Why does God call people to repentence?

L

LeeH

Well-known member
Does God want all people to repent and believe in him, does he command it?

If the answer is no, please explain why God commands something he doesn't want to happen?
If the answer is yes, then he must want all people to be saved, if he wants ALL people to repent and believe, what other purpose can there be for it?
 
Acts 17:30 says He does. But commanding them does not mean they have the ability to. Just like we are commanded to be holy as He is holy. We are commanded to be just as holy as He is, yet we are unable to do so. ?
 
LeeH said:
Does God want all people to repent and believe in him, does he command it?
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First we have to define what is meant by "all people", because Paul and John are referring to both "Jews and Greeks/Gentiles".

You on the other hand are going to be referring to every single person, so we'll be arguing past each other.
LeeH said:
If the answer is no, please explain why God commands something he doesn't want to happen?
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LeeH said:
If the answer is yes, then he must want all people to be saved, if he wants ALL people to repent and believe, what other purpose can there be for it?
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It could be the same purpose for giving the Mosaic law, commanding all to follow the Mosaic law, all the while knowing no one could follow the Mosaic law.

In other words whatever objection you have with the Calvinist position on this, first has to be answered with the Mosaic law.
 
CookedGoose said:
First we have to define what is meant by "all people", because Paul and John are referring to both "Jews and Greeks/Gentiles".

You on the other hand are going to be referring to every single person, so we'll be arguing past each other.


It could be the same purpose for giving the Mosaic law, commanding all to follow the Mosaic law, all the while knowing no one could follow the Mosaic law.

In other words whatever objection you have with the Calvinist position on this, first has to be answered with the Mosaic law.
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I'm leaning toward "all people" to include Jew and Gentile, not every single person ever.
 
CookedGoose said:
First we have to define what is meant by "all people", because Paul and John are referring to both "Jews and Greeks/Gentiles".

You on the other hand are going to be referring to every single person, so we'll be arguing past each other.
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Who are his commandments aimed at, just the elect or everyone?
CookedGoose said:
It could be the same purpose for giving the Mosaic law, commanding all to follow the Mosaic law, all the while knowing no one could follow the Mosaic law.

In other words whatever objection you have with the Calvinist position on this, first has to be answered with the Mosaic law.
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Does he want people to do his will and is his will when he gives mankind commandments for men to do them?
 
LeeH said:
Who are his commandments aimed at, just the elect or everyone?

Does he want people to do his will and is his will when he gives mankind commandments for men to do them?
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Now you are on to something...

As I say, I would be better at your sides Apology than y'all are. Just don't misuse it...
 
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CookedGoose said:
Absolutely.
I'm leaning way over there.
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I would guess that if God wanted every single person saved, He would have chosen every single person in Christ. But that is only me thinking with my finite mind through what God has revealed in Scripture.

I also believe the call to repent, even when we tell someone they need to, and they will never be saved, it is a damning message to them.
 
LeeH said:
Who are his commandments aimed at, just the elect or everyone?
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Both Jews and Greeks (aka everyone)
LeeH said:
Does he want people to do his will
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Both Jews and Greeks (aka people)
LeeH said:
and is his will when he gives mankind commandments for men to do them?
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As long as they're either Jews or Gentiles (aka mankind). But according to Ephesians 5 it's not just "men" but also husbands, children, wives etc.....
 
SovereignGrace said:
Acts 17:30 says He does.
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So okay we can agree on this, so does he want everyone to believe or not, not that they maybe able to, the question does hye want them to?

If so, why does he want them to?
SovereignGrace said:
But commanding them does not mean they have the ability to.
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That is a seperate issue at the moment.
SovereignGrace said:
Just like we are commanded to be holy as He is holy.
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Again a seperate issue at the moment and although important doesn't address the question in the OP.
SovereignGrace said:
We are commanded to be just as holy as He is, yet we are unable to do so. ?
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What's the owl for, I keep seeing that, what is that all about?
 
CookedGoose said:
Both Jews and Greeks (aka everyone)

Both Jews and Greeks (aka people)

As long as they're either Jews or Gentiles (aka mankind). But according to Ephesians 5 it's not just "men" but also husbands, children, wives etc.....
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Okay so we are agreed that God wants all mankind to do his will, everyone, but for what purpose does he call for everyone to believe?

We both can agree not everyone will be saved, we agree on that, this is a seperate issue, but if he commands it, it must be his will that we obey that commandment, not to not obey it, no? What happens if we obey, will it or can it lead to salvation, is that the purpose of that command?

What do you say are you in agreement so far?
 
CookedGoose said:
Both Jews and Greeks (aka everyone)

Both Jews and Greeks (aka people)

As long as they're either Jews or Gentiles (aka mankind). But according to Ephesians 5 it's not just "men" but also husbands, children, wives etc.....
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I would say to practice a solid hermeneutics, wherever we see the phrases "whole world;" 1 John 2:2, "all people;" Luke 2:10, "all men;' 1 Timothy 2:4 &c we appropriately interpret them as not meaning "every single person ever." We need to remain consistent in this practice throughout Scripture.

In these and other passages where context, culture, purpose, audience &c limit "all" in its scope. We should exercise the same hermeneutical consistency with this text in Acts 17:30. If not we are changing our hermeneutical principles and are not being consistent in interpreting Scripture.

I see nothing in this text that says otherwise, and I cannot in good conscience use it to say God wants every single person ever to be saved.
 
preacher4truth said:
I would guess that if God wanted every single person saved, He would have chosen every single person in Christ. But that is only me thinking with my finite mind through what God has revealed in Scripture.
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We disagree on the predestination side has you know P4T, but this is a seperate issue for now, it's what does God intend when he commands us to do something, is it his will we do it, do you believe that?
 
LeeH said:
Okay so we are agreed that God wants all mankind to do his will, everyone, but for what purpose does he call for everyone to believe?

We both can agree not everyone will be saved, we agree on that, this is a seperate issue, but if he commands it, it must be his will that we obey that commandment, not to not obey it, no? What happens if we obey, will it or can it lead to salvation, is that the purpose of that command?

What do you say are you in agreement so far?
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If you want to tell us his Purpose, go ahead; it will move the Debate along.
 
I have to catch up with this tomorrow, got 4 websites to work on and it's late here. Goodnight everyone, hope you have some productive discussions.
 
preacher4truth said:
I would say to practice a solid hermeneutical, wherever we see the phrases "whole world;" 1 John 2:2, "all people;" Luke 2:10, "all men;' 1 Timothy 2:4 &c we appropriately interpret them as not meaning every single person ever. We need to remain consistent in this practice throughout Scripture.

In these and other passages where context, culture, purpose, audience &c limit "all" in its scope, we should exercise the same consistency with this text in Actys 17:30. If not we are changing our hermeneutical principles and are not being consistent in interpreting Scripture.

I see nothing in this text that says otherwise, and I cannot in good conscience use it to say God wants every single person ever to be saved.
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Completely agree. Infact it could be the main purpose for recording Acts 15.
Sets the context for the rest of the New Covenant.
 
CookedGoose said:
I don't think it is. I think it's at the very heart of the issue and it's why the Mosaic law needs to be addressed.

Why does He still find fault?
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Good question, which Paul offered.

Which imo he never did answer.

Besides seeking to displace everyone to NOT being.
 
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