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Catholics believe in the Eucharist / Lord's Supper as a means of grace

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  • Originally posted by Atemi View Post

    So Paul did not say that, and Paul did not say eating Eucharists dispense "supernatural life,"
    But Jesus did and St. Paul believes Him:

    John 6:54
    New International Version
    Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.

    John 6:51I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats this bread will live forever.

    nor did Paul say that Eucharist chomping makes anyone more holy.
    Actually, he does. If you only took the time to read the text. It is plain.

    1 Cor 11:27 So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Everyone ought to examine themselves before they eat of the bread and drink from the cup. 29 For those who eat and drink without discerning the body of Christ eat and drink judgment on themselves. 30 That is why many among you are weak and sick, and a number of you have fallen asleep. 31 But if we were more discerning with regard to ourselves, we would not come under such judgment. 32 Nevertheless, when we are judged in this way by the Lord, we are being disciplined so that we will not be finally condemned with the world.

    Everytime we eat the Eucharist, we are judged by God in order that we will not be condemned in the Final Judgment. Thus, eating the Eucharist results in us becoming more holy.

    Hebrews 12:14 Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord.

    So what other make believe are Catholics willing to post about their pet sacrament?
    It is Protestants who deny God's word and make up their religion as they go along.

    Why not just follow what God DOES say instead of all the fictions Roman Catholics feel compelled to invent?

    ...
    Where does God say Sola Scriptura? Oh, He doesn't. He says:
    2 Thessalonians 2:15

    15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

    Where does He say, "you are justified by faith alone"? Oh, He doesn't He says,

    James 2:24 You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone.

    So, you guys invent your religion.

    Pray!

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Thomas View Post

      Proof? Here you go again. Seek rather faith! Seek the evidence not of human logic (a religion of man) but of faith (the gift of God).

      Heb 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
      Faith is neither substance nor evidence of hoping to be in heaven.

      Lessons in simply logic are required.


      .

      Comment


      • Originally posted by De Maria View Post

        But Jesus did and St. Paul believes Him:

        John 6:54
        New International Version
        Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.

        John 6:51I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats this bread will live forever.

        53 Jesus said to them, “Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you."

        Yet, the roman catholic church teaches that those who don't eat the roman catholic Eucharist still have life in them.

        This proves that the roman catholic church knows that verse does not teach about the roman catholic Eucharist even though they pretend it does.

        Actually, he does. If you only took the time to read the text. It is plain.

        1 Cor 11:27 So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Everyone ought to examine themselves before they eat of the bread and drink from the cup. 29 For those who eat and drink without discerning the body of Christ eat and drink judgment on themselves. 30 That is why many among you are weak and sick, and a number of you have fallen asleep. 31 But if we were more discerning with regard to ourselves, we would not come under such judgment. 32 Nevertheless, when we are judged in this way by the Lord, we are being disciplined so that we will not be finally condemned with the world.

        When Paul speaks in this scripture it is of the bread and cup, eating and drinking? EXCEPT when he mentions what it is they need to discern. There he only mentions the body. Why? Because he's not talking about the flesh and the blood of Christ. He's talking about the body (his church members) the same body Paul had just rebuked them for not treating in a Christ like manner. Some of them eating and drinking to a state of drunkenness and gluttony while others go hungry which brought judgement on to themselves. He was saying basically that they needed to check themselves. Those who were doing such things were not a child of God.



        Everytime we eat the Eucharist, we are judged by God in order that we will not be condemned in the Final Judgment. Thus, eating the Eucharist results in us becoming more holy.
        Holy like your abominable priests who have abused thousands and thousands of children, adults and even each other?

        Hebrews 12:14 Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord.
        Again here you see that they are being told to live in peace together, not doing as the Corinthians were above. Love each other, share, make sure everybody has their share and needs met.



        It is Protestants who deny God's word and make up their religion as they go along.
        Protestants take the scripture as it is written. Eating and drinking the body and blood, means coming to and believing in Jesus as is explained perfectly in the passage. Believing in His death, burial and resurrection. Having participation in His death, by dying with Him.



        Where does God say Sola Scriptura? Oh, He doesn't. He says:
        2 Thessalonians 2:15

        15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.
        We have been given authority and leadership in our local church, but we don't hold fast to the traditions of man as regards to our salvation.

        Where does He say, "you are justified by faith alone"? Oh, He doesn't He says,

        James 2:24 You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone.
        And what they do is believe in and follow Jesus, who then gives them good works to sanctify and serve His body. (the brethren) Good works contribute to the sanctification and perseverance of the saints, but they are not the cause of justification? How many works must you do to be saved?

        So, you guys invent your religion.
        A bunch of men who wanted power over the people invented yours. Read the ECF. Your church is nothing like them. NOTHING!

        Nothing you've said proves your filthy abominable priesthood is leading the church of our savior.

        But instead the fruit of your filthy abominable priesthood actually proves that they are not.

        Matthew 7: 15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 You will know them by their fruits."

        Your own leadership could not deny the good fruit in the Protestants whom you say deny God's word and whom you also condemn. But your leadership knew and they knew that the world could see it too, so they eventually tried to latch on and claim that fruit as theirs by calling us separated brethren.

        All the world sees of your roman catholic church is a bunch of pedophile priests who prey on the innocent and call those who expose them friends of the devil.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by 4Him View Post

          What is that supposed to be proof of???
          Truth.
          ... For salvation is nearer to us now than when we first believed;...
          But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to gratify its desires. (Rom 13)

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Conqueror View Post

            Faith is neither substance nor evidence of hoping to be in heaven.

            Lessons in simply logic are required.


            .
            Argue with the Lord about it - He wrote that.
            ... For salvation is nearer to us now than when we first believed;...
            But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to gratify its desires. (Rom 13)

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Thomas View Post

              Proof? Here you go again. Seek rather faith! Seek the evidence not of human logic (a religion of man) but of faith (the gift of God).

              Heb 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.


              Faith is neither substance nor evidence of hoping to be in heaven.

              Lessons in simply logic are required.

              Originally posted by Thomas View Post

              Argue with the Lord about it - He wrote that.

              The omniscient Lord Jesus isn't bereft of logic.

              The author of Hebrews wasn't an apostle.



              .

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Thomas View Post

                A religion based on proof, and not on divine revelation, is as weak as the men doing the logic.
                You don't know what you are saying because Christianity is based on proof which is Jesus.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Thomas View Post

                  Truth.
                  Be more specific.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by De Maria View Post

                    He means the same thing that Jesus Christ said to St. Thomas:

                    John 20:29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

                    And which St. Paul also taught:

                    2 Corinthians 5:7 For we live by faith, not by sight.

                    Do you still claim to be saved by faith ALONE?
                    The infallible interpretation according to De Maria.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Thomas View Post

                      Saving faith is a gift of God, not a work of man. Saving faith is supernatural, of God, from God, given freely....If what you believe is "true" because you have found "proof" of it in the reasonings of your mind, you have natural faith - something not of God but of man (yourself).
                      Saving faith is true because it was given by God who is Truth itself. Does a man dare to submit God to the requirements of his own very fallible mind?
                      Meaningless word salad...^...
                      Last edited by Howie; 02-22-19, 10:06 AM.
                      If he had meant to cast you away he would have done so long ago. If he wanted reasons for rejecting you he had reasons from all eternity, for he knew what you would be. No sin in you has been a surprise to him. C.H. Spurgeon

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by De Maria View Post

                        He means the same thing that Jesus Christ said to St. Thomas:

                        John 20:29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

                        And which St. Paul also taught:

                        2 Corinthians 5:7 For we live by faith, not by sight.

                        Do you still claim to be saved by faith ALONE?
                        What!?!?!?????

                        If he had meant to cast you away he would have done so long ago. If he wanted reasons for rejecting you he had reasons from all eternity, for he knew what you would be. No sin in you has been a surprise to him. C.H. Spurgeon

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Thomas View Post

                          A religion based on proof, and not on divine revelation, is as weak as the men doing the logic.
                          Another monumentally absurd bromide from a Roman Catholic emulating the schoolmen.

                          If he had meant to cast you away he would have done so long ago. If he wanted reasons for rejecting you he had reasons from all eternity, for he knew what you would be. No sin in you has been a surprise to him. C.H. Spurgeon

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by De Maria View Post

                            He means the same thing that Jesus Christ said to St. Thomas:

                            John 20:29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

                            And which St. Paul also taught:

                            2 Corinthians 5:7 For we live by faith, not by sight.

                            Do you still claim to be saved by faith ALONE?
                            How do you feel these scriptures disprove faith ALONE?

                            We believe in what we have not seen which means we live by what? FAITH.

                            We live by faith, not by sight, which means we live by what? FAITH.

                            Thomas needed to see to believe in the resurrection, but blessed are those who have NOT SEEN, but believe that Jesus conquered death and lives.

                            What is it to believe in what you have not seen. FAITH.

                            We have not seen Christ but we believe in His death, burial and resurrection because of unmerited grace which gives us FAITH to believe.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Angels_Sing View Post

                              Be more specific.
                              My OP:


                              Originally posted by Thomas View Post
                              Proof? Here you go again. Seek rather faith! Seek the evidence not of human logic (a religion of man) but of faith (the gift of God).

                              Heb 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
                              4Him: "What is that supposed to be proof of???"

                              My answer, "Truth."

                              That is, Faith is the "proof" of Truth - not human reasoning. Human reasoning results in natural faith, only God's gift can result in supernatural, and salvific, faith.
                              ... For salvation is nearer to us now than when we first believed;...
                              But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to gratify its desires. (Rom 13)

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Angels_Sing View Post

                                You don't know what you are saying because Christianity is based on proof which is Jesus.
                                Why is everyone not Christian, then? Because their logic is faulty? They're not "smart" enough? God wants to save only the "smart" people?
                                ... For salvation is nearer to us now than when we first believed;...
                                But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to gratify its desires. (Rom 13)

                                Comment

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