Year for a day?

[Icyspark]

Hey Icyspark!

Are you going to read my post to you???

Why do SDA’s reject the words of the Bible? #34​

Do you understand what I'm saying? It is quite unlike anything you've ever been taught as an Adventist. It is why Paul wrote this in Galatians 3:

19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made.

Do you know who the Seed is and what He accomplished?

I'm not Common Tater, so #34 wasn't written to me.

 

[CharismaticLady]

I'm not Common Tater, so #34 wasn't written to me.

Common Tater is in this thread, Year for a day? I'm talking about another thread:

Why do SDA’s reject the words of the Bible? #34​

Still waiting...

 

[Buzzard]

and Icy says

Hi Sherloc,


Apparently hoping no one will notice his misuse of Scripture as an affirmative for his upcoming further misuse he then quickly jumps into a biblical narrative which has zero to do with the second coming of Christ (Genesis 24). No inspired Bible author refers to Genesis 24 as any sort of relevance to Christ's return and I'll bet no trusted theologian from the time of the early church till now has ever attempted to read the second coming into this story (That's known as eisegesis).

I pray this helps.

and also; Icy informs us of this is what he believes

Hi CharismaticLady,

SDAs believe that in the millennium we will be in heaven.
Yes, this is what the Bible teaches.
SDAs will be looking at all the records of people and either agreeing with or disagreeing with God.
The Bible teaches that "someday we believers will judge the world?" 1Cor. 6:2
The job of the SDA is to vindicate God and the only way to do that is to keep the 10c’s but most importantly the 4th one.
Not quite. All redeemed believers will be judging the world and ultimately vindicating God's character. It's incongruous to jump from that to "the 10c's" and even more so to claim that the most important is the 4th one. According to James if you break one you've broken them all. Adventists merely draw attention to the one command which God says to remember which most seem deperate to forget. Ironic, huh?

But you're saying you were an Adventist and didn't know about the millennium in heaven?

God bless!

Icy says
no trusted theologian from the time of the early church till now
================================================
and
But you're saying you were an Adventist and didn't know about the millennium in heaven?


OK; Icy;
we have from these ---- trusted theologians ---- "quote / quote"
Pre Trib, Mid trib, Post trib
and that the millennium will be in heaven.
and
that the millennium will be on this earth
2nd coming is for the Jews only
etc. etc. etc.
hopefully you get the point

they are all over the map on these things
get 10 of them in a room and ask a question
and we will get 5 different answers

so which of these . trusted theologians "quote / quote"
do you trust,


Peter says of these things
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of,
that by the word of God the heavens were of old,
and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

6 Whereby the world that then was,
being overflowed with water, perished:

7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now,
by the same word are kept in store,
reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing,
that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years,
and a thousand years as one day.

9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise,
as some men count slackness;
but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish,
but that all should come to repentance.

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night;
in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise,
and the elements shall melt with fervent heat,
the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved,
what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God,
wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved,
and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise,
look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things,
be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace,
without spot, and blameless.

15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation;
even as our beloved brother Paul also
according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;

16 As also in all his epistles,
speaking in them of these things;
in which are some things hard to be understood,
which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest,
as they do also the other scriptures,
unto their own destruction.

so; when Paul wrote what Icy posted

Hi CharismaticLady,

1 Thessalonians 4:16-17​

For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.​

I pray this helps.

As also in all his epistles,​

speaking in them of these things;​

in which are some things hard to be understood,​

which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest,​

as they do also the other scriptures,​

unto their own destruction.​

so; Icy;
I ask, which of these unlearned and unstable
trusted theologians "quote / quote"
Who's Books; of the many written by these men
are you reading

Ecc. 12:11​

The words of the wise are as goads,​

and as nails fastened by the masters of assemblies,​

which are given from one shepherd.​

​

That would be Paul; the Wise Masterbuilder

​

12 And further, by these, my son, be admonished:​

of making many books there is no end;​

and much study is a weariness of the flesh.​

..
----------The Parables--------
the 1st sowers went forth just casting seed
and it fell wherever the wind carried it
wayside, stony places, among thorns, and good ground

the 2nd sower
Another parable put he forth unto them,
saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which
sowed good seed in his field:

But while men slept,
his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat,
and went his way.

Good seed = Tares

the good seed are the children of the kingdom;
but the tares are the children of the wicked one;

Rev.2:1​

​

Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write​

.​

and how thou canst not bear them which are evil:​

and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles,​

and are not, and hast found them liars:​

without an understanding of the Kingdom Parables
we will never understand The Visions of Daniel
nor John's Revelation

Now lets get back on subject
a Year for a Day

 

[CharismaticLady]

But you're saying you were an Adventist and didn't know about the millennium in heaven?

Why no scripture backup?

 

[Buzzard]

]]

Why no scripture backup?

ahh, I was quoting Icy
Icy says
no trusted theologian from the time of the early church till now
================================================
and
But you're saying you were an Adventist and didn't know about the millennium in heaven?

Icyspark said:
Hi CharismaticLady,

SDAs believe that in the millennium we will be in heaven.
Yes, this is what the Bible teaches.
SDAs will be looking at all the records of people and either agreeing with or disagreeing with God.
The Bible teaches that "someday we believers will judge the world?" 1Cor. 6:2
The job of the SDA is to vindicate God and the only way to do that is to keep the 10c’s but most importantly the 4th one.
Not quite. All redeemed believers will be judging the world and ultimately vindicating God's character. It's incongruous to jump from that to "the 10c's" and even more so to claim that the most important is the 4th one. According to James if you break one you've broken them all. Adventists merely draw attention to the one command which God says to remember which most seem deperate to forget. Ironic, huh?

But you're saying you were an Adventist and didn't know about the millennium in heaven?

God bless!
------------------end quote-----------------

 

[Buzzard]

------The Wedding----
at the wedding there will be
the Father and Mother, Christ and the "Best Men" = friends of the Bridegroom

John 3:29
He that hath the bride is the bridegroom:
but the friend of the bridegroom,
which standeth and heareth him,
rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice:
this my joy therefore is fulfilled.

then there will be

The Bride and all her Bridesmaids = the Daughters of Jerusalem
(Song of Solomon)

and the "The Guest" at the Wedding

Icy;
Christ does not marry his best men nor all the bridesmaids
and ""ONLY the Bride"" goes into the Bridal Chamber
and no one else ; no not one

another little hint recorded there

And Isaac went out to meditate in the field at the eventide:
and he lifted up his eyes, and saw,
and, behold, the camels were coming.

64 And Rebekah lifted up her eyes,
and when she saw Isaac, she lighted off the camel.

65 For she had said unto the servant,
What man is this that walketh in the field to meet us?
(Who is this man coming to meet us)
And the servant had said,
It is my master:
therefore she took a vail, and covered herself.

Gen.24:67
And Isaac brought her into his mother Sarah's tent,
and took Rebekah, and she became his wife;

​

And Isaac went out to meditate in the field at the eventide:​

and he lifted up his eyes, and saw,​

and, behold, the camels were coming.​

and here comes the Bride and her Bridesmaids

And Rebekah arose, and her damsels,
and they rode upon the camels,
and followed the man:
and the servant took Rebekah,
and went his way.​

riding on Dem Camels
any idea what day that was ?????

what would become - Pentecost

 

[CharismaticLady]

no trusted theologian from the time of the early church till now

Okay. I'll have to agree with Icy on that one.

and
But you're saying you were an Adventist and didn't know about the millennium in heaven?

Icyspark said:
Hi CharismaticLady,

SDAs believe that in the millennium we will be in heaven.
Yes, this is what the Bible teaches.
SDAs will be looking at all the records of people and either agreeing with or disagreeing with God.
The Bible teaches that "someday we believers will judge the world?" 1Cor. 6:2
The job of the SDA is to vindicate God and the only way to do that is to keep the 10c’s but most importantly the 4th one.
Not quite. All redeemed believers will be judging the world and ultimately vindicating God's character. It's incongruous to jump from that to "the 10c's" and even more so to claim that the most important is the 4th one. According to James if you break one you've broken them all. Adventists merely draw attention to the one command which God says to remember which most seem deperate to forget. Ironic, huh?

But you're saying you were an Adventist and didn't know about the millennium in heaven?

God bless!

As I recall in scripture, the New Jerusalem was just floating above the earth in our atmosphere, so in between heaven and earth for the Millennium, so both advocates are correct.

When Jesus touches earth and splits the Mt. of Olive in two, that is Old Testament, but is reporting of the second coming. Now which part - before or after the Millennium, I don't know. I was 23 when I left the SDA church, and the Holy Spirit has completely retrained my brain and wiped out all false doctrines and prepared it for His Truth.

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings Buzzard,

SDAs believe that in the millennium we will be in heaven.
Yes, this is what the Bible teaches.

Even though you are quoting someone else I will address this to you. The 1000 years will be upon the earth and there will be mortals upon the earth Isaiah 2:1-4, Daniel 2:35,44, Isaiah 65:17-22, Zechariah 14:16.

SDAs will be looking at all the records of people and either agreeing with or disagreeing with God.
The Bible teaches that "someday we believers will judge the world?" 1Cor. 6:2

What a miserable job to do during the 1000 years, examining the books of all the condemned. Rather the Bible teaches that the faithful will be kings and priests during the 1000 years, instructing the mortal population and bringing them into line with the ways of God so that t the end of the 1000 years there will be an abundant harvest of faithful who will receive immortality.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[CharismaticLady]

What a miserable job to do during the 1000 years, examining the books of all the condemned. Rather the Bible teaches that the faithful will be kings and priests during the 1000 years, instructing the mortal population and bringing them into line with the ways of God so that t the end of the 1000 years there will be an abundant harvest of faithful who will receive immortality.

That might be wishful thinking, unless you have a scripture that means that and isn't contradicted elsewhere.

From what I see, at the beginning of the Great Tribulation, no one but Jews (Revelation 12) will be saved during the first half of the seven years. All other non-Christians will have a strong delusion put upon them. The last half of the GT will be a lot of beheadings. This seven years is before the second coming and the Millennium.

2 Thes. 2:9-12
9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings CharismaticLady,

That might be wishful thinking, unless you have a scripture that means that and isn't contradicted elsewhere.

I consider Isaiah 2:1-4 and Revelation 20:6 is sufficient to establish this.

From what I see, at the beginning of the Great Tribulation, no one but Jews (Revelation 12) will be saved during the first half of the seven years. All other non-Christians will have a strong delusion put upon them. The last half of the GT will be a lot of beheadings. This seven years is before the second coming and the Millennium.

I do not accept the seven year concept and the other concepts that you mention above.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[CharismaticLady]

Greetings CharismaticLady,

I consider Isaiah 2:1-4 and Revelation 20:6 is sufficient to establish this.

I do not accept the seven year concept and the other concepts that you mention above.

Kind regards
Trevor

Isaiah 2:3
Many people shall come and say,
“Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord,
To the house of the God of Jacob;
He will teach us His ways,
And we shall walk in His paths.”
For out of Zion shall go forth the law,
And the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.

This has to be referring to the Old Covenant, not the end of the New Covenant.

Revelation 20:
Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Neither of these verses fit your belief that many will be saved during the 1000 years.

7 year:

How do you interpret:

Revelation 12:
14 But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent. 15 So the serpent spewed water out of his mouth like a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away by the flood. 16 But the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed up the flood which the dragon had spewed out of his mouth. 17 And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Revelation 13:
5 And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue for forty-two months.

How long a time do those make together?

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again CharismaticLady,

For out of Zion shall go forth the law,
And the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.

This has to be referring to the Old Covenant, not the end of the New Covenant.

When the nations become subject to the rule of Christ during the 1000 years they will taught the ways of God, and I understand "the law" is the "torah", the teachings and would encompass all the information to control the individual nations, but also the instructions necessary to educate the individuals in the ways of God. It will be elements of the new Covenant, not the Old Covenant (SDAs are stuck on the Old Covenant).

Revelation 20: Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Neither of these verses fit your belief that many will be saved during the 1000 years.

This is speaking about the resurrected faithful at the beginning of the 1000 years and those beheaded are an example of the suffering of the faithful during this last 2000 years. The faithful will become kings and priests over the mortals for the 1000 years and their work will be effective in bringing in a great harvest during the 1000 years. What a glorious result, and how drab and terrible and morbid is the SDA view of kings and priests.

Revelation 12: 14 But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent. 15 So the serpent spewed water out of his mouth like a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away by the flood. 16 But the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed up the flood which the dragon had spewed out of his mouth. 17 And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Revelation 13:5 And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue for forty-two months.
How long a time do those make together?

Yes both periods amount to 1260 days and on a day for a year concept, 1260 years. It is the period of time that the RCC had dominance and persecuted the faithful. There are two starting dates that characterise the rise of the Papacy, AD 529-533 in the time of Justinian, and AD 608-610 in the time of Phocas. The corresponding times that resulted in the decline of the Papacy and its ability to persecute the faithful were AD 1789-1793 with the French Revolution and AD 1868-1870 the reduction of the Papal Power and its loss of its temporal power. Even some SDA literature agree with the above, although they have a poor and incorrect exposition of some of the elements of Daniel 7, Revelation 12 and 13.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[CharismaticLady]

It will be elements of the new Covenant, not the Old Covenant (SDAs are stuck on the Old Covenant).

You do know that the New Covenant is not "the law." It is a covenant of the Holy Spirit's Grace which is the power of God.

The faithful will become kings and priests over the mortals for the 1000 years and their work will be effective in bringing in a great harvest during the 1000 years.

Where is what you believe written?

es both periods amount to 1260 days and on a day for a year concept, 1260 years. It is the period of time that the RCC had dominance and persecuted the faithful. There are two starting dates that characterise the rise of the Papacy, AD 529-533 in the time of Justinian, and AD 608-610 in the time of Phocas. The corresponding times that resulted in the decline of the Papacy and its ability to persecute the faithful were AD 1789-1793 with the French Revolution and AD 1868-1870 the reduction of the Papal Power and its loss of its temporal power. Even some SDA literature agree with the above, although they have a poor and incorrect exposition of some of the elements of Daniel 7, Revelation 12 and 13.

A year for a day is only valid where there are no other specifics. And even then it could mean 1000 years not one year, as in Hosea 6:1-3. (2000 years, and 1000 year millennium regarding the nation of Israel.) But when the 3.5 years is written three ways, then you CANNOT take the year for a day prophetic time and apply it to only one of the three specifics. They all represent the same amount of time. Therefore, 1260 years is not viable. It is 3.5 years.

Another error was the 2,300 mornings and evenings of Daniel 8. Those specifics are the same as during Creation week, and are 24 hour days. It comes to 6.3 years, the exact time from 67 BC to 60 BC of the first Jewish revolt when Antiochus IV Epiphanes defiled the temple and died in 64 BC in the middle of the "week."

These dates have nothing to do with the Roman Catholic denomination. Look at the 7 letters to the 7 churches (ages). All the visions that Daniel saw had to do with Israel, not the Church or any era of the Church.

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again CharismaticLady,

You do know that the New Covenant is not "the law."

Iconsider that "the law" has a wider range of meaning than what you are suggesting.
Psalm 1:2 (KJV): But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
Although the term Torah can be used of the law, or of the Pentateuch, or even (at a later date) of the whole OT, its significance here is the most fundamental one. Basically, the word Torah means “instruction”; specifically, it is the instruction which God gives to mankind as a guide for life. Thus it may include that which is technically law, but it also includes other more general parts of God’s revelation.

Jesus uses the term "law" in a wider sense as he is quoting Psalm 82:6:
John 10:34 (KJV): Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?

the New Covenant ..... is a covenant of the Holy Spirit's Grace which is the power of God.

I consider the New Covenant includes the Gospel of the Kingdom and the Name of Jesus Christ Acts 8:5-6,12 and this includes the Promises to Abraham. I consider that your definition "Holy Spirit Grace" is too narrow a definition and may reflect your particular bias. The following uses the phrase "the power of God", and this speaks about salvation through a belief of the Gospel:
Romans 1:16–17 (KJV):16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

A year for a day is only valid where there are no other specifics. And even then it could mean 1000 years not one year, as in Hosea 6:1-3. (2000 years, and 1000 year millennium regarding the nation of Israel.) But when the 3.5 years is written three ways, then you CANNOT take the year for a day prophetic time and apply it to only one of the three specifics. They all represent the same amount of time. Therefore, 1260 years is not viable. It is 3.5 years.

I suggest that Daniel 7's little horn is the Papacy and it did not have dominance over the faithful for only 3 1/2 days, but for 1260 years.

Another error was the 2,300 mornings and evenings of Daniel 8. Those specifics are the same as during Creation week, and are 24 hour days. It comes to 6.3 years, the exact time from 67 BC to 60 BC of the first Jewish revolt when Antiochus IV Epiphanes defiled the temple and died in 64 BC in the middle of the "week."

I consider that the prophecy of the 2300 days did have a shadow fulfillment under Antiochus, but I believe a major fulfillment of Daniel 8 is from Alexander the Great in BC 334-333 slaying the Persian Ram, to AD 1967 when the Jews retook Jerusalem.

These dates have nothing to do with the Roman Catholic denomination.

The little horn of the fourth Roman Beast in Daniel 7 is the Papacy.

Look at the 7 letters to the 7 churches (ages).

There may be a depiction of 7 ages, but the 7 Congregations were real Congregations at the time when John wrote concerning them.

All the visions that Daniel saw had to do with Israel, not the Church or any era of the Church.

Daniel 2 and Daniel 7 and other prophetical features have reference from the Time of Daniel until the return of Jesus and the establishment of the Kingdom.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[TrevorL]

I suggest that Daniel 7's little horn is the Papacy and it did not have dominance over the faithful for only 3 1/2 days, but for 1260 years.

Whoops, I should have stated 3 1/2 years.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[CharismaticLady]

Iconsider that "the law" has a wider range of meaning than what you are suggesting.
Psalm 1:2 (KJV): But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
Although the term Torah can be used of the law, or of the Pentateuch, or even (at a later date) of the whole OT, its significance here is the most fundamental one. Basically, the word Torah means “instruction”; specifically, it is the instruction which God gives to mankind as a guide for life. Thus it may include that which is technically law, but it also includes other more general parts of God’s revelation.

Jesus uses the term "law" in a wider sense as he is quoting Psalm 82:6:
John 10:34 (KJV): Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?

There is the eternal law of God. But only the perfect could keep it. And ever since Adam sinned, man inherited from that time forward a sin nature of the devil. Therefore, God made laws that a person with a sin nature could keep by the letter of the law, the Ten Commandments. It was designed to show man his sin. But it could make no man perfect enough to keep the eternal laws of God though the Jews were told about them. It was in place UNTIL the promised one, Jesus, could come and take away the sin nature of all who would believe on Him, and He in turn would fill us with His Spirit, not only taking away our sin, but taking away the desires and nature of a sinner, turning us into children of God.

I consider the New Covenant includes the Gospel of the Kingdom and the Name of Jesus Christ Acts 8:5-6,12 and this includes the Promises to Abraham. I consider that your definition "Holy Spirit Grace" is too narrow a definition and may reflect your particular bias. The following uses the phrase "the power of God", and this speaks about salvation through a belief of the Gospel:
Romans 1:16–17 (KJV):16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

I agree.

"Holy Spirit Grace" I define as Grace is the divine power of God - revealed in us by the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

BTW, do you know what "faith to faith" means?

I suggest that Daniel 7's little horn is the Papacy and it did not have dominance over the faithful for only 3 1/2 days, but for 1260 years.

I do not see 1260 days mentioned in Daniel 7. Only "time, times and half a time." Seeing as it is not in days, it cannot be years. It is 3.5 literal years.

I see the Antichrist or Beast as a political figure, but the false prophet could be the pope as it will be a religious figure. Though he also could be Muslim.

I consider that the prophecy of the 2300 days did have a shadow fulfillment under Antiochus, but I believe a major fulfillment of Daniel 8 is from Alexander the Great in BC 334-333 slaying the Persian Ram, to AD 1967 when the Jews retook Jerusalem.

That is certainly a more feasible interpretation than SDA's use having to do with the popes and using the prophecy of Daniel 9 as the starting point. I can't remember what dates they use, but they end up in the 1700's having to do with a particular pope.

Though 2,300 mornings and evenings is 6.3 literal years, just like in Creation Week. If Daniel had just left it as 2,300 DAYS, then you could say it was prophetic year for a day as in Daniel 9 to Palm Sunday.

(But don't forget 1000 years for a day in Hosea 6:1-3)

The little horn of the fourth Roman Beast in Daniel 7 is the Papacy.

I believe Daniel 7 are end times as you do. The little horn will be the Antichrist. Whether it is the papacy I don't know. What I do know it he will fight against Israel and Christians (Israel's spiritual offspring). Did you know who the little horn will be fighting against?

There may be a depiction of 7 ages, but the 7 Congregations were real Congregations at the time when John wrote concerning them.

Yes, they were a three-fold prophecy.

congregations
type of Christians
church ages.

I'm a Philadelphian. What are you?

Daniel 2 and Daniel 7 and other prophetical features have reference from the Time of Daniel until the return of Jesus and the establishment of the Kingdom.

I agree.

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again CharismaticLady,

It was in place UNTIL the promised one, Jesus, could come and take away the sin nature of all who would believe on Him, and He in turn would fill us with His Spirit, not only taking away our sin, but taking away the desires and nature of a sinner, turning us into children of God.

I can agree with your statements in general, but I consider that we still have our sin nature, and the battle against sin is still a current experience.

I agree. "Holy Spirit Grace" I define as Grace is the divine power of God - revealed in us by the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

I do not accept that we are today subject to "baptism of the Holy Spirit". I believe in salvation through an affectionate belief of the gospel and this leads to water baptism in identification with the death and resurrection of Christ.

BTW, do you know what "faith to faith" means?

I have an opinion.

I do not see 1260 days mentioned in Daniel 7. Only "time, times and half a time." Seeing as it is not in days, it cannot be years. It is 3.5 literal years.

3.5 years is 1260 days.

I see the Antichrist or Beast as a political figure, but the false prophet could be the pope as it will be a religious figure. Though he also could be Muslim.

The little horn of Daniel 7 is the Papacy and the Antichrist. The little horn is not the fourth beast, but only a portion of the fourth beast.

If Daniel had just left it as 2,300 DAYS, then you could say it was prophetic year for a day

The usage of evening/morning still represents a day, and the language is relevant to the daily sacrifice.

Did you know who the little horn will be fighting against?

Antichrist, against Christ.

I'm a Philadelphian. What are you?

I attempt to absorb the warnings and encouragement of all the seven letters.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[CharismaticLady]

I can agree with your statements in general, but I consider that we still have our sin nature, and the battle against sin is still a current experience.

What we have is free will, but Jesus cleansed our nature and took away our sin. That is being born-again. It is our nature that is born again, consisting of our spirit and soul. It is when Christ writes the eternal laws on our conscience. 1 John 3:21-24. We are like Adam was when he was first created before he allowed the devil to pollute him with willful sin. What we also have that Adam didn't have was Christ's Spirit on the inside of us, empowering us to never give in to temptation. God has already given that way of escape. It is called partaking of the divine nature of God. We couldn't do that with an active sin nature. (The body is just a shell that cannot sin on its own. It is like a puppet. That is why it was left to still die, but our nature was made immortal. Once the body dies and is resurrected like our nature, then we will receive a new born-again body that is immortal.) The cleansing of that permanent stain of sin on our nature was how he defeated the devil in 1 John 3:5-9 and WHY Jesus died for us. 1 John 3:5. What you wrestle with is not sins against the moral laws such as stealing and murder, but immature fruit of the Spirit. When we grow to maturity in all those we will never struggle. 2 Peter 1:2-11. Memorize those verses and change your thinking.

What you are reciting "we will always sin" is one of the defeatist doctrine of demons created some time after the death of the last apostle. Probably by the worldly church (without the Spirit), and you know which denomination that was. It was continued even into the Reformation, until John Wesley came on the scene preaching holiness. Read Revelation 3:1-6 to see that what Jesus says of that doctrine. "You have a name that you are alive, but you are dead." Then 200 years into that Sardis church era he writes of those like John Wesley who fought that dead doctrine. "But you have a few even in Sardis who have not defiled their garments and they shall walk with Me in White, for they are worthy." Trevor, be one of the overcomers of that false doctrine. For whatsoever a man thinks in his heart, so is he. Stand in victory, not defeat and watch the change happen.

I do not accept that we are today subject to "baptism of the Holy Spirit". I believe in salvation through an affectionate belief of the gospel and this leads to water baptism in identification with the death and resurrection of Christ.

If you know anything about "covenants" and that nothing inside a covenant ends until the covenant itself ends, you can open yourself up to the power of God. I used to be a cessationist also growing up, but again, that is a doctrine that came along with the other defeatist doctrine of demons. I couldn't have received the baptism of the Holy Spirit in 1977 if it didn't exist. What a change happened, from defeat, to victory. I even felt a heavy weight lift out of me when my nature was cleansed and the weight of sin in my nature was taken away. Don't you know that Romans 8:9 is the baptism of the Holy Spirit? How do you expect to walk in the Spirit if He cannot come inside of you? Baptism in water does not replace the true baptism of fire from Jesus. They are both part of our New Covenant of the Spirit called the ministry of the Spirit in 2 Corinthians 3:6-11. And Trevor, I also received all the gifts of the Spirit, except two. Don't be fooled yet again by those pesky demons that want you to remain powerless.

3.5 years is 1260 days.

Yes, and so does 42 months, but Daniel did not want us to make that mistake of prophetic year for a day for those prophecies of an exact 24 hour period of time. And especially regarding the end times that have to do with the length of the Great Tribulation in the last days when all national Israel will be saved.

The little horn of Daniel 7 is the Papacy and the Antichrist. The little horn is not the fourth beast, but only a portion of the fourth beast.

Time will tell. I don't see anything happening regarding the papacy right now, do you? That is an important question. With Revelation 8 possibly being fulfilled in April of 2029 according to NASA, minus 7 years is NOW. Therefore the Antichrist may have already been revealed, for if 2022 is the starting date of the Great Tribulation then the Antichrist has already been revealed.

The usage of evening/morning still represents a day, and the language is relevant to the daily sacrifice.

And exactly how long did creation week happen? 6 years? Are you not aware of the prophetic rule of "first usage"? This is one of those cases. And it has to do with Greece and Israel.

Antichrist, against Christ.

I mean literally. Jesus will not have returned during the Great Tribulation, but after it is finished. But you are right if you mean His people.

I attempt to absorb the warnings and encouragement of all the seven letters.

Good answer. But you still need to absorb the warning to Sardis...

 

[CharismaticLady]

I have an opinion.

Don't forget to give it... I'm interested. (faith to faith).

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again CharismaticLady,

We are like Adam was when he was first created

No, I believe that we still possess the fallen human nature. Our victory over sin is substantial through Christ, but not complete.

I also received all the gifts of the Spirit, except two.

I do not accept that we have the gifts of the Holy Spirit.

Yes, and so does 42 months, but Daniel did not want us to make that mistake of prophetic year for a day for those prophecies of an exact 24 hour period of time. And especially regarding the end times that have to do with the length of the Great Tribulation in the last days when all national Israel will be saved.

No, I consider that Daniel 7:25 is speaking about the 1260 years that the Papacy would have the ascendancy over the faithful.

Don't forget to give it... I'm interested. (faith to faith).

Initial suggestion, from immature faith to mature faith, like the stages in Abraham's development.

Kind regards
Trevor
faithful.