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Is the LDS church one of these dying churches?

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  • Is the LDS church one of these dying churches?

    "“BETWEEN 6,000 AND 10,000 CHURCHES IN THE U.S. ARE DYING EACH YEAR” – AND THAT MEANS THAT OVER 100 WILL DIE THIS WEEK"
    --from Alex Jones' Info Wars

    The article goes on to say:

    "...between 6,000 and 10,000 churches are dying in the United States every single year, and that means that more than 100 will die this week alone. And of course thousands of others are on life support. All over the country this weekend, small handfuls of people will gather in huge buildings which once boasted very large congregations. At one time, America was widely considered to be “a Christian nation”, but that really isn’t true anymore. As an excellent article in The Atlantic has noted, even though most Americans still consider themselves to be “Christian”, the numbers are telling us a very different story…"

    What do you think of this news?
    ...whenever a person's religious conversation dwells... on the faults of other people's religions, he is in a bad condition-C.S. Lewis

  • #2
    Originally posted by NRA-Jeff View Post
    between 6,000 and 10,000 churches are dying in the United States every single year, and that means that more than 100 will die this week alone. And of course thousands of others are on life support. All over the country this weekend, small handfuls of people will gather in huge buildings which once boasted very large congregations.
    And all over the country people will gather in large church buildings that are FULL.

    At one time, America was widely considered to be “a Christian nation”,
    But only by people who had NO CLUE what a "Christian Nation" even was.

    most Americans still consider themselves to be “Christian”,
    And most Americans never were, then AND now.

    What do you think of this news?
    What makes you think it's "News"??

    Comment


    • #3
      "In 1776, every European American, with the exception of about 2,500 Jews, identified himself or herself as a Christian. Moreover, approximately 98 percent of the colonists were Protestants, with the remaining 1.9 percent being Roman Catholics."

      That suggests that In the decade when Joseph Smith was murdered, over 90% of all Americans were still Protestants, so over 90% of the residents of Carthage, Illinois were probably Protestants, so over 90% of the mob who painted their faces black like Antifa does today, were probably Protestants.

      Now back to the article:

      "Not only did early Americans identify themselves as Christians, but nearly all of them regularly attended church.

      Now our society is moving very rapidly in the exact opposite direction, and many believe that this has tremendous implications for the future of our nation"

      Do any of you disagree with the statement that this has tremendous implications for the future of our nation?
      ...whenever a person's religious conversation dwells... on the faults of other people's religions, he is in a bad condition-C.S. Lewis

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by NRA-Jeff View Post
        "“BETWEEN 6,000 AND 10,000 CHURCHES IN THE U.S. ARE DYING EACH YEAR” – AND THAT MEANS THAT OVER 100 WILL DIE THIS WEEK"
        --from Alex Jones' Info Wars

        The article goes on to say:

        "...between 6,000 and 10,000 churches are dying in the United States every single year, and that means that more than 100 will die this week alone. And of course thousands of others are on life support. All over the country this weekend, small handfuls of people will gather in huge buildings which once boasted very large congregations. At one time, America was widely considered to be “a Christian nation”, but that really isn’t true anymore. As an excellent article in The Atlantic has noted, even though most Americans still consider themselves to be “Christian”, the numbers are telling us a very different story…"

        What do you think of this news?
        That is predicted in the Book of Mormon. In the parable of the olive tree (Jacob 5) it outlines the future history of both the Gentiles as well as the house of Israel. In that parable, there is a point at which Israel is scattered, and the Gentiles are grafted into their place, and for a long time they prosper bring forth good fruit. After that, there comes a time when they start bearing bad fruit, at which point they are gradually cut off, and true branches of the original tree are grafted back into their place. The process is a gradual one, which is what is happening today. As the traditional churches are dying out, the restored Church is gaining strength.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by NRA-Jeff View Post
          "In 1776, every European American, with the exception of about 2,500 Jews, identified himself or herself as a Christian. Moreover, approximately 98 percent of the colonists were Protestants, with the remaining 1.9 percent being Roman Catholics."

          That suggests that In the decade when Joseph Smith was murdered, over 90% of all Americans were still Protestants, so over 90% of the residents of Carthage, Illinois were probably Protestants, so over 90% of the mob who painted their faces black like Antifa does today, were probably Protestants.
          THE QUESTION, of course, is how many of the "Protestants" (or the LDS, for that matter) were "Christians" at all. "Protestant" means NOTHING (except "not adhering to Catholic paradigms"), and by the same token "LDS means NOTHING except as a definer of the "Religious paradigm" that the LDS has generated for itself.

          "Not only did early Americans identify themselves as Christians, but nearly all of them regularly attended church.
          Nothing of significance here, other than Social "Peer Pressure".

          Now our society is moving very rapidly in the exact opposite direction, and many believe that this has tremendous implications for the future of our nation".
          ANd it could be that The U.S. which has been in an accelerating SPIRITUAL Death spiral for quite a while is only "Actualizing" WHAT IT'S true CONDITION HAS BEEN ALL ALONG!!!

          Our government, AND our society is doing it's LEVEL BEST to remove any vestigial God-Consciousness from the U.S. which will NOT HAVE a positive effect on the Country. That we would actually ELECT ISLAMICS into governmental offices is a frightening admission of religious APATHY.
          Last edited by Bob Carabbio; 11-28-18, 04:10 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Bob Carabbio View Post

            THE QUESTION, of course, is how many of the "Protestants" (or the LDS, for that matter) were "Christians" at all. "Protestant" means NOTHING (except "not adhering to Catholic paradigms"), and by the same token "LDS means NOTHING except as a definer of the "Religious paradigm" that the LDS has generated for itself.


            Nothing of significance here, other than Social "Peer Pressure".



            ANd it could be that The U.S. which has been in an accelerating SPIRITUAL Death spiral for quite a while is only "Actualizing" WHAT IT'S true CONDITION HAS BEEN ALL ALONG!!!

            Our government, AND our society is doing it's LEVEL BEST to remove any vestigial God-Consciousness from the U.S. which will NOT HAVE a positive effect on the Country. That we would actually ELECT ISLAMICS into governmental offices is a frightening admission of religious APATHY.
            Ah.

            the "no true Christian' defense.


            "Christian" does NOT mean 'born again." It does not mean 'saved."

            It means simply that one's religious belief system puts the teachings of Jesus Christ (as he believes them to be) at the center.

            "Christian" absolutely does NOT mean 'belonging to Christ."

            YOU cannot judge who does, and who does not, belong to Him, any more than I can. Only two people can know that....and given some recent events, perhaps only One can.

            Only Jesus Himself can truly know who is, and who is not, His. The rest of us may think we are; we may be convinced of it, even. But we could be wrong.

            What is absolutely certain is this: neither you nor I can look at someone else and make that declaration.
            Providing a proper reference/citation for a quote says nothing. Refusing to provide a proper reference/citation for a quote says everything: it’s a credibility killer. Nothing says “I'm making this up” like refusing to provide citations.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Bob Carabbio

              There's No sense in paying any attention beyond THAT IDIOTIC statement!!!!

              SO YOU as a member of the LDS Have NO CONCEPT Whatsoever of what a "Christian" even IS!!!!!

              And you want us to take ANYTHING you say seriously????
              Oh, look it up in the dictionary, for crying out loud.

              As far as WE can tell, your definition of "Christian," is "he who agrees with me about everything.' I have seen Christians deny Christianity to everybody who doesn't agree, 100%, with a list they have....and many Christians have the same definition, but different lists.

              One group says that Catholics can't be Christians.
              Catholics used to (and some still do) say that Protestents can't be Christian.

              I have noticed that EVERYBODY IN HERE (but me, I think) has a favorite group that they will say 'not Christian' for no logical reason I can see....and then I see other Christians who claim that they ARE 'Christian' until they get caught doing something....er....and then they do a huge confess and cry and say "I only thought I was a Christian (or saved) but Now I Really Am!!" to the sound of ahhhs and applause.

              The one that REALLY gets me is this tendency to do the 'no true christian' thing, where any christian who does something that might just be embarrassing (oh, like assassinate another religious leader in a mob hit, or attack and kill children, or do other heinous things) is thrown out of the club. Oh, they say, don't blame CHRISTIANS, because HE WASN'T A CHRISTIAN....NO TRUE CHRISTIAN would do that!

              At the same time, a Mormon could do something heinous, and all of Mormonism is judged by that action. WE are not allowed to mention that those who did that thing were breaking all the rules and disobeying all the precepts they were taught AS Mormons. Oh, no....there is no 'no true Mormon' allowed.

              but all Christians are simon pure and sinless, because if any Christian DOES something wrong, then...he was no true Christian. Nice argument, if you could get it to fly.

              It doesn't, with me.

              ALL we can do, when judging those who claim to be Christian or not is to see their fruits. ...and even then, all we can do is say 'is this Christian walking the walk, or is this Christian being a bad one?

              But hey, what IS your 'list,' that all Christians must abide by in order to be a Christian in truth?

              Does it happen to match anybody else's list?

              Because I'll be willing to bet you my grilled cheese sandwich and half a banana that it doesn't, not all the way to the punctuation.

              ..............................btw................. .. Definition of Christian

              (Entry 1 of 2)


              1a : one who professes belief in the teachings of Jesus Christ

              As for whether you take anything I say seriously, that's entirely up to you. Please excuse me, however, if I decline to put up with the sort of ad hominem attack you just handed me.


              Providing a proper reference/citation for a quote says nothing. Refusing to provide a proper reference/citation for a quote says everything: it’s a credibility killer. Nothing says “I'm making this up” like refusing to provide citations.

              Comment


              • #8
                The Mormon cult is not popular with the technologically advanced crowd of Mormon young people. They know it's a hoax it would seem:

                https://religionnews.com/2016/10/05/...he-lds-church/




                Christian scholar John MacArthur about Mormonism: “Mormonism is wrong in epic proportions.”

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Bob Carabbio

                  There's No sense in paying any attention beyond THAT IDIOTIC statement!!!!

                  SO YOU as a member of the LDS Have NO CONCEPT Whatsoever of what a "Christian" even IS!!!!!

                  And you want us to take ANYTHING you say seriously????
                  That was really a statement out of left field wasn't it?
                  Christian scholar John MacArthur about Mormonism: “Mormonism is wrong in epic proportions.”

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Catherine Aurelia View Post

                    That was really a statement out of left field wasn't it?
                    not really. It was a statement out of the dictionary used by all English speaking people.

                    It's also a statement that you should be used to by now. We have had many discussions about what a 'Christian' is, and is not, with you coming down pretty hard on Mormons not being Christians...and I'm not certain that you aren't in one of the groups that deny Christianity to Jehovah's Witnesses, Christian Scientists....and Catholics. I could be wrong about that, but hey. Short term memory problems, here.

                    (shrug)

                    As far as I can see, everybody posting in here is a Christian. Not everybody is a GOOD one, but hey. we all sin and fall short. Being 'saved" isn't about what we do. It's about what we WANT more than anything else...you have a very different idea of how that works than I do, but the only One who counts here is Jesus, and you aren't Him.

                    And neither am I.
                    Providing a proper reference/citation for a quote says nothing. Refusing to provide a proper reference/citation for a quote says everything: it’s a credibility killer. Nothing says “I'm making this up” like refusing to provide citations.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Catherine Aurelia View Post
                      The Mormon cult is not popular with the technologically advanced crowd of Mormon young people. They know it's a hoax it would seem:

                      https://religionnews.com/2016/10/05/...he-lds-church/



                      Y'know, I read the whole thing.

                      the words "technologically advanced" "cult" and 'hoax" do not appear anywhere in it.

                      the emphasis seems, both by the author of the article and the people reported on, were about how to get the young adults to be more welcome, and to have more responsibilities. Catherine Aurelia, did YOU read the article? Frankly, I don't think you could have, because what you 'got' out of it simply wasn't in there.

                      And it doesn't work, especially when the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day saints is STILL the only church in the USA where the more education one has, the more likely one is to STAY IN THE CHURCH, unlike most other religions (especially evangelical Christianity) where college degrees generally equal exits from church going.

                      The problem, of course, is that the LDS doesn't have any problems with what science comes up with. Evangelicals, er, do. Or rather, they can. You really don't find all that many strict literal Biblical creationists in Mormonism, for one thing. (Oh, you can find them....there's no church doctrine that forbids it...or forbids old earth advocates, either).

                      We love learning. And technology. You wouldn't be able to watch soap operas or CNN or Fox or whatever it is that floats your boat without us.

                      More Mormons go to college than just about anybody else. We aren't the top in graduating, but we DO love to take the classes.

                      and while the numbers are, indeed, depressing..........they are STILL HIGHER IN RETENTION THAN ANY EVANGELICAL CHURCH OUT THERE.

                      So, you go and solve the problems YOU have with keeping the young people. THEN you can come tell us how you managed to do it.
                      Providing a proper reference/citation for a quote says nothing. Refusing to provide a proper reference/citation for a quote says everything: it’s a credibility killer. Nothing says “I'm making this up” like refusing to provide citations.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by dianaiad;n570***9
                        Oh, look it up in the dictionary, for crying out loud.
                        That' of course would be ONE MAJOR problem in the LDS - i.e. their members getting their theology from an "English Dictionary".

                        YOU SERIOUSLY THINK the Dictionary trumps the BIBLE in defining "Christianity"????

                        I TOLD YOU what makes a Christian a Christian - i.e. Being Born Again of the Holy Spirit John 3 - and you're willing to call JESUS a liar, in favor of Webster??

                        GET REAL!!!!
                        Last edited by 4Him; 11-28-18, 09:45 PM. Reason: No violation

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Bob Carabbio View Post

                          That' of course would be ONE MAJOR problem in the LDS - i.e. their members getting their theology from an "English Dictionary".

                          YOU SERIOUSLY THINK the Dictionary trumps the BIBLE in defining "Christianity"????

                          I TOLD YOU what makes a Christian a Christian - i.e. Being Born Again of the Holy Spirit John 3 - and you're willing to call JESUS a liar, in favor of Webster??

                          GET REAL!!!!
                          I've had them do that before! Was Webster one of he Early Church Fathers?
                          Christian scholar John MacArthur about Mormonism: “Mormonism is wrong in epic proportions.”

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Catherine Aurelia View Post

                            I've had them do that before! Was Webster one of he Early Church Fathers?
                            One of Crazy Joe's Cousins, maybe -

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Bob Carabbio View Post

                              That' of course would be ONE MAJOR problem in the LDS - i.e. their members getting their theology from an "English Dictionary".

                              YOU SERIOUSLY THINK the Dictionary trumps the BIBLE in defining "Christianity"????

                              I TOLD YOU what makes a Christian a Christian - i.e. Being Born Again of the Holy Spirit John 3 - and you're willing to call JESUS a liar, in favor of Webster??

                              GET REAL!!!!
                              There is one rather large problem with your position here.

                              the bible DOES NOT DEFINE THE WORD "CHRISTIAN."

                              Anywhere.

                              but do feel free to show me where it does. Really. I would like to see it. I would especially like to see where it defines "Christian" the way YOU, specifically, define it. In fact, the word 'Christian' or 'Christians' is used precisely three times in the Bible, and NONE of those mentions includes a definition.

                              but again, feel free to prove me wrong. There are, again, only three verses that mention the word. Acts 11:26

                              26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch. Acts 26:28

                              28 Then Agrippa said unto Paul, Almost thou persuadest me to be a Christian.

                              1 Peter 4:16
                              16 Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

                              What these verses do is simply to allow those who follow Jesus and His teachings as they believe them to be, and who believe themselves to be His followers, to call themselves Christians.

                              ..................as other people called them 'Christians,' which, btw, was a term that was generally a pejorative when used by others, at the time.

                              But you still haven't given me your list of what must be DONE in order to be a Christian in your eyes. Now you claim that being Christian means being 'born again,' though there's nothing in the bible to say so.

                              However, let's just, for the sake of argument, say that this is so.

                              What does one have to DO in order to be 'born again?" WHERE IS YOUR LIST, that automatically shuts out anybody who disagrees with you regarding Jesus or His teachings?


                              Providing a proper reference/citation for a quote says nothing. Refusing to provide a proper reference/citation for a quote says everything: it’s a credibility killer. Nothing says “I'm making this up” like refusing to provide citations.

                              Comment

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