Why Jews will never accept Jesus

[GeneZ]

Because the separation from Adam caused cosmological effects... and we are not in paradise with God are we...
There is a separation of us because of the fall...no more as Adam did can man walk with God in the garden..

We do not have to be in blissful paradise to be made happy. You are confusing "happiness" for what will be eternal glory.

God gets the glory when He can take a believer stuck in the Devil's world AND MAKE HIM HAPPY!

You are falling for a lie that makes you into a fatalist. Give-up-itis. Someone who is being robbed and stolen from by an enemy who does not want to see God glorified!

Yes! This is a screwed up world!


What better evidence of God's transforming grace and superiority over the Devil? Than the Lord making a believer happy in the Devil's back yard!

I have told you these things so that My joy and delight may be in you,
and that your joy may be made full and complete and overflowing."
John 15:11


You prepare a table before me
in the presence of my enemies.
You anoint my head with oil;
my cup overflows."
Psalm 23:5​

You need good sound teaching to pull you out of the mud you have gotten yourself stuck in.

False teaching is like walking through deep mud! It wears you out as you are being determined to keep going on.


grace and peace........

 

[En Hakkore]

I answered your question, and you didn't even realize it. Messiah is DESCRIBED unavoidably, and you choose to play "Word games.

It is not 'word games' to interpret a text within its own literary and historical contexts. There is no mention whatsoever of a 'messiah' (Hebrew: משיח) in this section of Isaiah so to think it is describing such a figure is to read something into the text that isn't there.

Kind regards,
Jonathan

 

[En Hakkore]

How come many here all know Him? And, you're teaching us He is not real?

You are preaching to a choir of one between your ears.

We know the Truth.

We are being patient with you.

No idea what all ^^^ is supposed to convey. If I'm 'teaching' anything at all it's that the word 'messiah' (Hebrew: משיח) is not in the section of text cited (which anyone with access to a copy of the MT should already know) so one can hardly get bent out of shape when other interpreters don't accept a messianic reading. Your patience is not required. Do you have anything of substance to add to the conversation?

Kind regards,
Jonathan

 

[Bob Carabbio]

It is not 'word games' to interpret a text within its own literary and historical contexts. There is no mention whatsoever of a 'messiah' (Hebrew: משיח) in this section of Isaiah so to think it is describing such a figure is to read something into the text that isn't there.

Kind regards,
Jonathan

OR something that wouldn't be "Politically Correct" for a Jew to admit. Same mess Jewish "Scholars" made out of Isa 9:6 (which they refused even to translate) about the same Messiah.

 

[GeneZ]

No idea what all ^^^ is supposed to convey. If I'm 'teaching' anything at all it's that the word 'messiah' (Hebrew: משיח) is not in the section of text cited (which anyone with access to a copy of the MT should already know) so one can hardly get bent out of shape when other interpreters don't accept a messianic reading. Your patience is not required. Do you have anything of substance to add to the conversation?

Kind regards,
Jonathan

He is able to leap tall buildings with a single bound! He wears a cape... and has an aversion to Kryptonite!

That is Superman!

.... where do you see the word "Superman?" Its not there!

 

[En Hakkore]

OR something that wouldn't be "Politically Correct" for a Jew to admit. Same mess Jewish "Scholars" made out of Isa 9:6 (which they refused even to translate) about the same Messiah.

No mention of a 'messiah' (Hebrew: משיח) there either...

Kind regards,
Jonathan

 

[Bob Carabbio]

No mention of a 'messiah' (Hebrew: משיח) there either...

Kind regards,
Jonathan

Like I said, JEWS can't afford to ADMIT what's right in front of them in description, even though not in the EXACT word. Jewish "Theologians" completely missed their time of visitation.

 

[En Hakkore]

He is able to leap tall buildings with a single bound! He wears a cape... and has an aversion to Kryptonite!

That is Superman!

.... where do you see the word "Superman?" Its not there!

Reaction point just for the amusing analogy. Back to the subject at hand. Who defines what a 'messiah' (Hebrew: משיח) should be in the absence of specific mention? One could conceivably take any text and make it 'messianic'. There are no controls whatsoever on this methodology...

Kind regards,
Jonathan

 

[En Hakkore]

Like I said, JEWS can't afford to ADMIT what's right in front of them in description, even though not in the EXACT word. Jewish "Theologians" completely missed their time of visitation.

Jews have perfectly reasonable interpretations of these and other so-called 'messianic' texts... interpretations that are faithful to the literary and historical contexts in which they were written.

Kind regards,
Jonathan

 

[GeneZ]

OR something that wouldn't be "Politically Correct" for a Jew to admit. Same mess Jewish "Scholars" made out of Isa 9:6 (which they refused even to translate) about the same Messiah.

But the Lord will still show you this sign: The young woman (virgin) is pregnant
and will give birth to a son. She will name him Immanuel." Isaiah 7:14

Some rabbis claim that does not mean that a virgin would conceive. That it simply means a "young maiden" will conceive.

But, what they will not admit to.. It meant a young unmarried woman. Under Law she would have to be a virgin!

They withhold just enough information to claim the word does not say "virgin."

Or, they are just ignorant of the strictness of the life for the young unmarried woman under the Law of Moses.

 

[GeneZ]

Reaction point just for the amusing analogy. Back to the subject at hand. Who defines what a 'messiah' (Hebrew: משיח) should be in the absence of specific mention? One could conceivably take any text and make it 'messianic'. There are no controls whatsoever on this methodology...

Kind regards,
Jonathan

If it walks like a Messiah? behaves like a Messiah? Died like the Messiah?

You're just ducking the issue.


My very Jewish Aunt read before all the family Isaiah 53 at a family gathering. She was not aware of what she was shown to read. She then proclaimed before all that she had read a "Catholic Bible. " Then told the family that what she read is about Jesus, and we Jews do not believe in Jesus.

You should have seen her face after my sister told her what she read was translated from the Masoretic text... and was the Bible I was given at my Bar Mitzvah.

Keep denying if you wish. Its obvious if one does not have a closed and biased mind.

 

[En Hakkore]

But the Lord will still show you this sign: The young woman (virgin) is pregnant
and will give birth to a son. She will name him Immanuel." Isaiah 7:14

Some rabbis claim that does not mean that a virgin would conceive. That it simply means a "young maiden" will conceive.

But, what they will not admit to.. It meant a young unmarried woman. Under Law she would have to be a virgin!

They withhold just enough information to claim the word does not say "virgin."

Or, they are just ignorant of the strictness of the life for the young unmarried woman under the Law of Moses.

The problem, of course, is that Isa 7:16 plainly states that this boy would not be old enough to know right from wrong before Assyria laid Aram and Ephraim to waste... this has nothing to do with a messiah to be born seven hundred years in the future.

Kind regards,
Jonathan

 

[En Hakkore]

If it walks like a Messiah? behaves like a Messiah? Died like the Messiah?

You're just ducking the issue.

I'm not 'ducking' anything... there are no controls whatsoever on this approach to biblical texts. Anything could conceivably become a 'messianic' text... the words and the context actually matter to correct interpretation.

Kind regards,
Jonathan

 

[GeneZ]

The problem, of course, is that Isa 7:16 plainly states that this boy would not be old enough to know right from wrong before Assyria laid Aram and Ephraim to waste... this has nothing to do with a messiah to be born seven hundred years in the future.

Kind regards,
Jonathan

It was another double prophecy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_fulfillment

For one thing... the way you state it, it never happened in Isaiah's day. The reference was used to show how long it would take to turn around the horrible threat of destruction Israel was facing outside of its city walls. Meaning? (According to the age of this young child) it would not take long to see fulfilled.

So it was when suddenly Sennacherib's army was supernaturally killed by the Lord while in their sleep. The Lord God of Israel wiped out that Assyrian army while sleeping in their encampment... Instantly, in the night. it was the same Lord God of Israel who later made Himself to become as a man...


Who, being in very nature God,
did not consider equality with God something to be
used to his own advantage;
rather, he made himself nothing
by taking the very nature of a servant,
being made in human likeness.
And being found in appearance as a man,
he humbled himself
by becoming obedient to death—
even death on a cross!

Philippians 2:6-8


He reveals Himself to those who are His. That will confound you if you base your evaluation upon human ability. We all sensed it was supernatural when we became enlightened. We also know that those who have yet to believe would not believe us just because we say so.

 

[GeneZ]

I'm not 'ducking' anything... there are no controls whatsoever on this approach to biblical texts. Anything could conceivably become a 'messianic' text... the words and the context actually matter to correct interpretation.

Kind regards,
Jonathan

I did not know Jesus is real because I read these passages. I never read them before salvation took hold of me.

I only read them after I was changed. I was humbled to know that I was now able to believe them, not just wonder about them.

Its impossible to explain. But, if you get there, you will understand.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Jews have perfectly reasonable interpretations of these and other so-called 'messianic' texts... interpretations that are faithful to the literary and historical contexts in which they were written.

Kind regards,
Jonathan

Yup - All God's Chilluns gots "Reasonable interpretations" for what ever they want to believe - just look at the Catholics!!!

 

[Jewjitzu]

No, most Jews have rejected the Gospel message for 2,000 years because their eyes have been temporarily blinded. Romans 11:7-15, Romans 11:25
But those days are coming to an end due to outreaches like Rabbi Jonathan Bernis'.

This is interesting because the original Nazarenes, who believed Jesus a mere man, mortal, who perfected himself, rejected Paul as an apostate, and rejected his writings. Paul was a non Pharisee, a legend in his own mind, and no student of Gamliel.

 

[En Hakkore]

It was another double prophecy.

The concept of 'double prophecy' is purely ad hoc, developed precisely to add exegetically-creative interpretations on top of the contextually-sound interpretations of so-called 'messianic' texts in the Hebrew Bible... this 'explanation' is not the least bit convincing.

For one thing... the way you state it, it never happened in Isaiah's day.

It is unclear what you mean by this. Are you saying Assyria did not sweep through the ancient Levant at this time and subjugate these kingdoms?

The reference was used to show how long it would take to turn around the horrible threat of destruction Israel was facing outside of its city walls.

As an FYI it was the kingdom of Judah (not Israel) and its principal city Jerusalem that were threatened by the Syro-Ephraimite coalition. Furthermore, Ephraim and Israel are different names for the same kingdom.

Meaning? (According to the age of this young child) it would not take long to see fulfilled.

Great... hopefully we can agree that 'fulfillment' seven hundred years later could hardly have given anyone in the 8th century BCE assurance that the Syro-Ephraimite threat would pass.

Kind regards,
Jonathan

 

[GeneZ]

My soul prospering has nothing to do with this world and its needs and wants.
As you know, I don't read anything in OT or NT to indicate that he is interested in this world... rather, He wants us to die to it.

Since the Bible does not agree with what you say? I can not follow your way of thinking. Its personal and subjective.

 

[GeneZ]

The concept of 'double prophecy' is purely ad hoc, developed precisely to add exegetically-creative interpretations on top of the contextually-sound interpretations of so-called 'messianic' texts in the Hebrew Bible... this 'explanation' is not the least bit convincing.

Finding yourself able to believe in Jesus and having God's Spirit enter your body would solve your inability to comprehend beyond your natural limitations will solve what you can not at this present time know.

Its quite simple. Why argue with you? Did Moses argue with the Jews in the wilderness who could not get a grasp on God? No. God did not weep when they perished. All over the wilderness.