Why does Jesus need to remain a man?

[cjab]

I'm actually disagreeing with the term "metaphor..." This is not a similitude to me, but a spiritual reality.

Spiritual reality is conveyed in metaphor. See Jesus' parables.

If the angels neither marry nor are given in marriage, that is the case for all the angels in the OT...maleness or femaleness, as my limited understanding sees it in the spiritual realm, is in the sense of seed bearing, or fruit bearing.

OK

I'm with Corrie Ten Boom. I'm a panmillennialist. It will pan out, and I'll see it when it comes. I'm also promillennialist. I'm all for it. As far as the church goes, He delegated to us His authority as the Son of Adam, He promised I would do all the works He did and greater, and that He was always only ever with me right up to the end of the age. That's not a millennial thing. That's a day/night thing. As He promised, night came. No man could work, and now the day is dawning, and the church is awakening to the authority He measured to us in His new will and testament.

But the kingdom of God isn't on earth. That's a problem for those who see those in the kingdom of God as inheriting this earth. What does "the meek will inherit the earth" actually mean?

There is something to "no longer being under the curse" that belies your claim. We are no longer under that curse.

We are still stung by wasps and stinging nettles, and can catch deadly diseases. Our bodies still die. I think our flesh remains under the curse all right.

The prophetic roles we have been given are still being played out. You are right, and as the "Woke" enforcers becomes increasingly depraved, we can see how seriously Paul's prophecy in Romans 1 should be taken.

It comes as it came the day Jesus sent out the seventy, and satan is poised once again to fall...like lightning from heaven as the church takes it to his gates.

How can satan fall a second time?

Yeah...that comes later. There is a lot more that is about to be fulfilled. Peter talks of a "salvation that stands ready to be revealed in the last days." That is something imminent to look forward to.

 

[BMS]

God made flesh in Jesus is male and a man. That is how it is and how it always will be. Nonetheless the image of God is one man with one woman.

 

[tbeachhead]

Spiritual reality is conveyed in metaphor. See Jesus' parables.

This is a truism...that limits God. Spiritual reality is conveyed in whatever manner God chooses to convey it. That which is revealed belongs to man. That which is hidden belongs to God.

OK


But the kingdom of God isn't on earth. That's a problem for those who see those in the kingdom of God as inheriting this earth. What does "the meek will inherit the earth" actually mean?

Jesus did not teach us to pray futile prayers that will never be answered, or to which the answer will always be "No!" He taught me to pray, "Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven." I pray believing as I was taught to pray, nothing doubting.

I've never learned an alternative to the prayer of faith.

We are still stung by wasps and stinging nettles, and can catch deadly diseases. Our bodies still die. I think our flesh remains under the curse all right.

You're asking me to walk by sight? I don't care what happened...I care what has been promised.

How can satan fall a second time?

Satan falls whenever and wherever the church rises up. He fell when Jesus turned him down. He fell when the seventy were sent out...he offered Jesus that territory, and Jesus refused...sent the seventy in and liberated the land. He falls whenever a believer takes a stand. And he'll fall at the start and again at the end of the Millennial Reign, if I'm reading Revelation correctly.

 

[Thistle]

This is a truism...that limits God. Spiritual reality is conveyed in whatever manner God chooses to convey it. That which is revealed belongs to man. That which is hidden belongs to God.

Jesus did not teach us to pray futile prayers that will never be answered, or to which the answer will always be "No!" He taught me to pray, "Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven." I pray believing as I was taught to pray, nothing doubting.

I've never learned an alternative to the prayer of faith.
You're asking me to walk by sight? I don't care what happened...I care what has been promised.

Satan falls whenever and wherever the church rises up. He fell when Jesus turned him down. He fell when the seventy were sent out...he offered Jesus that territory, and Jesus refused...sent the seventy in and liberated the land. He falls whenever a believer takes a stand. And he'll fall at the start and again at the end of the Millennial Reign, if I'm reading Revelation correctly.

I think I agree with what you've said here. You mention no alternative to the prayer of faith and in my view Peter tells us that Christian baptism is not so much a removal of dirt from the body, but it is an appeal to God for a clear conscience. At the end of this millennial age I see all things coming to a conclusion in the great judgment during which God will re-create the heavens in the earth and it is in fact this earth that will be recreated as our eternal disposition. And it is there, or shall I say here, that we will reign for eternity with Christ. So I suppose that in that case God's will shall be done on earth as it is in heaven and God's kingdom will come to earth literally.

 

[tbeachhead]

I think I agree with what you've said here. You mention no alternative to the prayer of faith and in my view Peter tells us that Christian baptism is not so much a removal of dirt from the body, but it is an appeal to God for a clear conscience. At the end of this millennial age I see all things coming to a conclusion in the great judgment during which God will re-create the heavens in the earth and it is in fact this earth that will be recreated as our eternal disposition. And it is there, or shall I say here, that we will reign for eternity with Christ. So I suppose that in that case God's will shall be done on earth as it is in heaven and God's kingdom will come to earth literally.

God’s will is done when revival strikes the land, and kingdom rule guides each and every heart. Think again of what happened when the seventy were sent out and even demons were subject to His name. The kingdom of God was at hand!

We don’t have to wait to the end of time to witness first hand the answer to the Lord’s Prayer. We’re called to be witnesses. Now. Today.

 

[Thistle]

God’s will is done when revival strikes the land, and kingdom rule guides each and every heart. Think again of what happened when the seventy were sent out and even demons were subject to His name. The kingdom of God was at hand!

We don’t have to wait to the end of time to witness first hand the answer to the Lord’s Prayer. We’re called to be witnesses. Now. Today.

I agree with all of that except there is in fact a difference between the kingdom being "at hand" and the kingdom arriving. Of course as we read Ephesians 3 there is a sense in which we are reigning with Christ even now as he is exalted in heaven at the right hand of God the Father. But there will be a more kinetic expression of that fact in a recreated universe.

 

[tbeachhead]

I agree with all of that except there is in fact a difference between the kingdom being "at hand" and the kingdom arriving. Of course as we read Ephesians 3 there is a sense in which we are reigning with Christ even now as he is exalted in heaven at the right hand of God the Father. But there will be a more kinetic expression of that fact in a recreated universe.

As I see it, we make this more complicated than we should. Either the Kingdom is effectual and potent and satan’s reign is challenged, or the kingdom is imaginary and impotent, ie some esoteric theory of the future…and our hands are tied until He returns. I cannot believe he turned us back over to satan’s rule. He sent us out to bring down the very gates of hell, that cannot withstand a fully armed church.

 

[Thistle]

As I see it, we make this more complicated than we should. Either the Kingdom is effectual and potent and satan’s reign is challenged, or the kingdom is imaginary and impotent, ie some esoteric theory of the future…and our hands are tied until He returns. I cannot believe he turned us back over to satan’s rule. He sent us out to bring down the very gates of hell, that cannot withstand a fully armed church.

I would simply say that both are true, each in its own way. We do in fact have a super power given to us by God which is the Holy Spirit, which is both as a super power to defeat sin our own lives and a superpower to convict the world of the sin of which they are guilty.

So it is very true that we live in a world that is completely unlike the world into which Christ was born. Even the greatest horrors which survive do not compare to the Roman roads that were lined with crosses for miles and miles to prove that the world was subject to its antichrist reign. And I don't mean to single Rome out in particular because this would've been true of every empire back to Nimrod. In no way was Satan bound during that entire period of time. And of course the same is true in anti-diluvian times from the fall till the flood.


Yet it is true the glimpses of that evil do reappear in men like Stalin and Hitler and Pol Pot and undoubtedly men yet to come.

 

[101G]

God made flesh in Jesus is male and a man. That is how it is and how it always will be. Nonetheless the image of God is one man with one woman.

Good answer, Genesis 1:26 " And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth."
Genesis 1:27 " So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them."

before you can have an IMAGE, you must already have the SOURCE of the Image. in this case God in Flesh, that was to come.

PICJAG, 101G.

 

[101G]

Anyone know of a scripture, or even logic that would explain the need for Jesus to remain a man, in a man's body after He resurrected?

Revelation 21:1 "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea."
Revelation 21:2 "And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband."
Revelation 21:3 "And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God."
Revelation 21:4 "And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away."
Revelation 21:5 "And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful."

God will be with us in a body.

 

[bluedog1us]

And what does scripture teach is the reason for Jesus to continue in Heaven as a man in a man's body? Any idea?

Because He is still a priest intercepting for us. And He will remain a priest until His last enemy, which is death, is put under His feet. And in order to be a priest He must be a man as per Numbers 4.

 

[Thistle]

And what does scripture teach is the reason for Jesus to continue in Heaven as a man in a man's body? Any idea?

Jesus of Nazareth was never not a man. So far as that goes, he will always be what God created him to be in as much as he was a man. And as every man has a finite human nature so Jesus of Nazareth had a finite human nature. The eternal Word that we read about at the beginning of John, the second person of the Godhead, of course is eternal.

So as the eternal Word was in Jesus it is correct to say that the undivided nature of God was also in Jesus and this is why we say the Jesus was fully human and fully God because he had both a finite human nature and the undivided eternal nature of God within him. Your comment calls to my mind a couple of passages Ephesians 1: 20–23 and Romans 8:18–27, 29. One could ask how could God be glorified and exalted by God because he's already on the highest place he could possibly be, from the ultimate superlative perch, how could you possibly be exalted from there? I think the answer is the eternal Word was not exalted, rather the finite man Jesus of Nazareth was. Because of the nature of the trinity there are paradoxes like this that can be carefully unwound.

From these passages it just seems obvious to me that Christ having been once for all physically resurrected and being the first born of the resurrection need not become a disembodied spirit between now and the general resurrection. It seems to me that this was the plan from the beginning the Christ would be once for all resurrected bodily and we would join him in the general resurrection on the last day. And of course as Romans eight explains all creation is going to be physically resurrected and there will be a new heaven and a new earth which is part and parcel of this complete resurrection of the entire universe.

So it is interesting that there is this dimension where the physically resurrected Christ can sit at the right hand of a theophany of the Father and preside over all of creation. It does quite ignite the imagination. I expect that this was the idea that inspired J.R.R. Tolkien to write this line:

What Christian wouldn't be "quite ready" for the adventure that lies beyond the resurrection of the dead?