Announcement

Collapse

Message to all users:

https://carm.org/forum-rules

Super Member Subscription
https://carm.org/carm-super-members-banner-ad-signup

As most of you are aware, we had a crash to forums and were down for over two days a while back. We did have to do an upgrade to the vbulletin software to fix the forums and that has created changes, VB no longer provide the hybrid or threaded forums. There are some issues/changes to the forums we are not able to fix or change. Also note the link address change, please let friends and posters know of the changed link to the forums. For now this is the only link available, https://forums.carm.org/vb5/ but if clicking on forum on carm.org homepage it will now send you to this link. (edited to add https: now working.

Again, we are working through some of the posting and viewing issues to learn how to post with the changes, you will have to check and test the different features, icons that have changed. You may also want to go to profile settings,since many of the notifications, information in profile, also to update/edit your avatar by clicking on avatar space, pull down arrow next to login for user settings.

Edit to add "How to read forums, to make it easier."
Pull down arrow next to login name upper right select profile, or user settings when page opens to profile,select link in tab that says Account. Then select/choose options, go down to Conversation Detail Options, Select Display mode Posts, NOT Activity, that selection of Posts will make the pages of discussions go to last post on last page rather than out of order that happens if you choose activity threads. Then be sure to go to bottom and select SAVE Changes in your profile options. You can then follow discussions by going through the pages, to the last page having latest responses. Then click on the other links Privacy, Notifications, to select viewing options,the forums get easier if you open all the tabs or links in your profile, user settings and select options. To join Super Member, pull down arrow next to login name, select User Settings and then click on tab/link at top that says Subscriptions.

Thank you for your patience and God Bless.

Diane S
https://carm.org/forum-rules
See more
See less

one person two natures

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • one person two natures

    I believe each of these statements are true
    do Catholics agree with each statement?


    Jesus Christ is one person; not two.
    Jesus Christ has two natures; not one.

    One of His natures is Divine.
    One of His natures is human.

    Everything that is true about the Divine nature is true about the person of Jesus Christ.
    Everything that is true about the human nature is true about the person of Jesus Christ.

    NOT everything that is true about the Divine nature is true about the human nature of Jesus Christ.
    NOT everything that is true about the human nature is true about the Divine nature of Jesus Christ.

    NOT everything that is true about the person of Jesus Christ is true about the human nature of Jesus Christ.
    NOT everything that is true about the person of Jesus Christ is true about the Divine nature of Jesus Christ.
    One of the ekklēsia

  • #2
    two persons ...

    Originally posted by tester View Post

    Jesus descendant of Abraham from the line of David, son of Mary, Son of Man, the Lamb of God, the last Adam died on the Cross: killed by a few Roman soldiers.
    His life ceased

    The Christ, the Supreme Creator of all, the Second Person of the Trinity, the Eternal, the Logos, the Sustainer of ALL things, the Great I AM, the Lord God, "who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty." did not die on the Cross
    His life never ceases
    Though the godless poured poison in to your veins, your heart still beats with love for Christ,
    O bishop Theodore, martyred father, who now raise your prayers before the Throne of God.

    [Kontakion of Blessed Theodore (Byzantine-Ruthenian usage)]

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Curious Joe View Post
      two persons ...
      How so? God cannot die. Jesus is God, Jesus is man....Jesus is one person, not two.
      ~~~My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My Father's hand~~~

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by 4Him View Post

        How so? God cannot die. Jesus is God, Jesus is man....Jesus is one person, not two.
        Yes, Jesus is God, and yes, Jesus is man.

        Yes, Jesus is one person, not two.

        Jesus suffered death
        Though the godless poured poison in to your veins, your heart still beats with love for Christ,
        O bishop Theodore, martyred father, who now raise your prayers before the Throne of God.

        [Kontakion of Blessed Theodore (Byzantine-Ruthenian usage)]

        Comment


        • #5
          and following in the long tradition of not answer the question from the OP
          Originally posted by Curious Joe View Post
          two persons ...
          One of the ekklēsia

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Curious Joe View Post

            Yes, Jesus is God, and yes, Jesus is man.

            Yes, Jesus is one person, not two.

            Jesus suffered death
            this is the OP:
            do Catholics agree with each statement?

            Jesus Christ is one person; not two.
            Jesus Christ has two natures; not one.

            One of His natures is Divine.
            One of His natures is human.

            Everything that is true about the Divine nature is true about the person of Jesus Christ.
            Everything that is true about the human nature is true about the person of Jesus Christ.

            NOT everything that is true about the Divine nature is true about the human nature of Jesus Christ.
            NOT everything that is true about the human nature is true about the Divine nature of Jesus Christ.

            NOT everything that is true about the person of Jesus Christ is true about the human nature of Jesus Christ.
            NOT everything that is true about the person of Jesus Christ is true about the Divine nature of Jesus Christ.
            Last edited by tester; 07-12-18, 10:19 AM.
            One of the ekklēsia

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by tester View Post
              I believe each of these statements are true
              do Catholics agree with each statement?


              Jesus Christ is one person; not two.
              Jesus Christ has two natures; not one.

              One of His natures is Divine.
              One of His natures is human.

              Everything that is true about the Divine nature is true about the person of Jesus Christ.
              Everything that is true about the human nature is true about the person of Jesus Christ.

              NOT everything that is true about the Divine nature is true about the human nature of Jesus Christ.
              NOT everything that is true about the human nature is true about the Divine nature of Jesus Christ.

              NOT everything that is true about the person of Jesus Christ is true about the human nature of Jesus Christ.
              NOT everything that is true about the person of Jesus Christ is true about the Divine nature of Jesus Christ.
              Another OP Catholics will not answer.

              If he had meant to cast you away he would have done so long ago. If he wanted reasons for rejecting you he had reasons from all eternity, for he knew what you would be. No sin in you has been a surprise to him. C.H. Spurgeon

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Curious Joe View Post

                Yes, Jesus is God, and yes, Jesus is man.

                Yes, Jesus is one person, not two.

                Jesus suffered death
                How can God die and remain God?

                If he had meant to cast you away he would have done so long ago. If he wanted reasons for rejecting you he had reasons from all eternity, for he knew what you would be. No sin in you has been a surprise to him. C.H. Spurgeon

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Howie View Post
                  How can God die and remain God?
                  Because the divine nature is hypostatically united with the human soul which separated from the body (that is death)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Mark Rome View Post

                    Because the divine nature is hypostatically united with the human soul which separated from the body (that is death)
                    "We believe that Jesus Christ was God incarnate. We also believe that Jesus Christ died on the cross. If we say that God died on the cross, and if by that we mean that the divine nature perished, we have stepped over the edge into serious heresy.
                    In fact, two such heresies related to this problem arose in the early centuries of the church: theopassianism and patripassianism.
                    The first of these, theopassianism, teaches that God Himself suffered death on the cross.
                    Patripassianism indicates that the Father suffered vicariously through the suffering of His Son.
                    Both of these heresies were roundly rejected by the church for the very reason that they categorically deny the very character and nature of God, including His immutability. There is no change in the substantive nature or character of God at any time.

                    God not only created the universe, He sustains it by the very power of His being. As Paul said, “In Him we live and move and have our being” Acts 17:28. If the being of God ceased for one second, the universe would disappear. It would pass out of existence, because nothing can exist apart from the sustaining power of God. If God dies, everything dies with Him. Obviously, then, God could not have perished on the cross.

                    Some say, “It was the second person of the Trinity Who died.” That would be a mutation within the very being of God, because when we look at the Trinity we say that the three are one in essence, and that though there are personal distinctions among the persons of the Godhead, those distinctions are not essential in the sense that they are differences in being. Death is something that would involve a change in one’s being.

                    We should shrink in horror from the idea that God actually died on the cross. The atonement was made by the human nature of Christ. Somehow people tend to think that this lessens the dignity or the value of the substitutionary act, as if we were somehow implicitly denying the deity of Christ. God forbid. It’s the God-man Who dies, but death is something that is experienced only by the human nature, because the divine nature isn’t capable of experiencing death."

                    This excerpt is taken from The Truth of the Cross by R.C. Sproul.
                    One of the ekklēsia

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Curious Joe View Post
                      two persons ...
                      I didn't realize this is what Catholics believe.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by tester View Post

                        "We believe that Jesus Christ was God incarnate. We also believe that Jesus Christ died on the cross. If we say that God died on the cross, and if by that we mean that the divine nature perished, we have stepped over the edge into serious heresy.
                        In fact, two such heresies related to this problem arose in the early centuries of the church: theopassianism and patripassianism.
                        The first of these, theopassianism, teaches that God Himself suffered death on the cross.
                        Patripassianism indicates that the Father suffered vicariously through the suffering of His Son.
                        Both of these heresies were roundly rejected by the church for the very reason that they categorically deny the very character and nature of God, including His immutability. There is no change in the substantive nature or character of God at any time.

                        God not only created the universe, He sustains it by the very power of His being. As Paul said, “In Him we live and move and have our being” Acts 17:28. If the being of God ceased for one second, the universe would disappear. It would pass out of existence, because nothing can exist apart from the sustaining power of God. If God dies, everything dies with Him. Obviously, then, God could not have perished on the cross.

                        Some say, “It was the second person of the Trinity Who died.” That would be a mutation within the very being of God, because when we look at the Trinity we say that the three are one in essence, and that though there are personal distinctions among the persons of the Godhead, those distinctions are not essential in the sense that they are differences in being. Death is something that would involve a change in one’s being.

                        We should shrink in horror from the idea that God actually died on the cross. The atonement was made by the human nature of Christ. Somehow people tend to think that this lessens the dignity or the value of the substitutionary act, as if we were somehow implicitly denying the deity of Christ. God forbid. It’s the God-man Who dies, but death is something that is experienced only by the human nature, because the divine nature isn’t capable of experiencing death."

                        This excerpt is taken from The Truth of the Cross by R.C. Sproul.
                        What is death?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Mark Rome View Post

                          Because the divine nature is hypostatically united with the human soul which separated from the body (that is death)
                          So only the human soul and human the body were affected by His death?

                          Sounds like you're dividing Christ into pieces.
                          If he had meant to cast you away he would have done so long ago. If he wanted reasons for rejecting you he had reasons from all eternity, for he knew what you would be. No sin in you has been a surprise to him. C.H. Spurgeon

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Mark Rome View Post

                            What is death?
                            The cessation of life
                            One of the ekklēsia

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by tester View Post

                              this is the OP:
                              do Catholics agree with each statement?

                              Jesus Christ is one person; not two.
                              Jesus Christ has two natures; not one.

                              One of His natures is Divine.
                              One of His natures is human.

                              Everything that is true about the Divine nature is true about the person of Jesus Christ.
                              Everything that is true about the human nature is true about the person of Jesus Christ.

                              NOT everything that is true about the Divine nature is true about the human nature of Jesus Christ.
                              NOT everything that is true about the human nature is true about the Divine nature of Jesus Christ.

                              NOT everything that is true about the person of Jesus Christ is true about the human nature of Jesus Christ.
                              NOT everything that is true about the person of Jesus Christ is true about the Divine nature of Jesus Christ.
                              OK thanks. Which statements do you agree with?
                              Though the godless poured poison in to your veins, your heart still beats with love for Christ,
                              O bishop Theodore, martyred father, who now raise your prayers before the Throne of God.

                              [Kontakion of Blessed Theodore (Byzantine-Ruthenian usage)]

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X