Announcement

Collapse

Message to all users:

https://carm.org/forum-rules

Super Member Subscription
https://carm.org/carm-super-members-banner-ad-signup

As most of you are aware, we had a crash to forums and were down for over two days a while back. We did have to do an upgrade to the vbulletin software to fix the forums and that has created changes, VB no longer provide the hybrid or threaded forums. There are some issues/changes to the forums we are not able to fix or change. Also note the link address change, please let friends and posters know of the changed link to the forums. For now this is the only link available, https://forums.carm.org/vb5/ but if clicking on forum on carm.org homepage it will now send you to this link. (edited to add https: now working.

Again, we are working through some of the posting and viewing issues to learn how to post with the changes, you will have to check and test the different features, icons that have changed. You may also want to go to profile settings,since many of the notifications, information in profile, also to update/edit your avatar by clicking on avatar space, pull down arrow next to login for user settings.

Edit to add "How to read forums, to make it easier."
Pull down arrow next to login name upper right select profile, or user settings when page opens to profile,select link in tab that says Account. Then select/choose options, go down to Conversation Detail Options, Select Display mode Posts, NOT Activity, that selection of Posts will make the pages of discussions go to last post on last page rather than out of order that happens if you choose activity threads. Then be sure to go to bottom and select SAVE Changes in your profile options. You can then follow discussions by going through the pages, to the last page having latest responses. Then click on the other links Privacy, Notifications, to select viewing options,the forums get easier if you open all the tabs or links in your profile, user settings and select options. To join Super Member, pull down arrow next to login name, select User Settings and then click on tab/link at top that says Subscriptions.

Thank you for your patience and God Bless.

Diane S
https://carm.org/forum-rules
See more
See less

Works based salvation?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Philomena View Post

    What He had just named "rock"!

    Blessings
    Peter was not a rock, that was a name ,a person .. what was the THIS?

    "Christ, you see, built his Church not on a man but on Peter's confession. What is Peter's confession? 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.' There's the rock for you, there's the foundation, there's where the Church has been built, which the gates of the underworld cannot conquer. — John Rotelle, O.S.A., Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine , © 1993 New City Press, Sermons, Vol III/6, Sermon 229P.1, p. 327
    Have I now become your enemy because I tell you the truth ? Gal 4:16

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Only_3 View Post

      Seventh Day Adventurists tell us that it stands for Roman Orothodox Catholic Kingdom.
      I would not know about that since I am not a Seventh Day Adventist

      God bless you,

      SeventhDay.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Calsgal View Post

        Peter was not a rock, that was a name ,a person .. what was the THIS?

        "Christ, you see, built his Church not on a man but on Peter's confession. What is Peter's confession? 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.' There's the rock for you, there's the foundation, there's where the Church has been built, which the gates of the underworld cannot conquer. — John Rotelle, O.S.A., Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine , © 1993 New City Press, Sermons, Vol III/6, Sermon 229P.1, p. 327
        Was Augustine teaching and speaking from the Chair of Peter?

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Only_3 View Post
          Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. (Mark 16:16)

          Calsgal, you got any more law of Moses up your sleeve to counter what Jesus said and taught?

          LOL I was responding to another RC Poster that said this


          Originally posted by ramcam2 View Post
          No, but both are done as a sign of the covenant with god.
          Catholics do have a reading comprehension issue I think..... All I was doing was comparing his comment to presbyterian teaching ...I did not say I believed that or agreed or disagreed ..

          But lets look at your scripture proof text

          Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. (Mark 16:16)

          Notice belief comes before baptism.. ... and it does not say that those not baptized will be condemned ...but that those that do not believe will be condemned..


          Have I now become your enemy because I tell you the truth ? Gal 4:16

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Theophilos View Post

            I think there is basic misunderstanding of the what the John 10:26-28 means. Here is an explanation from St. John Chrysostom, whose native language was the koine Greek of the New Testament:

            But I told you, and you believe not, because you are not of My sheep. (John 10:26)
            For I on My part have fulfilled all that it behooved a Shepherd to do, and if you follow Me not, it is not because I am not a Shepherd, but because you are not My sheep. (paraphrase)

            For My sheep hear My voice, and follow Me; and I give unto them eternal life ; neither can any man pluck them out of My hand. The Father, which gave them Me, is greater than all, and no man is able to pluck them out of My Father's hand. I and the Father are One. (John 10:27-30)
            Observe how in renouncing He excites them to follow Him. You hear Me not, He says, for neither are you sheep, but they who follow, these are of the flock. This He said, that they might strive to become sheep. Then by mentioning what they should obtain, He makes these men jealous, so as to rouse them, and cause them to desire such things.
            EDIT

            The sheep are the people who follow Christ and hear his voice. They are sheep because they follow and keep following. That is what makes them sheep.
            Only His sheep CAN hear His voice
            Last edited by 4Him; 02-09-19, 08:52 PM.
            Have I now become your enemy because I tell you the truth ? Gal 4:16

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Only_3 View Post

              Was Augustine teaching and speaking from the Chair of Peter?
              LOL LOL LOL ....He was a Doctor of the church ...one of those Early Church Fathers you guys love to quote

              Basil of Seleucia, Oratio 25:

              'You are Christ, Son of the living God.'...Now Christ called this confession a rock, and he named the one who confessed it 'Peter,' perceiving the appellation which was suitable to the author of this confession. For this is the solemn rock of religion, this the basis of salvation, this the wall of faith and the foundation of truth: 'For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Christ Jesus.' To whom be glory and power forever. — Oratio XXV.4, M.P.G., Vol. 85, Col. 296-297.
              Have I now become your enemy because I tell you the truth ? Gal 4:16

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Calsgal View Post

                LOL I was responding to another RC Poster that said this



                Catholics do have a reading comprehension issue I think..... All I was doing was comparing his comment to presbyterian teaching ...I did not say I believed that or agreed or disagreed ..

                But lets look at your scripture proof text

                Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. (Mark 16:16)

                Notice belief comes before baptism.. ... and it does not say that those not baptized will be condemned ...but that those that do not believe will be condemned..

                Why are you trying to take baptism out of that scripture? Have you been baptized? If not, why not?

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Calsgal View Post

                  LOL LOL LOL ....He was a Doctor of the church ...one of those Early Church Fathers you guys love to quote

                  Basil of Seleucia, Oratio 25:

                  'You are Christ, Son of the living God.'...Now Christ called this confession a rock, and he named the one who confessed it 'Peter,' perceiving the appellation which was suitable to the author of this confession. For this is the solemn rock of religion, this the basis of salvation, this the wall of faith and the foundation of truth: 'For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Christ Jesus.' To whom be glory and power forever. — Oratio XXV.4, M.P.G., Vol. 85, Col. 296-297.
                  So now you admit that Christ is not the Rock?

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Only_3 View Post

                    Why are you trying to take baptism out of that scripture? Have you been baptized? If not, why not?
                    Lets just agree that you are unable to understand what I am pointing out ... reading comprehension is not your strong suit
                    Have I now become your enemy because I tell you the truth ? Gal 4:16

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Only_3 View Post

                      So now you admit that Christ is not the Rock?
                      Did I say that? Ever?? We are back to your reading comprehension
                      Have I now become your enemy because I tell you the truth ? Gal 4:16

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Only_3 View Post

                        It sounds to me that a false God compelled you to leave the Catholic Church. What did God say to you?
                        Leave it to a Catholic to call God a false God.
                        ~~~My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My Father's hand~~~

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Theophilos View Post

                          I think there is basic misunderstanding of the what the John 10:26-28 means. Here is an explanation from St. John Chrysostom, whose native language was the koine Greek of the New Testament:

                          But I told you, and you believe not, because you are not of My sheep. (John 10:26)
                          For I on My part have fulfilled all that it behooved a Shepherd to do, and if you follow Me not, it is not because I am not a Shepherd, but because you are not My sheep. (paraphrase)

                          For My sheep hear My voice, and follow Me; and I give unto them eternal life ; neither can any man pluck them out of My hand. The Father, which gave them Me, is greater than all, and no man is able to pluck them out of My Father's hand. I and the Father are One. (John 10:27-30)
                          Observe how in renouncing He excites them to follow Him. You hear Me not, He says, for neither are you sheep, but they who follow, these are of the flock. This He said, that they might strive to become sheep. Then by mentioning what they should obtain, He makes these men jealous, so as to rouse them, and cause them to desire such things.
                          http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/240161.htm

                          The sheep are the people who follow Christ and hear his voice. They are sheep because they follow and keep following. That is what makes them sheep.
                          Wrong. They follow BECAUSE they are sheep. The Good Shepherd will leave the flock to find one lost sheep. His sheep shall never perish. You quoting words of men will never negate His word.
                          ~~~My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My Father's hand~~~

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Theophilos View Post
                            I think there is basic misunderstanding of the what the John 10:26-28 means. Here is an explanation from St. John Chrysostom, whose native language was the koine Greek of the New Testament:

                            But I told you, and you believe not, because you are not of My sheep. (John 10:26)
                            For I on My part have fulfilled all that it behooved a Shepherd to do, and if you follow Me not, it is not because I am not a Shepherd, but because you are not My sheep. (paraphrase)

                            For My sheep hear My voice, and follow Me; and I give unto them eternal life ; neither can any man pluck them out of My hand. The Father, which gave them Me, is greater than all, and no man is able to pluck them out of My Father's hand. I and the Father are One. (John 10:27-30)
                            Observe how in renouncing He excites them to follow Him. You hear Me not, He says, for neither are you sheep, but they who follow, these are of the flock. This He said, that they might strive to become sheep. Then by mentioning what they should obtain, He makes these men jealous, so as to rouse them, and cause them to desire such things.
                            Edit per mod

                            The sheep are the people who follow Christ and hear his voice. They are sheep because they follow and keep following. That is what makes them sheep.
                            yes, believers are, they follow Christ. catholics follow the RCC, it isn't Christ.

                            "I was changed, redeemed, forgiven before the blood was dry.

                            The debt I owed was canceled in the twinkling of an eye."

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Calsgal View Post

                              Only His sheep CAN hear His voice
                              Only his sheep work at understanding and following Christ's words. The Pharisees heard Christ's words but they did not learn from them.

                              Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me.
                              Matthew 16:24

                              Taking up a cross sounds like work to me, but that is what Christ says we must do to follow his words. Disciple literally means "one who learns" in Greek.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by mica View Post
                                yes, believers are, they follow Christ. catholics follow the RCC, it isn't Christ.
                                . . .I exhort the elders among you to tend the flock of God that is in your charge, exercising the oversight, not under compulsion but willingly, as God would have you do it—not for sordid gain but eagerly. 1 Peter 5:1-2

                                The Greek word translated as "elder" is still used for priests the Greek Church. The Greek word for bishop literally means "overseer".

                                Have confidence in your leaders and submit to their authority, because they keep watch over you as those who must give an account. Hebrews 13:17

                                The bishops and priests still serve as pastors (= shepherd in Latin) who tend Christ's flock.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X