Why I am not a Arminian (Anymore)

Ladodgers6

Well-known member
Once upon a time I was a Classical Arminian, until after several months of reading, studying, and learning about Classical Calvinism (Doctrines of Grace), that I became a convinced Calvinist. Here are the reasons why I am not a Arminian.

1) Arminians have too lofty a view of the human condition and an inadequate understanding of God's Sovereign Love in Christ.

2) Arminianism & Semi-Pelagianism are like Brother & Sister

3) They believe & Teach Total Depravity, but then wipe away this teaching by the sinner's cooperation to decide his/her own fate. God is only a bystander in hopes that they make the right decision to be saved. So the sinner is never fully regenerated by the Holy Spirit, they're partially regenerated and placed in limbo between Life & Death where they decide to accept and go to heaven or reject it and go to hell. Which makes no sense, because who would ever want to got to hell?

4) Water down Grace; cheap Grace! Their Grace doesn't accomplish anything. It's up to the sinner to make the Cross effectual by THEIR activity, not by Christ's. Christ did cross the finish line, so it's up to the sinner to help Jesus finish what he could not.

So in essence their Gospel is no gospel at all. There's no hope, no assurance, no peace, no love, no satisfaction, no Salvation, because it's left up to the sinner!
 

Dizerner

Well-known member
I can't even begin to understand how you can Jesus define suffering hell for me as "not accomplishing anything" because I can reject it.

I can't even begin to understand how you could think pursuing sin "makes no sense" when the Bible says it gives a passing pleasure and deceives and beguiles.

I can't even begin to understand how you think love means I'm not allowed to reject it or that is somehow a "lofty view" of something made in God's image.

I can't even begin to understand how you think a grace that cost Jesus Christ everything he had is "cheap" because he doesn't force it upon me.

That just doesn't make any sense at all to me.

I'm sorry.
 

Ladodgers6

Well-known member
I can't even begin to understand how you can Jesus define suffering hell for me as "not accomplishing anything" because I can reject it.
I asked you to give me your belief on what the Gospel is? The Covenant of Redemption & Covenant of Grace are God's PROMISE to save his people form their sins! The Gospel is an announcement of what God has ALREADY ACCOMLISHED in Christ for his people (John 10). There's no addition or supplement needed here! This is why you cannot grasp and understand what was accomplished. You feel & think there's something left up to us to decide? Really? How many times did God leave it up to us to save ourselves? Read Ezekiel 36. Read about how many times we kept disobeying God, like the Israelites worshipping idol gods, when God freed them from bondage, a lot of them cried out that they wanted to go back to into bondage in Egypt. Over & over people failed God. If God did not step in to secure the Salvation of his people, we would all perish, plain & simple! Who God chooses is his business, not mine, or yours!

See Dizerner, if someone is really truly regenerated by the Holy Spirit, they will not reject Christ. Because they will have new hearts to believe, and new minds to understand the truth! Their eyes and ears are open to God, and they will hear his voice, and see Christ and follow him! This is Amazing Grace. But your Arminian so-called grace is no grace at all. Because the sinner possesses more power than God's Grace, do you understand now?
I can't even begin to understand how you could think pursuing sin "makes no sense" when the Bible says it gives a passing pleasure and deceives and beguiles.
This is exactly why you do not understand how Amazing God is, and how rich is his Grace & Mercy! I am still waiting for your account of the Gospel. Read and study more about Law & Gospel you need it.
I can't even begin to understand how you think love means I'm not allowed to reject it or that is somehow a "lofty view" of something made in God's image.
Romans 5: 7 For one will scarcely die for a righteous person—though perhaps for a good person one would dare even to die— 8 but God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God. 10 For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, now that we are reconciled, shall we be saved by his life. 11 More than that, we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.
I can't even begin to understand how you think a grace that cost Jesus Christ everything he had is "cheap" because he doesn't force it upon me.
Not God's Grace; so-called Arminian view of grace.
That just doesn't make any sense at all to me.

I'm sorry.
I'm sorry you don't know more about the Law & Gospel and they relate together like Sin & Grace! Your to focus on what you can never understand with Predestination. Even Calvin only wrote about a page on the subject. Instead let's discuss the Pure Gospel that Paul preached, I'm waiting your account of what the Gospel is from you. You should always be ready to share it with anyone.
 

Reformedguy

Well-known member
Once upon a time I was a Classical Arminian, until after several months of reading, studying, and learning about Classical Calvinism (Doctrines of Grace), that I became a convinced Calvinist. Here are the reasons why I am not a Arminian.

1) Arminians have too lofty a view of the human condition and an inadequate understanding of God's Sovereign Love in Christ.

2) Arminianism & Semi-Pelagianism are like Brother & Sister

3) They believe & Teach Total Depravity, but then wipe away this teaching by the sinner's cooperation to decide his/her own fate. God is only a bystander in hopes that they make the right decision to be saved. So the sinner is never fully regenerated by the Holy Spirit, they're partially regenerated and placed in limbo between Life & Death where they decide to accept and go to heaven or reject it and go to hell. Which makes no sense, because who would ever want to got to hell?

4) Water down Grace; cheap Grace! Their Grace doesn't accomplish anything. It's up to the sinner to make the Cross effectual by THEIR activity, not by Christ's. Christ did cross the finish line, so it's up to the sinner to help Jesus finish what he could not.

So in essence their Gospel is no gospel at all. There's no hope, no assurance, no peace, no love, no satisfaction, no Salvation, because it's left up to the sinner!
Well stated. Sounds similar to my experience. God bless

Watch your back. The provisionist long knives will be coming for you in here.
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
Once upon a time I was a Classical Arminian, until after several months of reading, studying, and learning about Classical Calvinism (Doctrines of Grace), that I became a convinced Calvinist. Here are the reasons why I am not a Arminian.

1) Arminians have too lofty a view of the human condition and an inadequate understanding of God's Sovereign Love in Christ.

2) Arminianism & Semi-Pelagianism are like Brother & Sister

3) They believe & Teach Total Depravity, but then wipe away this teaching by the sinner's cooperation to decide his/her own fate. God is only a bystander in hopes that they make the right decision to be saved. So the sinner is never fully regenerated by the Holy Spirit, they're partially regenerated and placed in limbo between Life & Death where they decide to accept and go to heaven or reject it and go to hell. Which makes no sense, because who would ever want to got to hell?

4) Water down Grace; cheap Grace! Their Grace doesn't accomplish anything. It's up to the sinner to make the Cross effectual by THEIR activity, not by Christ's. Christ did cross the finish line, so it's up to the sinner to help Jesus finish what he could not.

So in essence their Gospel is no gospel at all. There's no hope, no assurance, no peace, no love, no satisfaction, no Salvation, because it's left up to the sinner!
I would like to remind All that there is only one Gospel. There is no Arminian Gospel; just as there is no Calvinist Gospel. It's Christ's Gospel, or it's no Gospel at all. Arminianism and Calvinism are Soteriologies; not Gospels...

Sola Christus!
 
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eternomade

Well-known member
I would like to remind All that there is only one Gospel. There is no Arminian Gospel; just as there is no Calvinist Gospel. It's Christ's Gospel, or it's no Gospel at all. Arminianism and Calvinism are Soteriologies; not Gospels...

Sola Christus!
The gospel defines who God is. If one hates who God is according to this gospel, this is concerning...
 

preacher4truth

Well-known member
I can't even begin to understand how you can Jesus define suffering hell for me as "not accomplishing anything" because I can reject it.

I can't even begin to understand how you could think pursuing sin "makes no sense" when the Bible says it gives a passing pleasure and deceives and beguiles.

I can't even begin to understand how you think love means I'm not allowed to reject it or that is somehow a "lofty view" of something made in God's image.

I can't even begin to understand how you think a grace that cost Jesus Christ everything he had is "cheap" because he doesn't force it upon me.

That just doesn't make any sense at all to me.

I'm sorry.
Probably the most disingenuous post I've seen here of late.

Sorry.
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
Amen to that!
We've always believed mostly the same; and maybe you're part of the reason I believe the way I do...

Do you remember the Poster JStone? He said that Arminian Prevenient Grace turns a Totally Depraved person into a Semi-Pelagian; from there they can decide to choose or deny God. That was a lightbulb moment for me. Arminianism is Semi-Pelagianism, because Total Depravity is a Moot factor. Just as Polio is now a Moot factor...
 

preacher4truth

Well-known member
I would like to remind All that there is only one Gospel. There is no Arminian Gospel; just as there is no Calvinist Gospel. It's Christ's Gospel, or it's no Gospel at all. Arminianism and Calvinism are Soteriologies; not Gospels...

Sola Christus!
I agree to an extent, yet ones Soteriology completely effects what they say they believe about the Gospel. And frankly, some of what others teach in soteriology renders their gospel as false.
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
I agree to an extent, yet ones Soteriology completely effects what they say they believe about the Gospel. And frankly, some of what others teach in soteriology renders their gospel as false.
Me too. Anything Semi-Pelagian or Pelagian definitely effects the Gospel regarding God's Grace. Provisionism falls within those Categories...
 

preacher4truth

Well-known member
Me too. Anything Semi-Pelagian or Pelagian definitely effects the Gospel regarding God's Grace. Provisionism falls within those Categories...
Exactly. Statements of faith generally get the definition of Gospel right. Then when the actual teachings happen in said churches, one can determine if they truly hold to the one Gospel. For instance, the Galatians probably believed, or said they believed the Gospel, yet when it came down to it, they were found, in their teachings, to have denied it for "another gospel."
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
Exactly. Statements of faith generally get the definition of Gospel right. Then when the actual teachings happen in said churches, one can determine if they truly hold to the one Gospel. For instance, the Galatians probably believed, or said they believed the Gospel, yet when it came down to it, they were found, in their teachings, to have denied it for "another gospel."
Good point...
 
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