the earth and all the people. They got so bad that God had to make laws to harness them under threat of death! But God had a plan to redeem man from the SIN that was causing all the evil and the threats. He sent His own Son to die and be resurrected, so we who would believe in Him could also die to our sin nature, and be resurrected to be slaves of righteousness, and right in God's eyes.
If you believe you still have a sin nature, then you ARE following another god.
CharismaticLady
Well-known member
Sinless perfection would be supernatural and only if we possess the supernatural God inside of us. Can we agree on that? Decide on the God you will follow and abide in, and He in us. Is that possible? Is your god weak, or all powerful? I choose the Creator!
2 Peter 1:2-11
2 Grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord, 3 as His divine power has given to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of Him who called us by glory and virtue, 4 by which have been given to us exceedingly great and precious promises, that through these you may be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.
10 Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble; 11 for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
1 Corinthians 2:9:16
9 But as it is written:
“Eye has not seen, nor ear heard,
Nor have entered into the heart of man
The things which God has prepared for those who love Him.”
10 But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. 11 For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.
13 These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one. 16 For “who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct Him?” But we have the mind of Christ.
2 Peter 1:2-11
2 Grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord, 3 as His divine power has given to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of Him who called us by glory and virtue, 4 by which have been given to us exceedingly great and precious promises, that through these you may be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.
10 Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble; 11 for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
1 Corinthians 2:9:16
9 But as it is written:
“Eye has not seen, nor ear heard,
Nor have entered into the heart of man
The things which God has prepared for those who love Him.”
10 But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. 11 For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.
13 These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one. 16 For “who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct Him?” But we have the mind of Christ.
Icyspark
Active member
Hi CharismaticLady,
As I said, I really don't wish to further engage but you keep illustrating serious errors which call for a rebuttal.
I provided a link in the post to which you just replied indicating the fault was with "the people" and if you would've just checked it maybe you would've seen this strange error before posting this. Aside from the obvious fact that the word "people" comprises more than one person (i.e. Adam doesn't qualify as a plurality as you insist), but the context of that quote indicates that the people were at fault because they did not remain faithful to God's covenant. Adam had nothing to do with the covenant which "the people" did not obey.
Hebrews 8:7-13
For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant, no place would have been sought for another. 8 But God found fault with the people and said:
“The days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah. It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they did not remain faithful to my covenant, and I turned away from them, declares the Lord. This is the covenant I will establish with the people of Israel after that time, declares the Lord. I will put my laws in their minds and write them on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people. No longer will they teach their neighbor, or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’ because they will all know me, from the least of them to the greatest. For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more.”
By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.
Context, context, context. - Was Adam involved "with that first covenant"?
- Was Adam one of "their ancestors" whom God lead "out of Egypt"?
- Was Adam involved in any way in "not remain[ing] faithful to" God's covenant?
- What covenant was made "obsolete and outdated" and was Adam around to participate in this covenant/agreement?
I am apparently wounding you my in correcting and rebuking your errors and for that I am sorry. But if not me, then who?
Wounds from a friend can be trusted, but an enemy multiplies kisses.
I pray this helps.
CharismaticLady
Well-known member
Yes, it was the people, but WHY couldn't they keep the law? That is the big hurdle in your mind you have to get over. If you can't answer that question, you will stay blind and in the dark.
The reason you don't want to engage with me is because I know the MEANING of scripture in the New Testament far better than you ever will while you refuse to even study them.
You bringing this up again - This is blatant error as was your earlier contention that "the law was holy." - shows your hatred of a fellow believer and have committed murder. 1 John 3:15 Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him.
I already explained I used Past Tense because I am no longer under the law for sinners. You will still have to say it IS holy for yourself.
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Icyspark
Active member
Hi CharismaticLady,
Thank you for admitting your error about Adam vs the people. I find it strange that immediately after acknowledging your own blatant error that you attempt to spin the narrative to the issue being in reality my error and that I'm the one supposedly "blind and in the dark."
Hmm. So the fact that I'm engaging you in reality means I not actually engaging you? That's rather strange, don'tcha think? If you "know the MEANING of scripture in the New Testament far better than ever will" how is it you're making such blatant errors regarding New Testament issues? This contention is very hard to justify in relation to your recent string of errors.
Wow. So now you're resorting to accusing me of "hatred of a fellow believer and hav[ing] committed murder"? I really don't think you understand the New Testament as well as you suppose. You certainly don't understand me or my motives. In fact, in my previous post I indicated that I am your true friend and quoted Proverbs 27:6: "Wounds from a friend can be trusted, but an enemy multiplies kisses." But apparently you think you not only know the New Testament better than me but you know me better than me. The reality, however, is that you don't know me or my motives. I correct and rebuke your errors in keeping with the Paul's New Testament admonition to "correct, rebuke and encourage--with great patience and careful instruction." Proverbs 10:17 says, "Whoever heeds discipline shows the way to life, but whoever ignores correction leads others astray." I correct you so that you do not lead others astray.
What's even more absurd is that by your own standard of what you suppose should be considered "hatred" you are condemning yourself as being hateful. You are attempting to correct what you perceive as being errors on my part, but apparently your corrections are loving and righteous, while my corrections of blatant errors are hateful and wicked? Yeahhhh, logic doesn't work like that and neither does the Holy Spirit.
Speaking of the Holy Spirit, let's consider what Paul says about those who walk according to the Spirit:
Galatians 5:16-26
So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever you want. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.
If you are walking by the Spirit do you think the Spirit is leading you to accuse me of being hateful? Since I am not in any way meaning to be hateful, then I can tell you that the Spirit is not leading you to accuse me of something which is not true. If that's the case does that not mean that you are embracing "the acts of the flesh"? Are you not--using your own expressed standard--being hateful toward me? Are your words not discordant? Are your words showing the fruit of the Spirit? Are your words showing forbearance toward me? Kindness? Gentleness and self-control? If not, then according to Paul you are not being led by the Spirit and you are still under the law.
Paul didn't qualify it the way you are attempting to do so.
Romans 7:7-12
What shall we say, then? Is the law sinful? Certainly not! Nevertheless, I would not have known what sin was had it not been for the law. For I would not have known what coveting really was if the law had not said, “You shall not covet.” But sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the commandment, produced in me every kind of coveting. For apart from the law, sin was dead. Once I was alive apart from the law; but when the commandment came, sin sprang to life and I died. I found that the very commandment that was intended to bring life actually brought death. For sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the commandment, deceived me, and through the commandment put me to death. So then, the law is holy, and the commandment is holy, righteous and good.
In this passage Paul confirms what is said elsewhere in the New Testament that transgression of the law is what determines sinful behavior. Your attempt to read into this passage something explicitly not there is not allowed for believers who are walking by the Spirit. Paul doesn't say, "The law is holy, righteous and good, but only for those who are no longer under the law." That is your private interpretation. Your dismissal of what the New Testament uses as the definition of sin is apparently what allows you to consider yourself sinless. After all, if there is no definition of sin, then effectively you are sinless. That's not New Testament. That's Your Testament.
I pray this helps.
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CharismaticLady
Well-known member
Yes, it was the Jews who couldn't keep the law, but first it was even worse for Adam. He had no excuse. Why couldn't the Jews keep the law?
I see you keep avoiding the questions you can't answer with attacks. I suppose because you would have to understand the New Covenant, and you are clueless on it. You only think you know the Old Covenant and believe it came first and the New Covenant couldn't end it. But the New Covenant actually came FIRST. Not that the Old Covenant ended for sinners. Are you a sinner?
ROFL You did it again. You think by posting attacks against me, you can take a pass on my questions to you. There is not a question you've asked me that I can't answer and do for we are to always give an answer for what we believe. I don't just believe in Jesus, I follow Him.
Wow. So now you're resorting to accusing me of "hatred of a fellow believer and hav[ing] committed murder"? I really don't think you understand the New Testament as well as you suppose. You certainly don't understand me or my motives. In fact, in my previous post I indicated that I am your true friend and quoted Proverbs 27:6: "Wounds from a friend can be trusted, but an enemy multiplies kisses." But apparently you think you not only know the New Testament better than me but you know me better than me. The reality, however, is that you don't know me or my motives. I correct and rebuke your errors in keeping with the Paul's New Testament admonition to "correct, rebuke and encourage--with great patience and careful instruction." Proverbs 10:17 says, "Whoever heeds discipline shows the way to life, but whoever ignores correction leads others astray." I correct you so that you do not lead others astray.
What's even more absurd is that by your own standard of what you suppose should be considered "hatred" you are condemning yourself as being hateful. You are attempting to correct what you perceive as being errors on my part, but apparently your corrections are loving and righteous, while my corrections of blatant errors are hateful and wicked? Yeahhhh, logic doesn't work like that and neither does the Holy Spirit.
Speaking of the Holy Spirit, let's consider what Paul says about those who walk according to the Spirit:
Galatians 5:16-26So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever you want. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.
If you are walking by the Spirit do you think the Spirit is leading you to accuse me of being hateful? Since I am not in any way meaning to be hateful, then I can tell you that the Spirit is not leading you to accuse me of something which is not true. If that's the case does that not mean that you are embracing "the acts of the flesh"? Are you not--using your own expressed standard--being hateful toward me? Are your words not discordant? Are your words showing the fruit of the Spirit? Are your words showing forbearance toward me? Kindness? Gentleness and self-control? If not, then according to Paul you are not being led by the Spirit and you are still under the law.
I accept truths, and did learn something from you that I cherish, and that is on the solid reason to believe in Annihilation - The Tree of Life. I'm so excited by that revelation, I'm even going to add it to my book. (I'm a Christian author.) But on the New Covenant, sorry, but you are still clueless, so your wound of a friend are just wounds of a blinded enemy so you don't have to answer my questions. Here is another: Why did Jesus come and die for us? What did He accomplish in full.
Paul didn't qualify it the way you are attempting to do so.
Romans 7:7-12What shall we say, then? Is the law sinful? Certainly not! Nevertheless, I would not have known what sin was had it not been for the law. For I would not have known what coveting really was if the law had not said, “You shall not covet.” But sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the commandment, produced in me every kind of coveting. For apart from the law, sin was dead. Once I was alive apart from the law; but when the commandment came, sin sprang to life and I died. I found that the very commandment that was intended to bring life actually brought death. For sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the commandment, deceived me, and through the commandment put me to death. So then, the law is holy, and the commandment is holy, righteous and good.
In this passage Paul confirms what is said elsewhere in the New Testament that transgression of the law is what determines sinful behavior. Your attempt to read into this passage something explicitly not there is not allowed for believers who are walking by the Spirit. Paul doesn't say, "The law is holy, righteous and good, but only for those who are no longer under the law." That is your private interpretation. Your dismissal of what the New Testament uses as the definition of sin is apparently what allows you to consider yourself sinless. After all, if there is no definition of sin, then effectively you are sinless. That's not New Testament. That's Your Testament.
It is interesting, your understanding of Romans 7. But you are correct, it is all about the Old Covenant. But you just don't read far enough. Romans 8:2 shows that Jesus freed us from the LAW of sin and death, the Old Covenant.
Here is a verse in Romans 7 you seemed to cleverly overlook. verses 5-6 5 "For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death. 6 But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter."
What does that mean?
Stop all the running on and on about ad hominems about me, and just answer my questions if you can.
e v e 21
Well-known member
until we receive our glorified body (soon) and go Home we are still not entirely free though? that Day being a fulfillment of being saved the way i think you mean that ….. by law I understand sin and death, flesh…. to be at war with His law of life…. Consider that whole purpose of the 10 commandments was and is to protect us until that Day…. seen in that way as a protection for us from the evil realm, then it’s understandable that we still need to listen Him all the time. I think I get what you might mean that as souls if we are in Him and listen Him and left behind this world…(which is still obeying Him!) then we are under His law now which is the law of the spirit of life. There is always a law at work (a law is a reality) such that it is His or it is of sin….