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The Role of Education?

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  • #61
    Originally posted by wincam View Post
    actually exactly the opposite is actually, really and truly the case - is this just another case to cover up all the cover ups, cons, fakes and frauds
    Now you are calling me, a scientist, a liar. Allow me to explain to you that lying is extremely frowned upon in the science community. Scientists caught lying in their publications tend to wind up being truck drivers and such. Wincam, I told you who one of the frauds is. You can check out Sungenis' credentials right here on the internet and verify for yourself that his "PhD" is from an uncredited institution that gives diplomas for all sorts of nonsense. You can verify for yourself that he does not have any physics degrees from accredited institutions nor does his vitae appear to show that he has taken even a basic course in the subject. There are several other frauds - Hovind, Baugh, in the creationism business which you could find out for yourself simply by Google search. Moreover, even for creationists with legitimate credentials, for most of them it is quite easy to find instances of claims they make that they should have had the expertise to know were false. Dr. Henry Morris, for instance, had a PhD in hydraulic engineering yet he claimed there was a water vapor canopy around the earth that contributed to the waters of Noah's flood. He should have had the expertise to know that any canopy sufficiently large as to contribute significantly to a global flood would have cooked the earth in well less than 1600 years. I knew that and my doctorate is in biology.

    - the global flood has stood and stands the test of time with "the millions of dead things buried in sedimentary rock layers laid down by water all over the earth"
    There likely are millions of fossils but the idea that they were buried by a global flood is nonsense. To begin with, such a catastrophe should have buried entire animals and we should be finding mostly intact vertebrate skeletons minus, of course, what was eroded away before the fossils are found. This is quite definitely not the case. There is an large bone bed in Montana where the bones of a herd of dinosaurs were disarticulated before they were buried. Large bones are found on one end of the field, small bones on the other. They are buried in 18 inches of sediment from what obviously was a local flood. Moreover, the bones are partially rotted meaning they lay on the ground months or years before they were buried.

    Moreover, there are trace fossils in the sedimentary rock back at least to the Cambrian.
    They testify that the sediments that contain them could not have been produced in the middle of any flood, much less a global one. The most obvious of these is footprints. These dinosaur footprints which have a mile of sedimentary rock both above and below them testify to the fact that there could never have been a global flood.

    whereas the geological column, it seems, exists only in imagination and faulty textbooks
    Now you're repeating the lies of the professional creodeceptionists. You should check your facts before posting such nonsense.

    - via google see [Fact vs Faith]textbooks - wincam
    Wincam, you made the claim. It is your responsibility to provide the link that supports it. Keep this up and I'm going to complain to CARMadmin.
    Last edited by trubadoor; 06-23-15, 02:27 AM.
    May the One True God of Creation bless you with the ability to tell fact from falsehood and lead you to the truth.

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by trubadoor View Post
      Now you are calling me, a scientist, a liar. Allow me to explain to you that lying is extremely frowned upon in the science community. Scientists caught lying in their publications tend to wind up being truck drivers and such. Wincam, I told you who one of the frauds is. You can check out Sungenis' credentials right here on the internet and verify for yourself that his "PhD" is from an uncredited institution that gives diplomas for all sorts of nonsense. You can verify for yourself that he does not have any physics degrees from accredited institutions nor does his vitae appear to show that he has taken even a basic course in the subject. There are several other frauds - Hovind, Baugh, in the creationism business which you could find out for yourself simply by Google search. Moreover, even for creationists with legitimate credentials, for most of them it is quite easy to find instances of claims they make that they should have had the expertise to know were false. Dr. Henry Morris, for instance, had a PhD in hydraulic engineering yet he claimed there was a water vapor canopy around the earth that contributed to the waters of Noah's flood. He should have had the expertise to know that any canopy sufficiently large as to contribute significantly to a global flood would have cooked the earth in well less than 1600 years. I knew that and my doctorate is in biology.

      There likely are millions of fossils but the idea that they were buried by a global flood is nonsense. To begin with, such a catastrophe should have buried entire animals and we should be finding mostly intact vertebrate skeletons minus, of course, what was eroded away before the fossils are found. This is quite definitely not the case. There is an large bone bed in Montana where the bones of a herd of dinosaurs were disarticulated before they were buried. Large bones are found on one end of the field, small bones on the other. They are buried in 18 inches of sediment from what obviously was a local flood. Moreover, the bones are partially rotted meaning they lay on the ground months or years before they were buried.

      Moreover, there are trace fossils in the sedimentary rock back at least to the Cambrian.
      They testify that the sediments that contain them could not have been produced in the middle of any flood, much less a global one. The most obvious of these is footprints. These dinosaur footprints which have a mile of sedimentary rock both above and below them testify to the fact that there could never have been a global flood.

      Now you're repeating the lies of the professional creodeceptionists. You should check your facts before posting such nonsense.

      Wincam, you made the claim. It is your responsibility to provide the link that supports it. Keep this up and I'm going to complain to CARMadmin.

      as for your whiter than white white coated scientists and yourself also perhaps but hopefully not why are you not complaining and ensuring that all the errors and lies that have been in school textbooks for years have still not been removed - btw not all scientists are equally knowledgeable even though equally qualified - why not address their knowledge as precedence to their qualification and get rid of pseudo science and scientists - btw it seems you are discriminating as are many others according to
      [Quick....lets discriminate/creationists] and [The Illusion of Academic Freedom] and also all via google [The slaughter of the Dissidents] - does it really matter in the end but sadly it seems it does to many which College/University qualification is superior - btw never mind belittling Dr. Morris and other qualified creationists, how has it been and still is proclaimed in some pseudo science and accepted that once upon a time billions of years ago when there was nothing this nothing expanded and a big bang exploded this nothing into everything - this has been in the textbooks for years - maybe some qualifications are a handicap after all - wincam
      Last edited by wincam; 06-23-15, 03:44 PM.

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by wincam View Post
        as for your whiter than white white coated scientists and yourself also perhaps but hopefully not why are you not complaining and ensuring that all the errors and lies that have been in school textbooks for years have still not been removed - btw not all scientists are equally knowledgeable even though equally qualified - why not address their knowledge as precedence to their qualification and get rid of pseudo science and scientists
        Pseudoscience, wincam, is what you've been suckered into believing. You can see that footprint for yourself and many more at a tracksite outside Tuba City, Arizona. You can see for yourself that I am not lying about its position a mile above sedimentary rock and below another mile of the same. The other tracks in that region are harder to get to but I can assure you the people who found them weren't lying either. Note the formations of the Grand Staircase. Some of the formations below the Tuba City (Kayenta Formation) tracksite have animal tracks in them as do most of the formations above it. You can do google search to find some of those tracks but I know you won't since you don't seem to be intelligent enough even to figure out how to give links supporting your claims. So I'll be happy to find them for you. It will take a while, though, as CARM allows only two links per post. How did those tracks get into those formations if there was a global flood. Considering 40 days of rain should have been enough to drown a duck there should not have been any animals left to leave tracks, certainly not thousands of animals known to have left their tracks in sedimentary rock around the world.

        - btw it seems you are discriminating as are many others according to
        [Quick....lets discriminate/creationists] and [The Illusion of Academic Freedom] and also all via google [The slaughter of the Dissidents] - does it really matter in the end but sadly it seems it does to many which College/University qualification is superior -
        Already looked at those claims. You should too but not just the creationist websites which give a creationist spin to their claims. And discriminating against propaganda and falsehood is no vice. That's what intelligent, informed people do.

        btw never mind belittling Dr. Morris and other qualified creationists,
        So you don't want to know how they are duping you into believing falsehoods. Might I suggest you open your mind and look at both sides of the issue, not just the side that is feeding you false information.

        how has it been and still is proclaimed in some pseudo science and accepted that once upon a time billions of years ago when there was nothing this nothing expanded and a big bang exploded this nothing into everything - this has been in the textbooks for years - maybe some qualifications are a handicap after all - wincam
        If it came from nothing it is reasonable to assume God created it from nothing. Did you know that it was a scientist-priest, Georges Lemaître, who first hypothesized the Big Bang. Or do you believe priests are liars too?
        May the One True God of Creation bless you with the ability to tell fact from falsehood and lead you to the truth.

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by trubadoor View Post
          Pseudoscience, wincam, is what you've been suckered into believing. You can see that footprint for yourself and many more at a tracksite outside Tuba City, Arizona. You can see for yourself that I am not lying about its position a mile above sedimentary rock and below another mile of the same. The other tracks in that region are harder to get to but I can assure you the people who found them weren't lying either. Note the formations of the Grand Staircase. Some of the formations below the Tuba City (Kayenta Formation) tracksite have animal tracks in them as do most of the formations above it. You can do google search to find some of those tracks but I know you won't since you don't seem to be intelligent enough even to figure out how to give links supporting your claims. So I'll be happy to find them for you. It will take a while, though, as CARM allows only two links per post. How did those tracks get into those formations if there was a global flood. Considering 40 days of rain should have been enough to drown a duck there should not have been any animals left to leave tracks, certainly not thousands of animals known to have left their tracks in sedimentary rock around the world.

          Already looked at those claims. You should too but not just the creationist websites which give a creationist spin to their claims. And discriminating against propaganda and falsehood is no vice. That's what intelligent, informed people do.

          So you don't want to know how they are duping you into believing falsehoods. Might I suggest you open your mind and look at both sides of the issue, not just the side that is feeding you false information.

          If it came from nothing it is reasonable to assume God created it from nothing. Did you know that it was a scientist-priest, Georges Lemaître, who first hypothesized the Big Bang. Or do you believe priests are liars too?

          Amazing who and what will be accepted - so you should know that both Galileo and Lemaitre are and were wrong and it takes the like of Sungenis to prove it - go on then tell us all you accept there was a big bang that created everything out of nothing - wincam

          Comment


          • #65
            Originally posted by wincam View Post
            Amazing who and what will be accepted - so you should know that both Galileo and Lemaitre are and were wrong and it takes the like of Sungenis to prove it
            Galileo and Lemaitre were honest astronomers. Sungenis is a fraud, which you would know if you knew how much education it takes to be a competent astronomer and how little science education Sungenis actually has. You could find out if you truly wanted to know the truth but you don't. You want to believe an obvious fraud because you want to believe his interpretation of the Bible. I take it you never went to college, wincam, and don't have a clue as to what it takes to acquire expertise in any science discipline.

            - go on then tell us all you accept there was a big bang that created everything out of nothing - wincam
            God would have created everything out of nothing. Deny that and you are, in essence, denying God.
            May the One True God of Creation bless you with the ability to tell fact from falsehood and lead you to the truth.

            Comment


            • #66
              Originally posted by trubadoor View Post
              Galileo and Lemaitre were honest astronomers. Sungenis is a fraud, which you would know if you knew how much education it takes to be a competent astronomer and how little science education Sungenis actually has. You could find out if you truly wanted to know the truth but you don't. You want to believe an obvious fraud because you want to believe his interpretation of the Bible. I take it you never went to college, wincam, and don't have a clue as to what it takes to acquire expertise in any science discipline.

              God would have created everything out of nothing. Deny that and you are, in essence, denying God.

              there is a difference and the difference makes all the difference - it is not exactly the same only different that nothing created something if not everything out of nothing - imho any scientist or anyone else who presumes to know more or better than God is a fraud - btw thank you very much but my further education was curtailed because of a war and other unforeseen circumstances but unlike many others my brain was not curtailed which is clearly seen or I would have accepted and been mesmerised by non science and nonsense and imho a degree in non science and nonsense is not to be cherished or desired and is worth less than no degree but a good non pickled brain like Sungenis etc - I learnt, unlike most others it seems not to rely on individual opinions,conjectures and conclusions and the inflation of ego but to follow the sound advice given to consult the advice of the experts and specialists qualified in all[repeat all] the disciplines of theology and science and for Catholics these may be found together and united at www.kolbecenter.org and www.daylightorigins.com - go there and come home now - wincam

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by wincam View Post
                there is a difference and the difference makes all the difference - it is not exactly the same only different that nothing created something if not everything out of nothing - imho any scientist or anyone else who presumes to know more or better than God is a fraud - btw thank you very much but my further education was curtailed because of a war and other unforeseen circumstances but unlike many others my brain was not curtailed which is clearly seen or I would have accepted and been mesmerised by non science and nonsense and imho a degree in non science and nonsense is not to be cherished or desired and is worth less than no degree but a good non pickled brain like Sungenis etc - I learnt, unlike most others it seems not to rely on individual opinions,conjectures and conclusions and the inflation of ego but to follow the sound advice given to consult the advice of the experts and specialists qualified in all[repeat all] the disciplines of theology and science and for Catholics these may be found together and united at www.kolbecenter.org and www.daylightorigins.com - go there and come home now - wincam
                You seem to be calling yourself a fraud here, wincam. Why would you do that?
                May the One True God of Creation bless you with the ability to tell fact from falsehood and lead you to the truth.

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by trubadoor View Post
                  You seem to be calling yourself a fraud here, wincam. Why would you do that?

                  frauds, as you have just proved yourself to be and dragged a whole lot of so called highly qualified scientists with you, are those like Galileo and your just quoted Lemaitre who presume to know more and better than God who clearly tells us and is obvious to some except to those crippled and handicapped and misled by degrees in pseudoscience that teaches that a big bang created everything presuming to know more and better than God who clearly tells us a big bang will destroy everything, as big bangs naturally and obviously do [2Peter3:10]and all highly qualified scientists will perish not knowing this and not being able provide against it - btw it seems even your footprints are a modern fraud - come home now - wincam
                  Last edited by wincam; 06-24-15, 04:58 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by wincam View Post
                    frauds, as you have just proved yourself to be and dragged a whole lot of so called highly qualified scientists with you, are those like Galileo and your just quoted Lemaitre who presume to know more and better than God who clearly tells us and is obvious to some except to those crippled and handicapped and misled by degrees in pseudoscience that teaches that a big bang created everything presuming to know more and better than God who clearly tells us a big bang will destroy everything, as big bangs naturally and obviously do [2Peter3:10]and all highly qualified scientists will perish not knowing this and not being able provide against it
                    Nonsensical word salad. Is that the best you can do?

                    - btw it seems even your footprints are a modern fraud - come home now - wincam
                    Not the Tuba City footprints. I saw those myself. They quite clearly are dinosaur footprints. I also saw some smaller footprints while rafting down the Colorado River. They came off the wall of the Grand Canyon, probably the Coconino Formation but they were in loose rock so I can't say for sure. What is a fraud is the so-called human footprints creodeceptionists claim to have found in Texas. That's been documented.by Glen Kuban, a devout and honest Christian.
                    May the One True God of Creation bless you with the ability to tell fact from falsehood and lead you to the truth.

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Originally posted by HumbleThinker View Post
                      Man this place is deserted; let's try to stir something up. What should be the role of education? This can be in relation to the child, society, whatever.
                      The role of education is to educate the child to read so that he can read the Bible.
                      I know my need for Christ

                      "But the evolution of intelligence presumes qualities that are useless until they are realized. And how in the world can some kind of chain in adaptability be appealed to in this case?"

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by PRS View Post
                        The role of education is to educate the child to read so that he can read the Bible.
                        "is"?

                        I think you mean "should be", in your opinion at least. A world where education starts and stops by the time a child is capable of reading the bible, is not one I want to live in.
                        It doesn't matter how beautiful your theory is, it doesn't matter how smart you are. If it doesn't agree with experiment, it's wrong. - Richard Feynman

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