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Infallible interpretation of verses

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  • ramcam2
    replied
    Originally posted by Howie View Post
    The big question with respect to your claim is, how can the fallible leadership of the RCC "infallibly" define anything?
    you keep chiding catholics for the official interpretation of verses and now when presented with a list, you cannot agree.

    and, when asked for your particular church's list, you say many things (evade and deny).

    don't you realize your double standard in this thread?

    you can just say your church have no list and I will understand.

    Leave a comment:


  • Algo
    replied
    • Augustine (354-430): God alone swears securely, because He alone is infallible. NPNF1: Vol. VIII, St. Augustin on the Psalms, Psalm 89, 4.
      Latin text: Deus solus securus jurat, quia falli non potest. See In Psalmum LXXXVIII Enarratio, Sermo I, PL 37:1122.

    Leave a comment:


  • ramcam2
    replied
    Originally posted by jeremiah1five View Post

    I don't post what my church believes. I post what I believe the Lord has taught me from God's Word.
    why can't you just admit you do not have such a list, ok?

    I will understand, thanks.

    Leave a comment:


  • jeremiah1five
    replied
    Originally posted by ramcam2 View Post

    I am not asking you to refute/comment on the interpretations.

    what I am asking is this....

    For the non-Catholics, can you list the verses officially interpreted by your church?
    I don't post what my church believes. I post what I believe the Lord has taught me from God's Word.

    Leave a comment:


  • Nondenom40
    replied
    Originally posted by Atemi View Post

    1. Where did you plagiarize this from?
    2. The Magisterium of your sect did not provide this list.
    3. You just made this up or it is just your lonely opinion...no different than 1 billion other Roman Catholic opinions.

    Why are you trying to pull the wool over the eyes of the posters here? I am surprised not one Catholic has had the backbone to correct you by now.

    ...
    You're talking about the same person that repeatedly cites pseudo Clementine literature to prop up his false doctrine. Gets caught, and posts it again. He just hopes no one actually checks sources.

    Leave a comment:


  • Geralt_De_Sales
    replied
    Originally posted by tester View Post
    what Scripture interpreting Scripture leads to this?

    "Furthermore, we declare, we proclaim, we define that it is absolutely necessary for salvation that every human creature be subject to the Roman Pontiff."
    Matthew 16:18 and John 13:20

    Leave a comment:


  • Howie
    replied
    Originally posted by ramcam2 View Post
    these are the fifteen verses infallibly interpreted by the Catholic Church.

    (1) Romans 5:12 ("By one man sin entered into this world") refers to original sin.

    (2) I Corinthians 4:7 ("What hast thou that thou hast not received") proves divine grace to be a sheer gift of God.

    (3) Isaiah 7:14 ("Behold a virgin shall be with child, etc." [sic]) must be regarded as prophetic of a Redeemer to come.

    (4) Genesis 3:15 ("I will put enmity between thee and the woman"), and Luke 1:28 ("Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with thee") contain at least implicitly the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception of the Blessed Virgin Mary.

    (5) Philippians 2:6 ("Christ Jesus, being in the form of God, did not prize being equal with God, etc." [sic]) refers to the existence of the person of Christ as the Second Divine Person of the Holy Trinity before He became man in the Incarnation.

    (6) Matthew 16:16-19 ("Thou art Peter and upon this rock I will build my Church") and John 21:15-17 ("Feed my lambs . . . Feed my sheep") contain the doctrine of Papal Supremacy.

    (7) Luke 22:32 ("I have prayed for thee that thy faith fail not and do thou . . . confirm thy brethren") must be interpreted as providing a basis for the doctrine of Papal Infallibility.

    (8) John 3:5 ("Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God") shows the necessity of the Sacrament of Baptism with water.

    (9) Luke 22:19 and I Corinthians 11:24, recording our Lord's words at the Last Supper: "Do this for a commemoration of me", indicate the institution of the Sacrament of Holy Orders, the apostles being ordained as priests to offer the Sacrifice of the Mass or Holy Eucharist.

    (10) Matthew 26:26-28; Mark 14:22-24; Luke 22:19-20; I Corinthians 11:23-29, demand the literal and not merely a symbolical interpretation of our Lord's words at the Last Supper: "This is my body," "This is my blood," so that we must hold they teach the Real Presence of Christ in the Holy Eucharist or Blessed Sacrament.

    (11) Malachi 1:11 ("From the rising of the sun even to the going down, my name is great among the Gentiles; and in every place there is sacrifice") is a prediction of the Sacrifice of the Mass.

    (12) John 6:54-57 ("unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink His blood") does not require Communion in both kinds instead of under the form of bread only.

    (13) Matthew 18:18 ("Whatsoever you shall loose upon earth shall be loosed also in heaven") and John 20:23 ("Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them") prove the Sacrament of Penance and the power of priests to forgive sins in confession.

    (14) James 5:14 ("Is any man sick . . . let him bring in the priests of the Church . . . anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord") teaches the existence of the Sacrament of Extreme Unction.

    (15) Deuteronomy 6:5 and Matthew 22:37 ("Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with thy whole heart and souls and mind and strength") do not require a love so spiritual and out of this world as to exclude all human emotional feelings and desires based on devotional sentiments.


    For the non-Catholics, can you list the verses officially interpreted by your church?
    The big question with respect to your claim is, how can the fallible leadership of the RCC "infallibly" define anything?

    Leave a comment:


  • Atemi
    replied
    Originally posted by Calsgal View Post
    These lists are guesses and nothing more...Rome has never disclosed their "infallibly defined scripture" My guess is that way it is subject to change
    The Roman Masters WANT individual RC apologists to make up their own lists. That way the liars in Rome always have plausible deniability.

    They have all their little minions running all over spreading their opinions as if they are facts, and not one of them can ever indict the Masters. One of the prerequisites for being a faithful Catholic is the willingness to lie for Holy Mother Church. Such is a virtue in their religion, as we see so often here.

    A great system that the devil himself probably devised.

    ...

    Leave a comment:


  • Howie
    replied
    Originally posted by Curious Joe View Post

    I believe in God, the Father almighty, (Mt 5 :45)
    Creator of heaven and earth, (Gen 1: 1; Rom 1: 20)
    And in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord, (Mt 3: 17; Phil 2: 12)
    Who was conceived by the Holy Spirit, (Lk 1: 35)
    born of the Virgin Mary, (Lk 2: 7)
    suffered under Pontius Pilate, (Jn 19: 16)
    was crucified, died, and was buried. (Jn 19: 29 – 42)
    He descended into hell; (1 Pet 3: 19 – 20)
    on the third day He rose again from the dead, (Mt 28:1-10; Jn 20:11-18)
    He ascended in heaven, (Lk 24: 51)
    and sits at the right hand of God, (Heb 1: 3)
    the Father almighty; (Mk 14: 36)
    from thence He shall come again (Mt 16: 27; Acts 10: 39
    to judge the living and the dead. (1 Cor 15: 51)
    I believe in the Holy Spirit, (Jn 14: 15 – 20; Acts 1: 7 – 8)
    the Holy Catholic Church, (Mt 16: 18 – 19; Eph 5: 26-27; Col 1: 24)
    the communion of Saints, (Mt 28: 19 – 20; 2 Cor 11: 13; 1 Cor 15: 33)
    the forgiveness of sins, (Jn 20: 22 – 23)
    the resurrection of the body, (1Cor 15: 51 – 54; 1 Thes 4: 13 – 18)
    and life everlasting. (1 Jn 5: 20)
    Where does your list of verses claim to be infallible? I don't see the claim.

    Leave a comment:


  • Howie
    replied
    Originally posted by tester View Post

    nope: not saying that we do not have an official list:

    What I am saying is that you do not have an official list of infallibly interpreted verses (the title of your thread)
    That's correct.

    There is no list of infallibly defined scripture verses in RCism that I've ever seen.

    Leave a comment:


  • Atemi
    replied
    Originally posted by tester View Post
    seems to be different than RamCam2's list
    Yup. So is it Joe telling us the truth, or is it Ramcam?

    Leave a comment:


  • Atemi
    replied
    Originally posted by tester View Post
    there is/are certain Catholic poster(s) here who seemed to have archived quite a collection of my past posts.
    Some of the past posts mention my age, and my position and responsibilities in my church.

    As my name , address, and my picture is located on my Church's website it would take only a few moments to connect the dots from my previous posts and identify me, my wife, and where I live.
    Many devout RC posters online are hate filled and would probably want to do harm to posters who refute their sect. I have had my own stalkers.

    NEVER give your personal information on this site as any psycho RC poster can run with that and try to "defend" their Holy Mother Church.

    Beware. Many of them ARE that unhinged and unstable.

    ...

    Leave a comment:


  • Atemi
    replied
    Originally posted by ramcam2 View Post
    I hope you have a good reason for saying I lied in what I posted.
    You stole the material and posted it as if it were your own.

    Please.

    Leave a comment:


  • Calsgal
    replied
    Originally posted by ramcam2 View Post

    wait, wait, wait.....

    first, show me your church's list first, then I will show you my source and you can show me your source, too.

    and do not point me to your 'we believe section' of your website (you have yet to give the website) for I can point you also to our catechism

    What you believe is different than verses infallibly defunded by the magisterium ...

    Leave a comment:


  • Atemi
    replied
    Originally posted by ramcam2 View Post
    well, in the footnotes of the catechism are not only bible verses but also council decrees, papal encyclicals, ecf writings, etc....
    Your catechism is a fallible and editable document.

    A footnote in this catechism can just as easily be eliminated and erased in the next catechism.

    ...

    Leave a comment:

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