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As most of you are aware, we had a crash to forums and were down for over two days a while back. We did have to do an upgrade to the vbulletin software to fix the forums and that has created changes, VB no longer provide the hybrid or threaded forums. There are some issues/changes to the forums we are not able to fix or change. Also note the link address change, please let friends and posters know of the changed link to the forums. For now this is the only link available, https://forums.carm.org/vb5/ but if clicking on forum on carm.org homepage it will now send you to this link. (edited to add https: now working.

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Diane S
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Were any of you there on New Years eve, in 1981 with Chuck Smith

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  • #61
    Originally posted by Markk View Post

    I am not. LDS theology demands that they, "the church," actually has a part is the salvation of a person. True salvation cannot occur in a LDS construct without ordinances preformed by worthy men with with certain authorities. It has even been taught that JS must approve all those who will enter into true salvation (eternal life/exaltation).

    God saves only those that believe in Him,,,even the BoM teaches that...

    Ether 4:18
    18 Therefore, repent all ye ends of the earth, and come unto me, and believe in my gospel, and be baptized in my name; for he that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned; and signs shall follow them that believe in my name.

    As far as those never has a chance to hear the Gospel, God will know their hearts and is a righteous judge...he created every person knowing their hearts, whether by foreknowledge or predestination. There is a lot written on this, if you want to do a study on it let me know and we can go through it on this forum...it is peaceful here


    CFR that you will perform ordinances for records that are not available. I have never heard it phrased that way before. I was taught folks will have a opportunity to hear the LDS gospel my missionaries after the Veil.

    Hi Markk, will you give me the reference that shows in the Calvary Chapel Doctrine that people who lived and died without knowing Christ still can have Salvation, and will not be in Hell?

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    • #62
      Originally posted by CTR-Lloyd View Post
      Hi Markk, will you give me the reference that shows in the Calvary Chapel Doctrine that people who lived and died without knowing Christ still can have Salvation, and will not be in Hell?
      That's like asking the CC to produce an official statement that rape is wrong. Now you are a Mormon, and believe that everybody who ever lived must be baptized by Mormon authority or they are lost. Christians believe this:

      "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love, having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will, to the praise of the glory of His grace, by which He made us accepted in the Beloved. In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace which He made to abound toward us in all wisdom and prudence, having made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His good pleasure which He purposed in Himself, that in the dispensation of the fullness of the times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven and which are on earth-in Him. In Him also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestined according to the purpose of Him who works all things according to the counsel of His will... (Ephesians 1:3-11)."

      Sadly, following Joseph Smith would be a pretty good indicator that one has not been called.

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      • #63
        Originally posted by Catherine Aurelia View Post

        That's like asking the CC to produce an official statement that rape is wrong. Now you are a Mormon, and believe that everybody who ever lived must be baptized by Mormon authority or they are lost. Christians believe this:

        "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love, having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will, to the praise of the glory of His grace, by which He made us accepted in the Beloved. In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace which He made to abound toward us in all wisdom and prudence, having made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His good pleasure which He purposed in Himself, that in the dispensation of the fullness of the times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven and which are on earth-in Him. In Him also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestined according to the purpose of Him who works all things according to the counsel of His will... (Ephesians 1:3-11)."

        Sadly, following Joseph Smith would be a pretty good indicator that one has not been called.
        Thatís fine, Iím not worried about me. Apparently Iím blinded to the demons of Mormonism trapped in a sex cult. Following a Different Jesus.

        The question is what about those who never knew Christ?

        Are they just predestined for Hell? That was Godís plan for them?

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        • #64
          Originally posted by CTR-Lloyd View Post
          Hi Markk, will you give me the reference that shows in the Calvary Chapel Doctrine that people who lived and died without knowing Christ still can have Salvation, and will not be in Hell?
          I did Romans 1 is a insight they would start with. God is righteous God, and He will judge Righteously. I am no sure you understand what CC doctrine is, it is the Bible.

          If you really want to know what CC teaches and how they interpret scripture, you would need to visit each CC individually. If you want to know what Chuck believed read "Calvary Distinctive's"...and "why Grace Changes Everything."

          Start here for a CC view from Pastor Greg Laurie...Ill see if I can find something else.

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kNIODLKIuc
          But there has been a great difficulty in getting anything into the heads of this generation. It has been like splitting hemlock knots with a corn-dodger for a wedge, and a pumpkin for a beetle. Even the Saints are slow to understand. Joseph Smith...

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          • #65
            Originally posted by Markk View Post

            I did Romans 1 is a insight they would start with. God is righteous God, and He will judge Righteously. I am no sure you understand what CC doctrine is, it is the Bible.

            If you really want to know what CC teaches and how they interpret scripture, you would need to visit each CC individually. If you want to know what Chuck believed read "Calvary Distinctive's"...and "why Grace Changes Everything."

            Start here for a CC view from Pastor Greg Laurie...Ill see if I can find something else.

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kNIODLKIuc
            Thanks, Iíll check it out. I agree God will Judge righteously.

            Does that mean you disavow Christian Teachings that Most or all of the people who didnít have evangelizing or the Bible are in Hell?

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