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Works based salvation?

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  • Originally posted by rldlolbeding View Post

    Scripture alone doesn't say that works do not play a part in salvation. In fact is says just the opposite.
    What works are necessary for our salvation?
    Eph 5:11 And do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them NASB

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Nondenom40 View Post

      What works are necessary for our salvation?
      And how much work is necessary to be "worthy" enough for Heaven.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Angels_Sing View Post

        And how much work is necessary to be "worthy" enough for Heaven.
        Either God is creating us for his glory or not?

        What did God save us for?

        God had no intention of creation the old Adam for his glory but to contrast the first Adam with the second Adam.

        The first Adam was of the earth which is temporal and the first Adam was subject to death and when the second Adam came the first Adam died with Christ in his death. Jesus died and rose out of death and is the second Adam and all humanity rise out of death with Christ in God's orderly arrangement.

        The Adam God wants is created in God's image through the express image of Christ and God is in Christ who the new Adam belongs to.

        There is nothing the old Adam could do to succor his salvation and God is not saving the old Adam whose purpose for existence was to contrast the new Adam in Christ.

        The old Adam is dead and Christ did not come to save the old Adam but to put him away because according to the Law the soul that sins shall die.

        Jesus came to make a new spiritual humanity and has delivered the old humanity out of death as a new spiritual creation.

        1Co 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

        1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
        Jesus succored our salvation and those who have been quickened out of death as a new spiritual creation must work out their salvation that Jesus has succored by the faith of Good spiritually at work in him which is by God's grace.

        God bless you,

        SeventhDay

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Angels_Sing View Post

          And how much work is necessary to be "worthy" enough for Heaven.
          They won't tell us. They bark about it all day long but never seem to be able to offer specifics.
          Eph 5:11 And do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them NASB

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Calsgal View Post

            LOL I was responding to another RC Poster that said this



            Catholics do have a reading comprehension issue I think..... All I was doing was comparing his comment to presbyterian teaching ...I did not say I believed that or agreed or disagreed ..

            But lets look at your scripture proof text

            Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. (Mark 16:16)

            Notice belief comes before baptism.. ... and it does not say that those not baptized will be condemned ...but that those that do not believe will be condemned..

            Here is Catholic Church teaching...

            Council of Trent: “We are therefore said to be justified by faith, because faith is the beginning of human salvation, the foundation and root of all justification, without which it is impossible to please God…we are therefore said to be justified gratuitously, because none of those things that precede justification, whether faith or works, merit the grace of justification,” (Denzinger, p. 252).

            Comment


            • Originally posted by ramcam2 View Post

              Here is Catholic Church teaching...

              Council of Trent: “We are therefore said to be justified by faith, because faith is the beginning of human salvation, the foundation and root of all justification, without which it is impossible to please God…we are therefore said to be justified gratuitously, because none of those things that precede justification, whether faith or works, merit the grace of justification,” (Denzinger, p. 252).
              That is not what the scripture I posted says is it ?
              Have I now become your enemy because I tell you the truth ? Gal 4:16

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Calsgal View Post

                That is not what the scripture I posted says is it ?
                March 16:16.

                if you believe in the one true church and is baptized, you will be saved, it you do not believe in the one true church, you will be condemn.


                8. Also well known is the Catholic teaching that no one can be saved outside the Catholic Church. Eternal salvation cannot be obtained by those who oppose the authority and statements of the same Church and are stubbornly separated from the unity of the Church and also from the successor of Peter, the Roman Pontiff, to whom "the custody of the vineyard has been committed by the Savior."[4] The words of Christ are clear enough: "If he refuses to listen even to the Church, let him be to you a Gentile and a tax collector;"[5] "He who hears you hears me, and he who rejects you, rejects me, and he who rejects me, rejects him who sent me;"[6] "He who does not believe will be condemned;"[7] "He who does not believe is already condemned;"[8] "He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters."[9] The Apostle Paul says that such persons are "perverted and self-condemned;"[10] the Prince of the Apostles calls them "false teachers . . . who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master. . . bringing upon themselves swift destruction."[11]...on promotion of false doctrine encyclical of pope Pius ix, 1863

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                • Originally posted by ramcam2 View Post

                  March 16:16.

                  if you believe in the one true church and is baptized, you will be saved, it you do not believe in the one true church, you will be condemn.


                  8. Also well known is the Catholic teaching that no one can be saved outside the Catholic Church. Eternal salvation cannot be obtained by those who oppose the authority and statements of the same Church and are stubbornly separated from the unity of the Church and also from the successor of Peter, the Roman Pontiff, to whom "the custody of the vineyard has been committed by the Savior."[4] The words of Christ are clear enough: "If he refuses to listen even to the Church, let him be to you a Gentile and a tax collector;"[5] "He who hears you hears me, and he who rejects you, rejects me, and he who rejects me, rejects him who sent me;"[6] "He who does not believe will be condemned;"[7] "He who does not believe is already condemned;"[8] "He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters."[9] The Apostle Paul says that such persons are "perverted and self-condemned;"[10] the Prince of the Apostles calls them "false teachers . . . who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master. . . bringing upon themselves swift destruction."[11]...on promotion of false doctrine encyclical of pope Pius ix, 1863
                  assuming you meant Mark16:16
                  which translation are you using?

                  "Also well known is the Catholic teaching that no one can be saved outside the Catholic Church. Eternal salvation cannot be obtained by those who oppose the authority and statements of the same Church and are stubbornly separated from the unity of the Church and also from the successor of Peter, the Roman Pontiff,"

                  your beloved Catholic Church no longer teaches that.
                  One of the ekklēsia

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by 4Him View Post
                    So, does the Catholic church teach we are saved by faith and works, which is a works based salvation? Yay or nay?
                    We are saved by faith and works which is a faith AND works based salvation. No one is a Sola Works advocate around here.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Nondenom40 View Post

                      What works are necessary for our salvation?
                      Our part in repentance. God does not repent for us.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by 4Him View Post
                        What part do works play in salvation? Are your works salvific? If so, how?
                        Our part in repentance plays a major role in our salvation. Salvation is a gift but it is a conditional gift that is given on condition that we repent.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Angels_Sing View Post
                          And how much work is necessary to be "worthy" enough for Heaven.
                          Our part in repenting and deciding to believe in Christ.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by UnionofGrace&Nature View Post
                            Our part in repenting and deciding to believe in Christ.
                            Is repenting and faith your own work or rather the work of God?

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by UnionofGrace&Nature View Post
                              Our part in repentance plays a major role in our salvation. Salvation is a gift but it is a conditional gift that is given on condition that we repent.
                              So what you are saying is salvation hinges on the believer and how good they were at death?

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Angels_Sing View Post

                                So what you are saying is salvation hinges on the believer and how good they were at death?
                                Its funny how catholics will swear they don't believe in works based salvation. Then another comes along and says thats exactly what they believe! No wonder they are confused.
                                Eph 5:11 And do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them NASB

                                Comment

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