Why does God call people to repentence?

Unbelievers have free will because they have the free choice to be able to do whatever they desire to do.​
To Matt I'd say free will has to mean to freely be able to yield a yeah or nay about any given situation without an over riding decision something is going to be a certain way regardless. Calvinistic thought doesn't offer such a thing not really although Matt's statement above tries to make it seem like it does. I'd say somewhere within his conscious mind he doesn't really want to believe in Calvinism.

This is why unbelievers do not have the ability to not sin.​
But not totally true. Unbelievers do have an ability not to sin. They do it all the time. What they don't have the ability to do is walk in the total perfection of God's character that is without the Spirit of God. Many sinners choose not to go into strife, unforgiveness, and other types of sin. Lots of sinners don't choose to walk in gluttony or other things as well. My point. There's no proof that man can't at least want something better that is to receive God's empowerment and to walk in a better way.

So yes, Adam had free will. He had the ability to make choices that were consistent with his non-fallen nature. No one forced him to sin. He freely chose to rebel against God.​
Again Matt is forgetting something. Before the man had his fallen nature according to Calvinism God ordained him not to be saved. Now that didn't happen but such is what Calvinism teaches.

 
To Matt I'd say free will has to mean to freely be able to yield a yeah or nay about any given situation without an over riding decision something is going to be a certain way regardless. Calvinistic thought doesn't offer such a thing not really although Matt's statement above tries to make it seem like it does. I'd say somewhere within his conscious mind he doesn't really want to believe in Calvinism.
I obviously disagree with you. So, I have a question for you. You then must hold a position that people are not born sinners, and have a total free-will, correct?
But not totally true. Unbelievers do have an ability not to sin. They do it all the time. What they don't have the ability to do is walk in the total perfection of God's character that is without the Spirit of God. Many sinners choose not to go into strife, unforgiveness, and other types of sin. Lots of sinners don't choose to walk in gluttony or other things as well. My point. There's no proof that man can't at least want something better that is to receive God's empowerment and to walk in a better way.
Where can I find this in Scripture? I must point out the obvious here, you have a weak position of Adam's disobedience toward God in the garden and what consequence it brought upon the whole human race. Are you familiar with what Christ had to do to redeem sinners from their sins?

Does it not state in Scripture that our wills are bound or enslaved to sin? What does this mean to you?
Again Matt is forgetting something. Before the man had his fallen nature according to Calvinism God ordained him not to be saved. Now that didn't happen but such is what Calvinism teaches.
No sir this Hyper-Calvinism, not Classical Calvinism, there's a big difference. research it for yourself. R.C. Sproul put it this way, God decreed to allow the Fall. Otherwise God would be author of evil. Sin (evil) came into the world through One Man's Act of Disobedience Romans 5:12-21.
 
None the less Calvinism I'm sorry is wrong.
You claim that Calvinism is wrong, but caricature Calvinism without knowledge or facts, but with assumptions and slander. Don't do that, I urge you to do your OWN homework. As I did before I became a convinced Classical Calvinist; not a Hyper-Calvinist. If you are really seeking the Doctrines of Grace (God's Word), the truth, then do so. Don't take my word for it, do it yourself, read everything you can get your hands on. Then, and only then you can understand these topics and arguments that have plagued Christendom from the very beginning.
 
Well right out of the gate Matt is forgetting something. Calvinism teaches that the actions of Adam and Eve were ordained before they did them. That means a guaranteed end result with no possibility to change. So where is your free will?
FYI, so that you are aware, Calvin only wrote about half a page on predestination. By the way Calvin did not agree once again that Adam & Eve did not have free-wills, God decreed to allow the fall, that's completely different that saying God made them sin purposely, forced, or coerced them to it. This would make God the author of evil. the Bible is clear that evil came through One Man's (ACT)(DECISION) of disobedience.
 
FYI, so that you are aware, Calvin only wrote about half a page on predestination. By the way Calvin did not agree once again that Adam & Eve did not have free-wills, God decreed to allow the fall,

If Calvin himself believed God ordained that men would sin he did not believe in freedom of will. Now don't provide a quote to me saying he did if he were here I'd tell him myself you DO NOT really believe that. If you did you would not believe God ordained men to sin.

“Accordingly it cannot be denied that before creating man, God foresaw to what end he would come; he foresaw it because he had so ordained it in his counsel…No one should think it strange if I say that God not only foresaw the fall of the first man, and with it the ruin of all his posterity, but also willed it. For just as it is part of his wisdom that he foresees all future events, so it is part of his power that he rules and governs all things by his hand.” Institutes 478


that's completely different that saying God made them sin purposely, forced, or coerced them to it. This would make God the author of evil. the Bible is clear that evil came through One Man's (ACT)(DECISION) of disobedience.
No offence but He did not just believe God allowed the fall. He believed God willed it (see above quote) and all things took place by his hand.
 
You claim that Calvinism is wrong, but caricature Calvinism without knowledge or facts,
I've heard that before however I think maybe perhaps in time, you'll consider you've made a false assumption.

If you are really seeking the Doctrines of Grace (God's Word), the truth, then do so
But you do understand correct that Non-Calvinists believe what the Bible teaches about grace BUT just not what the Calvinists consider grace to be.

 
Does God want all people to repent and believe in him, does he command it?

If the answer is no, please explain why God commands something he doesn't want to happen?
If the answer is yes, then he must want all people to be saved, if he wants ALL people to repent and believe, what other purpose can there be for it?
What Calvinists keep failing to realize and see is that God found a way to place Himself temporarily into a state of being able to create souls without knowing the outcome until after the creating was done, then removes himself from that state of being...
Jesus coming to earth as a man revealed this ability of God to suspend God's omniscience. That's why all things created were created THROUGH Christ to guarantee this freedom would be manifested.

Arminianism on the other hand sees the results of the reality that God produced when people are getting saved, but can not define why it is so.

Then we have Satan... He who gets in the middle and starts wars amongst believers pitting one's bias against the other.

In depth knowledge of doctrine is the only solution. Insight must be gained to make one free from the conflict that is an equivalent of being in caught in a church - bar room brawl.

In the meanwhile, Satan seeks and recruits amongst believers certain spiritual bullies. Bullies to suppress truth that opposes the arrogance of those bullies' thinking. For they must maintain the status of being in the superior position in their own mind to satisfy their weakness of ego lust.

Until then? Its war.

Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him,
If you continue in my word, then are you my disciples indeed;
And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."
John 8:31-32


grace and peace.....
 
No sir this Hyper-Calvinism, not Classical Calvinism, there's a big difference. research it for yourself. R.C. Sproul put it this way, God decreed to allow the Fall. Otherwise God would be author of evil. Sin (evil) came into the world through One Man's Act of Disobedience Romans 5:12-21.
This is NOT Hyper-Calvinism. Its infra vs supra. If R.C Sproul believes this I would say he is a "Hypo-Calvinist".

Here is Calvin(Institutes, Chapter 23, part 7)

"Nor ought it to seem absurd when I say, that God not only foresaw the fall of the first man, and in him the ruin of his posterity; but also at his own pleasure arranged it."
 
What Calvinists keep failing to realize and see is that God found a way to place Himself temporarily into a state of being able to create souls without knowing the outcome until after the creating was done, then removes himself from that state of being...
Jesus coming to earth as a man revealed this ability of God to suspend God's omniscience. That's why all things created were created THROUGH Christ to guarantee this freedom would be manifested.
Where is this concept found in the Bible?

Arminianism on the other hand sees the results of the reality that God produced when people are getting saved, but can not define why it is so.
What are you, Calvininst or Arminian? I personally lean much more towards Calvinism, and I believe the doctrine of grace.

Then we have Satan... He who gets in the middle and starts wars amongst believers pitting one's bias against the other.
Satan is controlled by God. God uses Satan to accomplish His purposes. See Job 42. If believers are fighting with each other, it's because God has purposed it from before time through His means.
 
What Calvinists keep failing to realize and see is that God found a way to place Himself temporarily into a state of being able to create souls without knowing the outcome until after the creating was done, then removes himself from that state of being...
I wish you well in convincing them of that, I can't even convince them that when God is angry he is not getting what he wants. That might be my debating skills though.
Then we have Satan... He who gets in the middle and starts wars amongst believers pitting one's bias against the other.
Divide and conquer, we see the same technique used in kingdoms fighting each other and Jesus confirms the reality of dividing a kingdom, what that will mean. Satan used the same technique with man and God, division.
In depth knowledge of doctrine is the only solution. Insight must be gained to make one free from the conflict that is an equivalent of being in caught in a church - bar room brawl.
If you don't have Gods peace, no amount of doctrine will help you get through that though.
In the meanwhile, Satan seeks and recruits amongst believers certain spiritual bullies. Bullies to suppress truth that opposes the arrogance of those bullies' thinking. For they must maintain the status of being in the superior position in their own mind to satisfy their weakness of ego lust.
Yeah, I know.
Until then? Its war.
I said the very same thing some weeks ago.
Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him,
If you continue in my word, then are you my disciples indeed;
And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."
John 8:31-32


grace and peace.....
Grace and peace to you GeneZ, your posts are always insightful and I love reading them, God bless.
 
This is NOT Hyper-Calvinism. Its infra vs supra. If R.C Sproul believes this I would say he is a "Hypo-Calvinist".

Here is Calvin(Institutes, Chapter 23, part 7)

"Nor ought it to seem absurd when I say, that God not only foresaw the fall of the first man, and in him the ruin of his posterity; but also at his own pleasure arranged it."
Fun fact, Calvin disagree with Augustine on God removing Grace from Adam which caused him to fall. Calvin says if this what happened then God is the author of evil. I'll found the Calvin reference and send to you. And yeah, God decreed to allow the fall. Semantics?
 
Fun fact, Calvin disagree with Augustine on God removing Grace from Adam which caused him to fall. Calvin says if this what happened then God is the author of evil. I'll found the Calvin reference and send to you. And yeah, God decreed to allow the fall. Semantics?
I don't really care what Calvin believed but to say that supralapsarians are hyper-calvinists is not true. I am just wanting to understand if you believe supralapsarians are hyper-calvinists? Are you saying that quote I provided is missing context?
 
GeneZ said:
What Calvinists keep failing to realize and see is that God found a way to place Himself temporarily into a state of being able to create souls without knowing the outcome until after the creating was done, then removes himself from that state of being...

I wish you well in convincing them of that,

1) Why would you WANT to convince us of that?!

2) Where do you find the above IN THE BIBLE, which is the ONLY reason we would have for accepting such nonsense?

I can't even convince them that when God is angry he is not getting what he wants. That might be my debating skills though.

... or more likely is you're unwillingness to accept what the BIBLE teaches.

Also, we don't follow the "teachings of men" (i.e. YOU).
We follow the BIBLE.

If you don't have Gods peace, no amount of doctrine will help you get through that though.

I can't understand why you think constantly attacking God's truth results in any "peace".

Grace and peace to you GeneZ, your posts are always insightful and I love reading them, God bless.

Luke 6:33 And if you do good to those who do good to you, what benefit is that to you? For even sinners do the same.

Funny how you only wish "grace and peace" to your buddies, but never to Calvinists.
 
I don't really care what Calvin believed but to say that supralapsarians are hyper-calvinists is not true. I am just wanting to understand if you believe supralapsarians are hyper-calvinists? Are you saying that quote I provided is missing context?
All I am saying is that I am not a Hyper-Calvinist. You can research the differences between Classical & Hyper Calvinism.
 
All I am saying is that I am not a Hyper-Calvinist. You can research the differences between Classical & Hyper Calvinism.
Neither am I, but you did make the claim that those who are supralapsarian are hyper calvinists. This is what I am asking you.
 
Where is this concept found in the Bible?

Found with God's ability done only through Christ, who can make Himself become as a man who was fully dependent upon the Father and Spirit.

One key is to be found in.... "All things created through Him." Why through him?


For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible,
whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him
and for him. He is before all things, and in him all things hold together."
Col 1:16-17

The creation was created both through Him, and for Him.

Meaning? All things that were created, were created to be relatable to a human soul. Jesus is two natures in union. Deity and Soul.

Created through Him (soul) as to make the lives being created to be created outside of the realm of God's omniscience. Thus, created to be initially free from any influence of the omniscience of God! To be created with only the Lord's love and the best intentions for all.

When He returned to manifesting His rightful omniscience he was instantly able to determine those who would freely reject, and freely accept.

God can do that easily. It will confound those who remain determined to keep things too simple...

The two natures of the Lord Jesus Christ being in union must first be understood before what I stated can make sense.

grace and peace ........
 
Grace and peace to you GeneZ, your posts are always insightful and I love reading them, God bless.


Thank you for your encouragement.
That means more to me than you might know.

grace and peace .......
 
Jesus calls all men to salvation.

Mathew 11:28 Jesus said “Come to me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest.”

John 7:37 “Now on the last day of the great feast, Jesus stood and cried out, saying ‘If any man is thirsty, let him come to Me and drink’.”

In John 12:32 Jesus said “And if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto Myself.”

Acts 17:30 “Therefore having overlooked the times of ignorance, God is now commanding all men everywhere to repent.”

Revelation 22:17 “And the Spirit and the bride say, ‘Come’. And let the one who hears say, ‘Come.’ And let the one who wishes (wills) take the water of life without cost.”

Romans 11:32 “For God has shut up all in disobedience that He might show mercy to all.”

God’s grace is resistible and man can resist His calling for salvation.

Luke 7:30 “But the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected God’s purpose for themselves, not having been baptized by John.”

Acts 7:51 “You men who are stiff necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears are always resisting the Holy Spirit; you are doing just as your fathers did.”

Mathew 23:37 “Oh Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling.”

Romans 2:5 “But because of your stubbornness and unrepentant heart you are storing up wrath for yourself in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgement of God,”

John 5:39 “You search the Scriptures, because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is these that bear witness of Me; and you are unwilling to come to Me, that you may have life.”

Romans 10:21 “But as for Israel He says, ‘All the day long I have stretched out my hands to a disobedient and obstinate people’.”

hope this helps !!!
 
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