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Challenge for anyone who wants to prevent our German lady from having to eat crow

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

    Nor that the NT contains the words of Jesus of Nazareth.

    Yet you believe a translation from the Greek to be accurately reporting the words of a Galilean Jew. How very droll.
    Your track record with translations brings new meaning to "bleak"

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by stiggywiggy View Post

      So you were incorrect. Nothing advocating Christians killing infidels and pagans.

      Why did you say that? Was it dishonesty or just a big screw-up?

      Did you miss the post addressed to you that directly followed that?

      Here it is again.

      Luther, in his 1522 sermon, charged the "witches" with a litany of supernatural behaviors, including transformation into different animals, accusations which, to the rationally thinking mind, would be ludicrous indeed. This further demonstrates that Luther's motive for breaking away from the Catholic Church was not to defend freedom of individual thought, but to establish a religious orthodoxy of his own.

      Luther, in addition to his intense anti-Semitism, strived to encourage the adoption of his version of Protestantism as the state-sponsored religion of numerous German principalities, at the expense of the religious freedoms of those principalities' citizens. His intolerance extended even to the Zwinglians in Switzerland, with whom he exhibited only a minor disagreement over transubstantiation. Luther would undoubtedly have been eager to use the fear of witches as yet another weapon to direct mass hostility against those whose views diverged with his own.

      John Calvin's description of witches in the Institutes of the Christian Religion even more transparently revealed his true motives of combating dissension from his version of Protestantism. Calvin draws, from his passage on witchcraft, the conclusion that "we have to wage war against an infinite number of enemies." Calvin might have included under this category anyone who did not conform to the dicta of his strict church government in Geneva.

      Calvin's policy was to stringently oversee people's private lives, church attendance, and intellectual expression, and ensure that nothing they said or did would displease God. It should therefore come as no surprise that Geneva experienced a far larger number of witch hunts than most other major European cities.
      Howlers:
      Ancient Literacy "Paper, writing utensils, the very act of writing was rare and dear."

      Romantic Love "I
      did not say that romantic love is endemic to all human beings. I said it's endemic to humanity."

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

        Christians persecuted women and men for being witches. Luther and Calvin both supported the witch-trials.
        Muslim witches? That's hilarious.

        Signature? You want a signature? I'll show you a signature!
        John Hancock

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

          Did you miss the post addressed to you that directly followed that?

          Here it is again.

          Luther, in his 1522 sermon, charged the "witches" with a litany of supernatural behaviors, including transformation into different animals, accusations which, to the rationally thinking mind, would be ludicrous indeed. This further demonstrates that Luther's motive for breaking away from the Catholic Church was not to defend freedom of individual thought, but to establish a religious orthodoxy of his own.

          Luther, in addition to his intense anti-Semitism, strived to encourage the adoption of his version of Protestantism as the state-sponsored religion of numerous German principalities, at the expense of the religious freedoms of those principalities' citizens. His intolerance extended even to the Zwinglians in Switzerland, with whom he exhibited only a minor disagreement over transubstantiation. Luther would undoubtedly have been eager to use the fear of witches as yet another weapon to direct mass hostility against those whose views diverged with his own.

          John Calvin's description of witches in the Institutes of the Christian Religion even more transparently revealed his true motives of combating dissension from his version of Protestantism. Calvin draws, from his passage on witchcraft, the conclusion that "we have to wage war against an infinite number of enemies." Calvin might have included under this category anyone who did not conform to the dicta of his strict church government in Geneva.

          Calvin's policy was to stringently oversee people's private lives, church attendance, and intellectual expression, and ensure that nothing they said or did would displease God. It should therefore come as no surprise that Geneva experienced a far larger number of witch hunts than most other major European cities.
          You had said that Luther advocated killing Muslims, and now you're talking about witches? Muslim witches?

          Bow out gracefully, lady. You screwed up and all this copying and pasting can't change that.




          Signature? You want a signature? I'll show you a signature!
          John Hancock

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by stiggywiggy View Post

            You had said that Luther advocated killing Muslims, and now you're talking about witches? Muslim witches?

            Bow out gracefully, lady. You screwed up and all this copying and pasting can't change that.



            I realise it is early morning where you are, so maybe you have not fully woken up yet.

            On your Bonehead threat Kastewart wrote this in her post #45

            Originally posted by Kastewart View Post

            There isn't one. So what justification did the various Christian leaders use to justify slaughtering Muslims and pagans (etc, at various times)?
            At post #48 on that same thread you wrote this challenge to her

            Originally posted by stiggywiggy View Post

            Exactly.

            What Christian leaders? Give me a name or two.
            I gave a list that included Luther and Calvin.

            Luther and Calvin both supported the persecution of so called witches (aka to Christians as pagans) and Luther also endorsed the persecution of Jews, and Muslims, as The Pixie has so kindly illustrated.
            Last edited by Hypatia_Alexandria; 01-11-17, 07:57 AM.
            Howlers:
            Ancient Literacy "Paper, writing utensils, the very act of writing was rare and dear."

            Romantic Love "I
            did not say that romantic love is endemic to all human beings. I said it's endemic to humanity."

            Comment


            • #36
              Here is a translation of Luther's "On war against the Turk"

              http://www.lutherdansk.dk/On%20war%2...#_Toc129163847

              From it:

              They are not good enough to make it worthwhile to say a single word of defense to them, for to them the Gospel must always be a stench and a savor of death unto death, as they have deserved by their willful blasphemy.
              I have some pieces of Mohammedís Koran which might be called in German a book of sermons or doctrines of the kind that we call popeís decretals. When I have time, I must put it into German so that every man may see what a foul and shameful book it is.
              Thus the Turk is, in truth, nothing but a murderer or highwayman, as his deeds show before menís eyes.

              Note the bold which states Luther's view that Muslims deserve death.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by The Pixie View Post
                Here is a translation of Luther's "On war against the Turk"

                http://www.lutherdansk.dk/On%20war%2...#_Toc129163847

                From it:


                Note the bold which states Luther's view that Muslims deserve death.
                We wait for the response!

                Howlers:
                Ancient Literacy "Paper, writing utensils, the very act of writing was rare and dear."

                Romantic Love "I
                did not say that romantic love is endemic to all human beings. I said it's endemic to humanity."

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                  I realise it is early morning where you are, so maybe you have not fully woken up yet.

                  On your Bonehead threat Kastewart wrote this in her post #45
                  Yep, and then you defended her erroneous comment.

                  I gave a list that included Luther and Calvin.
                  Yep, you sure did.So stop stalling and get busy finding a quote from Calvin and Luther advocating killing Muslims.
                  Signature? You want a signature? I'll show you a signature!
                  John Hancock

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by The Pixie View Post
                    Note the bold which states Luther's view that Muslims deserve death.
                    Luther thought all people deserve death. Let me know if you find anything from him advocating that Christians kill Muslims.

                    Signature? You want a signature? I'll show you a signature!
                    John Hancock

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by stiggywiggy View Post

                      Yep, and then you defended her erroneous comment.



                      Yep, you sure did.So stop stalling and get busy finding a quote from Calvin and Luther advocating killing Muslims.
                      It is not erroneous. And you have your answers a couple of posts back.

                      I think it is you who needs to bow gracefully and accept that you were wrong.

                      Although I have noticed that the ability to admit error does appear to be in short supply among some here on CARM.
                      Howlers:
                      Ancient Literacy "Paper, writing utensils, the very act of writing was rare and dear."

                      Romantic Love "I
                      did not say that romantic love is endemic to all human beings. I said it's endemic to humanity."

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                        It is not erroneous. And you have your answers a couple of posts back.

                        I think it is you who needs to bow gracefully and accept that you were wrong.
                        That's not his way.
                        Anyone who actually believes in the existence of sin will avoid lying about others and misrepresenting them.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by America View Post
                          That's not his way.
                          Oh dear. Another one?
                          Howlers:
                          Ancient Literacy "Paper, writing utensils, the very act of writing was rare and dear."

                          Romantic Love "I
                          did not say that romantic love is endemic to all human beings. I said it's endemic to humanity."

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                            Oh dear. Another one?
                            Seems to be SOP around here...
                            Anyone who actually believes in the existence of sin will avoid lying about others and misrepresenting them.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                              I realise it is early morning where you are, so maybe you have not fully woken up yet.

                              On your Bonehead threat Kastewart wrote this in her post #45
                              Yep, and you agreed. Drink some real coffee. Your decaff isn't working.


                              At post #48 on that same thread you wrote this challenge to her
                              You're repeating yourself. Answered below.


                              I gave a list that included Luther and Calvin.
                              Exactly. And since neither one ever advocated killing Muslims, you screwed up.
                              Signature? You want a signature? I'll show you a signature!
                              John Hancock

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                                It is not erroneous. And you have your answers a couple of posts back.

                                I think it is you who needs to bow gracefully and accept that you were wrong.

                                Although I have noticed that the ability to admit error does appear to be in short supply among some here on CARM.
                                You screwed up and you know it. Compounding your blunder with arrogance makes you look real small.


                                Signature? You want a signature? I'll show you a signature!
                                John Hancock

                                Comment

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