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More changes in WTS beliefs

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  • More changes in WTS beliefs

    Evidently JWs will be changing their beliefs again:
    [w16 11/15 p.22]6 Have Christians ever experienced anything comparable to the Babylonian captivity? For many years, this journal suggested that God’s modern-day servants entered into Babylonian captivity in 1918 and that they were released from Babylon in 1919. However, for the reasons that we shall outline in this article and in the one following, a reexamination of the subject was necessary.
    https://www.jw.org/en/publications/m...november-2016/

    Romans 10:1 Brethren, my heart’s desire and my prayer to God for them is for their salvation. 2 For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge. 3 For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

  • #2
    Originally posted by HollyWood View Post
    Evidently JWs will be changing their beliefs again:
    [w16 11/15 p.22]6 Have Christians ever experienced anything comparable to the Babylonian captivity? For many years, this journal suggested that God’s modern-day servants entered into Babylonian captivity in 1918 and that they were released from Babylon in 1919. However, for the reasons that we shall outline in this article and in the one following, a reexamination of the subject was necessary.
    https://www.jw.org/en/publications/m...november-2016/
    Could you elaborate a little on what you see about 1918 in this recent article link you provided. The link just brings you too a page with multiple choices. If you place 1918 in there search you come up with more choices but I’m thinking this one –

    https://www.jw.org/en/publications/m...esult_index]=4

    (Accordingly, between December 1917 and early 1918, the few thousand Bible Students zealously distributed 10,000,000 copies of a tract featuring the subject “The Fall of Babylon”) I still see the WTS providing the link to why 1914 is so significant to there system of beliefs ( They have pre-trib similarities-invisible return of Christ) https://www.jw.org/en/publications/b...esult_index]=1

    (The 2,520 years began in October 607 B.C.E., when Jerusalem fell to the Babylonians and the Davidic king was taken off his throne. The period ended in October 1914. At that time, “the appointed times of the nations” ended, and Jesus Christ was installed as God’s heavenly King.*)

    Acts11:26 Χριστιανούς Christianous->the name given to them in Antioch... 1 Peter4:16 However, if you suffer as a Christian, do not be ashamed, but praise God that you bear that name.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by HollyWood View Post
      Evidently JWs will be changing their beliefs again:
      [w16 11/15 p.22]6 Have Christians ever experienced anything comparable to the Babylonian captivity? For many years, this journal suggested that God’s modern-day servants entered into Babylonian captivity in 1918 and that they were released from Babylon in 1919. However, for the reasons that we shall outline in this article and in the one following, a reexamination of the subject was necessary.
      https://www.jw.org/en/publications/m...november-2016/
      this quote from the link is one all JW’s should try-Quote: 14 Many who thirsted for Bible truth fled to countries where the influence of the church was less pervasive. They wanted to read and study and converse with one another without being told what to think. It was in one such country, the United States, that Charles Taze Russell and a few associates began their systematic study of the Bible in the late 1800’s. Initially, Brother Russell’s goal was to ascertain which of the prevailing religions was teaching the truth. He had carefully compared the teachings of many different religions, even non-Christian religions, with what the Bible says. He soon realized that not one of those religions completely adhered to God’s Word…end quote https://www.jw.org/en/publications/m...t-of-darkness/

      Acts11:26 Χριστιανούς Christianous->the name given to them in Antioch... 1 Peter4:16 However, if you suffer as a Christian, do not be ashamed, but praise God that you bear that name.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by christianous View Post
        Could you elaborate a little on what you see about 1918 in this recent article link you provided. The link just brings you too a page with multiple choices. If you place 1918 in there search you come up with more choices but I’m thinking this one –

        https://www.jw.org/en/publications/m...esult_index]=4

        (Accordingly, between December 1917 and early 1918, the few thousand Bible Students zealously distributed 10,000,000 copies of a tract featuring the subject “The Fall of Babylon”) I still see the WTS providing the link to why 1914 is so significant to there system of beliefs ( They have pre-trib similarities-invisible return of Christ) https://www.jw.org/en/publications/b...esult_index]=1

        (The 2,520 years began in October 607 B.C.E., when Jerusalem fell to the Babylonians and the Davidic king was taken off his throne. The period ended in October 1914. At that time, “the appointed times of the nations” ended, and Jesus Christ was installed as God’s heavenly King.*)
        Well, it looks like they were saying their captivity lasted from 1918 to 1919, but now they are saying it was from when the last apostle died (in the 2nd century) to 1919.

        There's more at this website about it: http://avoidjw.org/2016/08/captives-of-constant-change/
        Romans 10:1 Brethren, my heart’s desire and my prayer to God for them is for their salvation. 2 For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge. 3 For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by christianous View Post
          this quote from the link is one all JW’s should try-Quote: 14 Many who thirsted for Bible truth fled to countries where the influence of the church was less pervasive. They wanted to read and study and converse with one another without being told what to think. It was in one such country, the United States, that Charles Taze Russell and a few associates began their systematic study of the Bible in the late 1800’s. Initially, Brother Russell’s goal was to ascertain which of the prevailing religions was teaching the truth. He had carefully compared the teachings of many different religions, even non-Christian religions, with what the Bible says. He soon realized that not one of those religions completely adhered to God’s Word…end quote https://www.jw.org/en/publications/m...t-of-darkness/
          I thought these were noteworthy quotes, too:

          par. 11 Any dissent from what the church taught was severely punished. Faithful anointed servants of God had to meet together in discreet groups—if they could meet at all.

          and par. 13: How dare the multitudes question church leaders!
          Romans 10:1 Brethren, my heart’s desire and my prayer to God for them is for their salvation. 2 For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge. 3 For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by HollyWood View Post

            Well, it looks like they were saying their captivity lasted from 1918 to 1919, but now they are saying it was from when the last apostle died (in the 2nd century) to 1919.

            There's more at this website about it: http://avoidjw.org/2016/08/captives-of-constant-change/
            They admit to "an adjustment in our understanding " more than once in this link.

            17 In the past, we have stated in our publications that these last four references apply to Jesus’ arriving, or coming, in 1918. As an example, take Jesus’ statement about “the faithful and discreet slave.” (Read Matthew 24:45-47.) We understood that the “arriving” mentioned in verse 46 was linked to the time when Jesus came to inspect the spiritual condition of the anointed in 1918 and that the appointment of the slave over all the Master’s belongings occurred in 1919. (Mal. 3:1) However, a further consideration of Jesus’ prophecy indicates that an adjustment in our understanding of the timing of certain aspects of Jesus’ prophecy is needed. Why so?

            19. What adjustments in understanding did we consider, and what questions will be answered in the following articles?

            19 In review, what have we learned? In the beginning of this article, we raised three “when” questions. We first considered that the great tribulation did not begin in 1914 but will start when the United Nations attacks Babylon the Great. Then, we reviewed why Jesus’ judgment of the sheep and the goats did not begin in 1914 but will occur during the great tribulation. Finally, we examined why Jesus’ arrival to appoint the faithful slave over all his belongings did not occur in 1919 but will take place during the great tribulation. So, then, all three “whens” apply to the same future time period—the great tribulation. How does this adjusted view further affect our understanding of the illustration of the faithful slave? Also, how does it affect our understanding of other parables, or illustrations, of Jesus that are being fulfilled during this time of the end? These important questions will be considered in the following articles https://www.jw.org/en/publications/m...ecy-last-days/
            Acts11:26 Χριστιανούς Christianous->the name given to them in Antioch... 1 Peter4:16 However, if you suffer as a Christian, do not be ashamed, but praise God that you bear that name.

            Comment


            • #7
              Indeed this is a major shift in understanding presented by the writer[s] of the Watchtower. The problem with cultic formulations like the Watchtower, [among others, such as HW Armstrong and his WW Church of God] is that they see themselves as the theological centre of the universe, as a result of which they have to interpret, and then, as circumstances change, to re-interpret choice bits of the Bible that are perceived to be foregleams of their history.

              In 1917, as a result of the publishing of probably the most execrable book ever released by the Watchtower, "The Finished Mystery", the Government of the United States incarcerated the WTS leadership in the Atlanta Penitentiary, citing the criminal intent of this leadership as publishers of seditious literature. This confinement in prison was not a religious issue [although later WTS publications would insist that it was] but a national security one. There was a war on, and any propaganda that incited the people and aided the enemy was regarded as a threat to the state.

              Even the most zealous of WT Followers today would have to admit that the bilious statements emanating from the book were bizarre, to say the least, yet at that time these statements were seen by objective readers as a contrivance to undermine the authority of the Government of the United States in a time of dire national peril during war. The State therefore, had justification in imprisoning these men as felons.

              With their inflated persecution complex, and a perception of themselves as The Ultimate Authority on all things biblical that bordered on the arrogant, these men naturally concluded that such an outrageous act against their venerable persons, must have been prophesied in the Bible. Of course it wasn't, but that was no deterrent to JF Rutherford, then President of the WTS. He pulled out the Babylonian Captivity of 587 BC - 539 BC and simply applied this to the nine month period of confinement that he and his mates experienced. Such an abominable case of biblical abuse would be laughable, were it not so serious in its intent. Almost immediately, and with no observable attempt to verify its veracity, this debauched teaching of the Bible was assumed by the rank and file WT membership to be God justified truth.

              This teaching was accepted as Received Wisdom by three succeeding generations of Watchtower Followers. Thousands died, including no less than four separate Presidents of the movement, with this teaching regarded as Absolute Truth. Now we have been told in the latest published magazine of the Watchtower, that this teaching was in fact NOT the truth. In fact it was the very opposite. It was FALSE.

              Now, we are told, for reasons outlined in the November 15, 2016 Wt, that the imprisonment of the executive committee of the WTS, was NOT a fulfillment of Bible prophecy, and that it was what we suspected all along. A jailing of a bunch of disillusioned old men, with no talent or ability at biblical exegesis. This does not mean that the Babylonian Captivity is invalid as a referent to the WTS, though.

              Now, we are told, or rather retold, that this captivity which lasted just one generation in the case of the Jews, actually lasted some two millennia in the case of the WTS!! According to the writer[s] of this article, the Light of True Christianity lasted from Pentecost Day, 33 AD to midnight of Dec 31 99 AD. At one second past midnight, when the world entered the second century on Jan 1, 100 AD, the lights went out, and the Babylonian Captivity began. It remained out till 1919. At that time, the "Jehovah" of the Watchtower, along with his little gnome like helper, Michael/Christ, examined all the religions of Christendom, and after pronouncing them apostate and cast out, liberated the WTS leadership from their long somnolent, captivity.

              As before, so now, this would appear almost laughable, were it not so serious in its intent. The Rank and File are expected, as then, to acknowledge this as Received Wisdom without debate or dissent. Till it is changed.

              Sad.

              Comment


              • #8
                There's also been a change in who they believe the man with the inkhorn is in Ezekiel 9.

                See the June 2016 wt QFR:
                In the past, we have explained that in the modern-day fulfillment of this vision, the man with the secretary’s inkhorn represented the anointed remnant. It was thought that those who respond favorably to the message being preached are now marked for survival. In recent years, however, it has become clear that an adjustment needs to be made to this explanation. According to what is stated at Matthew 25:31-33, Jesus is the one who judges people. He makes his final judgment during the time of the great tribulation, separating the sheep-like ones, who will survive, from the goat-like ones, who will be destroyed.
                Of course, in 1917 when Jesus was examining them and appointing them sole communicator between God and mankind, they were saying Russell was the man with the inkhorn, and he was marking his followers with a cross shape (+).
                Romans 10:1 Brethren, my heart’s desire and my prayer to God for them is for their salvation. 2 For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge. 3 For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Wow! I did not know about that, the changes come around so fast! So, the man with the inkhorn is not the anointed, and his identity as of the present is unknown. Evidently we will know this only when the GT breaks out.

                  What I find most disturbing, and probably a little bit sinister is how, by focusing on 1919, as the starting point of the GB and all attendant truths that have emerged from them, they have marginalized the seminal work done by CT Russell. Effectively the 1914 date seems to be fading into a footnote in Watchtower theology, and 1919, a date unknown to CT Russell, is emerging as the prime source date for all Watchtower "truth".

                  Since this "Jehovah" only chose the GB in 1919, and started to use them as his spokesmen, it follows that Russell himself was not so chosen, and his legacy is but a forgotten and neglected prelude to the real beginning of Watchtowerism.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    There's more at this website about it: http://avoidjw.org/2016/08/captives-of-constant-change/
                    Bear in mind what the writer(s) said in The Watchtower November 2016 on page 16 par. 10, “"Jehovah is behind such developments."”

                    If Jehovah really is behind such developments, past and present, was he behind the change in 1939? If so, why are they changing back to a doctrine that dates back to 1881? Either Jehovah is unsure of His own truth or Jehovah is not behind such developments. Whichever way you look at it, it is blasphemy. Why? Because it shows a complete lack of reverence to God. (Mark 3: 28, 29; Romans 2: 24; compare Isaiah 52:5). God is clearly not behind these “developments”. If God was behind them, there would never have been a change from what was originally believed in 1881. Indeed, there wouldn't have been various interpretations of it between 1881 and 1939.
                    [w16 11/15 p.16. par. 10: "Think about the many organizational changes that have been made during the past decade—and bear in mind that Jehovah is behind such developments."
                    Romans 10:1 Brethren, my heart’s desire and my prayer to God for them is for their salvation. 2 For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge. 3 For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by moggy View Post
                      Wow! I did not know about that, the changes come around so fast! So, the man with the inkhorn is not the anointed, and his identity as of the present is unknown. Evidently we will know this only when the GT breaks out.

                      What I find most disturbing, and probably a little bit sinister is how, by focusing on 1919, as the starting point of the GB and all attendant truths that have emerged from them, they have marginalized the seminal work done by CT Russell. Effectively the 1914 date seems to be fading into a footnote in Watchtower theology, and 1919, a date unknown to CT Russell, is emerging as the prime source date for all Watchtower "truth".

                      Since this "Jehovah" only chose the GB in 1919, and started to use them as his spokesmen, it follows that Russell himself was not so chosen, and his legacy is but a forgotten and neglected prelude to the real beginning of Watchtowerism.
                      Well, they're saying Jesus is the man with the inkhorn:
                      [June 2016 wt p.16] In the modern-day fulfillment, the man with the secretary’s inkhorn represents Jesus Christ, the one behind the scenes who marks those who will survive. The great crowd will receive their mark when they are judged as sheep during the great tribulation. This will put them in line to receive everlasting life here on earth.
                      Romans 10:1 Brethren, my heart’s desire and my prayer to God for them is for their salvation. 2 For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge. 3 For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Oops, missed that bit about Jesus being the guy with the inkhorn, although being a spirit in heaven, how he is going to do the marking of people on earth seems far more mysterious than the Trinity.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by moggy View Post
                          Oops, missed that bit about Jesus being the guy with the inkhorn, although being a spirit in heaven, how he is going to do the marking of people on earth seems far more mysterious than the Trinity.
                          I thought of that, too. After all, it is the man with an inkhorn, not an angel, and JWs say Jesus will never be a man again.

                          Rutherford continued the teaching that Russell was that man:

                          WT April 1, 1920, p.102: Practically all in present truth, if not all, we believe, concur in the thought that the "man . . . clothed with linen, with a writer's inkhorn by his side" (Ezekiel 9: 2) foreshadowed Brother Russell; that Brother Russell had a commission from the Lord to do certain work; and that he finished that work and reported the same. (Ezekiel 9: 11)

                          But ten years later he was saying this:

                          Vindication Book #1, 1931, Chapter 9 p.100] There is not one scripture to support the conclusion that the man with the writer's inkhorn by his side and clothed with linen pictures an individual. There are numerous scriptures proving that this one man pictures all the anointed ones on earth, and which constitute the "servant" class, the remnant of the Lord.

                          Now the men on the WTS GB are regressing back to the idea that the man is an individual----one they've said died as a man and would never be a man again.

                          [w87 4/15 p.6] Jesus, as a perfect, flesh-and-blood man, actually died as a man and remains dead as a man forever.


                          Romans 10:1 Brethren, my heart’s desire and my prayer to God for them is for their salvation. 2 For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge. 3 For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by moggy View Post
                            Oops, missed that bit about Jesus being the guy with the inkhorn, although being a spirit in heaven, how he is going to do the marking of people on earth seems far more mysterious than the Trinity.
                            This might help you to understand how "the guy with the inkhorn" can be in heaven and mark the people on earth.

                            Ezekiel 9

                            American Standard Version


                            Slaughter of the Idolaters

                            1Then he cried in mine ears with a loud voice, saying, Cause ye them that have charge over the city to draw near, every man with his destroying weapon in his hand. 2And behold, six men came from the way of the upper gate, which lieth toward the north, every man with his slaughter weapon in his hand; and one man in the midst of them clothed in linen, with a writer's inkhorn by his side. And they went in, and stood beside the brazen altar.

                            3And the glory of the God of Israel was gone up from the cherub, whereupon it was, to the threshold of the house: and he called to the man clothed in linen, who had the writer's inkhorn by his side. 4And Jehovah said unto him, Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem, and set a mark upon the foreheads of the men that sigh and that cry over all the abominations that are done in the midst thereof. 5And to the others he said in my hearing, Go ye through the city after him, and smite: let not your eye spare, neither have ye pity; 6slay utterly the old man, the young man and the virgin, and little children and women; but come not near any man upon whom is the mark: and begin at my sanctuary. Then they began at the old men that were before the house. 7And he said unto them, Defile the house, and fill the courts with the slain: go ye forth. And they went forth, and smote in the city. 8And it came to pass, while they were smiting, and I was left, that I fell upon my face, and cried, and said, Ah Lord Jehovah! wilt thou destroy all the residue of Israel in thy pouring out of thy wrath upon Jerusalem?

                            9Then said he unto me, The iniquity of the house of Israel and Judah is exceeding great, and the land is full of blood, and the city full of wrestling of judgment : for they say, Jehovah hath forsaken the land, and Jehovah seeth not. 10And as for me also, mine eye shall not spare, neither will I have pity, but I will bring their way upon their head.

                            11And behold, the man clothed in linen, who had the inkhorn by his side, reported the matter, saying, I have done as thou hast commanded me.

                            Hirsch means “deer” or “stag” in Yiddish. It is the root of many Ashkenazic last names including Hart, and Hartman. It is the Yiddish translation of the Hebrew word for gazelle — tsvi. The gazelle was the symbol of the tribe of Naphtali.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Peter Hart View Post

                              This might help you to understand how "the guy with the inkhorn" can be in heaven and mark the people on earth.

                              Ezekiel 9

                              American Standard Version


                              Slaughter of the Idolaters

                              1Then he cried in mine ears with a loud voice, saying, Cause ye them that have charge over the city to draw near, every man with his destroying weapon in his hand. 2And behold, six men came from the way of the upper gate, which lieth toward the north, every man with his slaughter weapon in his hand; and one man in the midst of them clothed in linen, with a writer's inkhorn by his side. And they went in, and stood beside the brazen altar.

                              3And the glory of the God of Israel was gone up from the cherub, whereupon it was, to the threshold of the house: and he called to the man clothed in linen, who had the writer's inkhorn by his side. 4And Jehovah said unto him, Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem, and set a mark upon the foreheads of the men that sigh and that cry over all the abominations that are done in the midst thereof. 5And to the others he said in my hearing, Go ye through the city after him, and smite: let not your eye spare, neither have ye pity; 6slay utterly the old man, the young man and the virgin, and little children and women; but come not near any man upon whom is the mark: and begin at my sanctuary. Then they began at the old men that were before the house. 7And he said unto them, Defile the house, and fill the courts with the slain: go ye forth. And they went forth, and smote in the city. 8And it came to pass, while they were smiting, and I was left, that I fell upon my face, and cried, and said, Ah Lord Jehovah! wilt thou destroy all the residue of Israel in thy pouring out of thy wrath upon Jerusalem?

                              9Then said he unto me, The iniquity of the house of Israel and Judah is exceeding great, and the land is full of blood, and the city full of wrestling of judgment : for they say, Jehovah hath forsaken the land, and Jehovah seeth not. 10And as for me also, mine eye shall not spare, neither will I have pity, but I will bring their way upon their head.

                              11And behold, the man clothed in linen, who had the inkhorn by his side, reported the matter, saying, I have done as thou hast commanded me.
                              Maybe you could address how Michael can be a man again.
                              Romans 10:1 Brethren, my heart’s desire and my prayer to God for them is for their salvation. 2 For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge. 3 For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

                              Comment

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