You Might Just Be A Semi-Deist If…

Chalcedon said:
You are funny . If you remember as a Calvinist I defended Arminians when they were falsely accused because they are brethren in Christ .
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So what?
Once again, all you're doing is boasting about how "great" you are.
This forum is not about discussing YOU.

Chalcedon said:
I’ve quoted Arminius 100’s of times over the years correcting Calvinists misrepresentation of them .
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Completely irrelevant to what I said.
But we get it... You think you're really great.
I mean, you've told us this about 100 times already, and that's just today, right?
 
Chalcedon said:
I never sought your approval as a Calvinist nor his and I surely do not now .
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Doesn't matter. What matters is what you are. I think you are anti-Christian. Your statement above along with other contemptuous statements you've made toward the body of Christ the last few months confirms that for me.

Chalcedon said:
Jesus approves me. That’s all that counts .
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Maybe He does, but I doubt it.
 
Sketo said:
What happens if God stops exerting power over you... are you a power in and of yourself?

Is God necessary for your very existance every moment of your existence?

God is the only refrence point that matters.

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We are never free from God. But God creates our libertarian freedom and thus we need God in order to have it.
 
christ_undivided said:
A caged animal can hurt themselves and many things in the cage with them.
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Apples to Oranges...

Can the "caged animal" move within the cage apart from God's determination to exert the power necessary for that animal to "hurt many things" in that cage.

Again God is the only reference point that matters.

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Kampioen said:
We are never free from God. But God creates our libertarian freedom and thus we need God in order to have it.
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As God is the only reference point that matters...

And God is necessary for the continued living, moving, and being of all things created (Acts 17:28)...

Then "libertarian from" the necessary reference point, God, is a logical contradiction.

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Sketo said:
Apples to Oranges...

Can the "caged animal" move within the cage apart from God's determination to exert the power necessary for that animal to "hurt many things" in that cage.

Again God is the only reference point that matters.

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Letting the animal out of the cage is different than letting the animal languish in the cage.
 
Sketo said:
As God is the only reference point that matters...

And God is necessary for the continued living, moving, and being of all things created (Acts 17:28)...

Then "libertarian from" the necessary reference point, God, is a logical contradiction.
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I disagree. God is not bound with no other choice than to give us no other choice. Such a limitation would mean God is bound by another reference point/deism other than Himself.
 
Kampioen said:
I disagree. God is not bound with no other choice than to give us no other choice.
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I agree, God is free to give you any choice God Determines. God has already freely determined the choices he gave you before you existed.

That is why your next statement does not follow...

Kampioen said:
Such a limitation would mean God is bound by another reference point/deism other than Himself.
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God was not bound or determined by an external reference point when he freely determined your choices.

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christ_undivided said:
Letting the animal out of the cage is different than letting the animal languish in the cage.
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Again God is the only refrence point that matters.

Biblically God can not disconnect from upholding your very existence moment by moment and you still continue to live, move, and have your being...

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Sketo said:
I agree, God is free to give you any choice God Determines. God has already freely determined the choices he gave you before you existed.

That is why your next statement does not follow...


God was not bound or determined by an external reference point when he freely determined your choices.
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So God was not bound ie could have chosen differently ie libertarianism? ... If God didn't have to be bound then why was He unable to give us unbound libertarian choice?
 
Kampioen said:
So God was not bound...
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Correct God is not bound to continue your existing...

Kampioen said:
ie could have chosen differently
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Correct God is free to determine you no longer exist...

Kampioen said:
ie libertarianism?
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No this does not follow. Nothing can exist or continue to exist apart from God Determining its next moment of existence.

This does not mean God is bound to continue your existence. God is free to choose that you no longer continue to exist...

Kampioen said:
... If God didn't have to be bound then...
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God is free to withdraw his sustaining power at any moment.

The part that you can not grasp is the fact that if God determines to stop exerting power over you, you don't continue to exist by an independent power, in fact you no longer exist at all.

You assume that if God stopped exerting power over you, you could continue to exist and be doing something else but this is not the case.

You exist therefore God controls you.

Kampioen said:
...why was He unable to give us unbound libertarian choice?
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Because, according to scripture, apart from God there is no other determinative power in existence that can continue your living, moving, and being.

It's a logical impossibility that is contrary to scripture.

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christ_undivided said:
God also creates reference points.
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I agree and you can be free from those other refrence points that dont matter...

...this does not mean you can be free from God as the only reference point that matters in the context of this discussion.

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Sketo said:
I agree and you can be free from those other refrence points that dont matter...

...this does not mean you can be free from God as the only reference point that matters in the context of this discussion.

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If God creates something bidding upon other portions of His creation, then that creation operates as intended. We can agree on this.
 
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