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As most of you are aware, we had a crash to forums and were down for over two days. We did have to do an upgrade to the vbulletin software to fix the forums and that has created changes, VB no longer provide the hybrid or threaded forums. There are some issues/changes to the forums we are not able to fix or change. Also note the link address change, please let friends and posters know of the changed link to the forums. For now this is the only link available, https://forums.carm.org/vb5/ but if clicking on forum on carm.org homepage it will now send you to this link. (edited to add https: now working.

Again, we are working through some of the posting and viewing issues to learn how to post with the changes, you will have to check and test the different features, icons that have changed. You may also want to go to profile settings,since many of the notifications, information in profile, also to update/edit your avatar by clicking on avatar space, pull down arrow next to login for user settings.

Edit to add "How to read forums, to make it easier."
Pull down arrow next to login name upper right select profile, or user settings when page opens to profile,select link in tab that says Account. Then select/choose options, go down to Conversation Detail Options, Select Display mode Posts, NOT Activity, that selection of Posts will make the pages of discussions go to last post on last page rather than out of order that happens if you choose activity threads. Then be sure to go to bottom and select SAVE Changes in your profile options. You can then follow discussions by going through the pages, to the last page having latest responses. Then click on the other links Privacy, Notifications, to select viewing options,the forums get easier if you open all the tabs or links in your profile, user settings and select options. To join Super Member, pull down arrow next to login name, select User Settings and then click on tab/link at top that says Subscriptions.

Thank you for your patience and God Bless.

Diane S
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  • Originally posted by rook View Post


    {snip pigeon chess distraction)

    .
    Here comes the usual off topic squawking when the Creo can't deal with the scientific evidence. Like clockwork.

    “We've been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of the culture” - creationist Pastor Ray Mummert on the Kitzmiller V. Dover trial

    Comment


    • Originally posted by D Laurier View Post

      What does it sound like I missed?
      The train of, of course. Educate yourself, you are being obtuse, yes?

      Evolution is promoted by its practitioners as more than mere science. Evolution is promulgated as an ideology, a secular religion—a full-fledged alternative to Christianity, with meaning and morality. ~ Michael Ruse, evolutionist

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Tim H View Post

        Here comes the usual off topic squawking when the Creo can't deal with the scientific evidence. Like clockwork.
        The Evo Black Knight keeps bleeding, does anyone have a tourniquet?
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKhEw7nD9C4
        Evolution is promoted by its practitioners as more than mere science. Evolution is promulgated as an ideology, a secular religion—a full-fledged alternative to Christianity, with meaning and morality. ~ Michael Ruse, evolutionist

        Comment


        • Originally posted by rook View Post


          (Squawk! Squawk! Insult! Squawk!)

          Like clockwork.
          “We've been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of the culture” - creationist Pastor Ray Mummert on the Kitzmiller V. Dover trial

          Comment


          • Originally posted by D Laurier View Post
            And?

            Yes... And?

            How kind of you. I have never learned this amazing skill before. Please teach me. And then teach me how to walk, and how to feed myself. You are so wonderful...
            Seriously. Your arrogant condescension is profoundly misplaced.
            My comments simply mirror what has been posted from your end. How about answering the original question, if you are interested of course. I have simply highlighted the pattern of behaviour that sidesteps the question by launching a personal attack. Try putting some substance into your response.
            In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe (Hebrews 1:1-2).

            Comment


            • Originally posted by MarkSC View Post
              . How about answering the original question, if you are interested of course.
              It was already answered. As per usual you ignored the answer and kept right on blathering.

              Try putting some substance into your response.
              Try practicing what you preach.
              “We've been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of the culture” - creationist Pastor Ray Mummert on the Kitzmiller V. Dover trial

              Comment


              • Originally posted by MarkSC View Post

                My comments simply mirror what has been posted from your end. How about answering the original question, if you are interested of course. I have simply highlighted the pattern of behaviour that sidesteps the question by launching a personal attack. Try putting some substance into your response.
                The problem here is that our evo-poser is not a scientist and his chronic confusion makes it difficult for him to reason succinctly. Logic, like science is not his friend.
                Evolution is promoted by its practitioners as more than mere science. Evolution is promulgated as an ideology, a secular religion—a full-fledged alternative to Christianity, with meaning and morality. ~ Michael Ruse, evolutionist

                Comment


                • I have stated what is needed in your response. I have a number of your posts in my notifications that I am going to ignore because you are just wasting our time with allegations and blather.
                  In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe (Hebrews 1:1-2).

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by MarkSC View Post
                    I have stated what is needed in your response. I have a number of your posts in my notifications that I am going to ignore because you are just wasting our time with allegations and blather.
                    It is certainly your right to ask questions then go LA LA LA! and ignore when you don't like the answers provided. Such evasion makes a person look like the north end of a southbound horse but hey, whatever floats yer boat.
                    “We've been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of the culture” - creationist Pastor Ray Mummert on the Kitzmiller V. Dover trial

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Tim H View Post
                      It is certainly your right to ask questions then go LA LA LA! and ignore when you don't like the answers provided. Such evasion makes a person look like the north end of a southbound horse but hey, whatever floats yer boat.
                      Says the evo-poser who routinely looks like the north end of a southbound horse. The irony.

                      Evolution is promoted by its practitioners as more than mere science. Evolution is promulgated as an ideology, a secular religion—a full-fledged alternative to Christianity, with meaning and morality. ~ Michael Ruse, evolutionist

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by MarkSC View Post
                        You have just said that lungs appeared fully working. Just because they are in an ape does not change anything. How about explaining this at the sub cellular level, with details about how new information is being placed within the DNA rapidly?
                        Rapidly? Why rapidly? How different are human lungs from chimpanzee lungs? How long since the ancestors of the two species separated? Unless you can tell us how large (or small) the change in information was and how long it took, then your "rapidly" is just hot air.

                        Where is your data? Where are your measurements? Show us what you have beyond your own personal opinion please.

                        rossum
                        The ultimate truth is that there is no ultimate truth.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by rossum View Post

                          Rapidly? Why rapidly? How different are human lungs from chimpanzee lungs? How long since the ancestors of the two species separated? Unless you can tell us how large (or small) the change in information was and how long it took, then your "rapidly" is just hot air.

                          Where is your data? Where are your measurements? Show us what you have beyond your own personal opinion please.

                          rossum
                          These are the questions you were supposed to be answering. I started the topic and now you are trying to reverse the questions because you are struggling to come up with a convincing response to the original questions.

                          You assumptions about the close relationship between chimps and humans is so dated, last century in fact. So please, when you respond with dignity, try to include some up to date references and some evidence that you have studied and understood the counter claims.
                          In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe (Hebrews 1:1-2).

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by MarkSC View Post
                            You assumptions about the close relationship between chimps and humans is so dated, last century in fact. So please, when you respond with dignity, try to include some up to date references and some evidence that you have studied and understood the counter claims.
                            OK, here's a "this century" reference.

                            Genetic evidence for complex speciation of humans and chimpanzees
                            Patterson et al
                            Nature, Vol. 441, No. 7097. (17 May 2006)

                            Abstract: The genetic divergence time between two species varies substantially across the genome, conveying important information about the timing and process of speciation. Here we develop a framework for studying this variation and apply it to about 20 million base pairs of aligned sequence from humans, chimpanzees, gorillas and more distantly related primates. Human–chimpanzee genetic divergence varies from less than 84% to more than 147% of the average, a range of more than 4 million years. Our analysis also shows that human–chimpanzee speciation occurred less than 6.3 million years ago and probably more recently, conflicting with some interpretations of ancient fossils. Most strikingly, chromosome X shows an extremely young genetic divergence time, close to the genome minimum along nearly its entire length. These unexpected features would be explained if the human and chimpanzee lineages initially diverged, then later exchanged genes before separating permanently.
                            Your turn. Please provide a "this century" scientific reference with evidence humans and chimps don't share a common ancestor.
                            “We've been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of the culture” - creationist Pastor Ray Mummert on the Kitzmiller V. Dover trial

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Tim H View Post

                              OK, here's a "this century" reference.



                              Your turn. Please provide a "this century" scientific reference with evidence humans and chimps don't share a common ancestor.
                              These unexpected features would be explained if the human and chimpanzee lineages initially diverged, then later exchanged genes before separating permanently.

                              Now let's apply real science and mathematics.

                              It is said that our closes relative is a chimp, the difference in our DNA is 1.5%. Let’s give the unknown common ancestor the same value. If there are three billion base pairs in a human 1 ˝% calculates to 45 million base pairs or 15 million codons. Sometime during 2012 scientist reported that 1% of the DNA strand codes for codons. So 1% of 15M is 150K
                              Is it possible that 150k codons can line up in the right order to ensure functional proteins?
                              Let’s make the number smaller. Let’s analyze 0.001 of 150k = 150
                              What is probability of getting 150 amino acids to line up in the right order? There are 20 amino acids that are used to build proteins. = 20 equally possible choices.
                              20 possible amino acids, 150 amino acid long. 20^150 = 1x10^195.
                              That is for 150 codons 450 nucleotides, from 3billion nucleotides.
                              A 450 nucleotide mutation would be 0.00000015% mutation [3 billion nucleotides].
                              Anything greater than 10^20 is a mathematical impossibility.

                              Also would there be enough time for 0.00000015% mutation to occur.

                              Dembski was able to calculate this number by multiplying three relevant factor together: the number of elementary particles [10^80] times the number of seconds since the big bang [10^16] times the number of possible interactions per second [10^43**. His calculation fixed the total number of events that could have taken place in the observable universe since the origin of the universe at 10^139.

                              A 0.00000015% mutation has the probability of one chance in 10^195 of occurring, but according to Dembski the total number of events that could have occurred since the beginning of the universe is 10^139. Not even close.

                              That article you posted should have started of with "Once upon a time."

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by towerwatchman View Post

                                These unexpected features would be explained if the human and chimpanzee lineages initially diverged, then later exchanged genes before separating permanently.

                                Now let's apply real science and mathematics.

                                (snip same spammed drivel)
                                You've already seen this bit of plagiarized stupidity refuted the last dozen times you C&Ped it. Your probability calculations make the demonstrably wrong assumption all the amino acids had to fall together all at once from a scrambled mixture. That's not how evolution works. Evolution is a continual process using feedback which in each generation makes small modifications to previously existing and working variations.

                                GIGO for you yet again. I will say you are consistent in your ignorant failures.
                                Last edited by Tim H; 08-12-17, 11:55 PM.
                                “We've been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of the culture” - creationist Pastor Ray Mummert on the Kitzmiller V. Dover trial

                                Comment

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