Announcement

Collapse

Message to all users:

https://carm.org/forum-rules

Super Member Subscription
https://carm.org/carm-super-members-banner-ad-signup

As most of you are aware, we had a crash to forums and were down for over two days a while back. We did have to do an upgrade to the vbulletin software to fix the forums and that has created changes, VB no longer provide the hybrid or threaded forums. There are some issues/changes to the forums we are not able to fix or change. Also note the link address change, please let friends and posters know of the changed link to the forums. For now this is the only link available, https://forums.carm.org/vb5/ but if clicking on forum on carm.org homepage it will now send you to this link. (edited to add https: now working.

Again, we are working through some of the posting and viewing issues to learn how to post with the changes, you will have to check and test the different features, icons that have changed. You may also want to go to profile settings,since many of the notifications, information in profile, also to update/edit your avatar by clicking on avatar space, pull down arrow next to login for user settings.

Edit to add "How to read forums, to make it easier."
Pull down arrow next to login name upper right select profile, or user settings when page opens to profile,select link in tab that says Account. Then select/choose options, go down to Conversation Detail Options, Select Display mode Posts, NOT Activity, that selection of Posts will make the pages of discussions go to last post on last page rather than out of order that happens if you choose activity threads. Then be sure to go to bottom and select SAVE Changes in your profile options. You can then follow discussions by going through the pages, to the last page having latest responses. Then click on the other links Privacy, Notifications, to select viewing options,the forums get easier if you open all the tabs or links in your profile, user settings and select options. To join Super Member, pull down arrow next to login name, select User Settings and then click on tab/link at top that says Subscriptions.

Thank you for your patience and God Bless.

Diane S
https://carm.org/forum-rules
See more
See less

Are U.S. schools failing?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Our schools fail because basically parents see school as that place their children go to from 8 to 3, those hours not in front of the play station or cell phone texting, tweeting, and instagramming.

    Or in other words, it really isn't the schools.
    Last edited by Heraclitus; 04-19-15, 07:44 PM.
    Song of Solomon 4:5: Thy two breasts are like two fawns That are twins of a gazelle, Which feed among the lilies.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Heraclitus View Post
      Or in other words, it really isn't the schools.
      I agree, but put much of the blame on standardized testing and the lack of transparency involved with it.

      Washington Post article on test is here:-
      Educators alarmed by some questions on N.Y. Common Core tests

      Topic is reading test. Actual questions not given, but there are some extracts from reading passages.
      First quote from article:-
      An elementary principal of a well-regarded elementary school in an affluent, “gold-coast” district wrote the following:

      These three days of ELA have been torture – I had only 23 students opt out and I had at least 3 times that number in tears. If we were permitted to talk about the content, it would be over so fast. Folks would be horrified at the vocabulary, the reading levels and the ambiguity of the questions. I was unable to answer at least 25 percent of them.
      If a teacher finds questions ambiguous, that suggests strongly that they have been poorly designed or tested. Only remedy is to make the entire test public. Perhaps this will show the testing company is faultless, but perhaps not.

      The other criticism is that students are easily discouraged by difficult questions, succumb to panic and/or test anxiety, and do not perform at their true level.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by Keith C View Post
        I agree, but put much of the blame on standardized testing and the lack of transparency involved with it.

        Washington Post article on test is here:-
        Educators alarmed by some questions on N.Y. Common Core tests

        Topic is reading test. Actual questions not given, but there are some extracts from reading passages.
        First quote from article:-

        If a teacher finds questions ambiguous, that suggests strongly that they have been poorly designed or tested. Only remedy is to make the entire test public. Perhaps this will show the testing company is faultless, but perhaps not.

        The other criticism is that students are easily discouraged by difficult questions, succumb to panic and/or test anxiety, and do not perform at their true level.
        Yet the reason why the standardize test is because we are seeing the end result of uneducated kids, which goes back to my point.
        Song of Solomon 4:5: Thy two breasts are like two fawns That are twins of a gazelle, Which feed among the lilies.

        Comment


        • #19
          This NY Times opinion piece claims that schools are in fact succeeding very well - but at teaching at least one wrong idea.

          Why Our Children Don’t Think There Are Moral Facts

          I think the problem is over-simplification. As article points out 'fact' vs 'opinion' is more complex than schools are teaching. But is 2nd grade the right place to introduce complications?

          Perhaps the solution is to revisit the 'fact vs opinion' question several times before students graduate HS.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by grog View Post
            For once, I agree with you. They want to take the common core down to 3 years old, with testing.
            I have spoken with local politicians. They do the typical, "yeah, yeah yeah" head nod...and then ignore me.

            Every one of these nincompoops should come walk a mile in our shoes for two weeks. I'm talking about the politicians, and I don't care what party--all of them, the whole lot. Two weeks. That's all it would take for them to scrap those tests, or at least reconsider very strongly. Because I honestly think they come in to school, read a book to a class that's relatively quiet for six minutes and think, look, those kids can sit still. They can do it.
            One thing have I asked of the LORD... that I may dwell in the house of the LORD all the days of my life, to gaze upon the beauty of the LORD and to inquire in his temple.--Psalm 27:4

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by WendyWrites View Post
              I just heard of a school where children were taking ketchup packets home from their school lunches. To mix it with water and make "ketchup soup" for dinner.

              When the politicians make their plans for standardized testing, they don't take any of this into consideration--all the PARENTING modern teachers do. It sounds like so much more "teacher whining" but it really is not. As the American family has disintegrated, schools are expected to pick up the slack. To no one's shock, students are floundering. But then, also to no one's shock, they are floundering academically. So here come the politicians tightening the screws on teachers--saying take these hurting children and teach them MORE, FASTER, and YOUNGER. Do it, or lose your job.
              My aunt is a teacher at a public school in South Carolina, and I wholeheartedly agree with everything you're saying here. In her class of nearly forty students, less than 10% live with both biological parents. The majority live with mom and her parade of new boyfriends, or mom, step-dad and assorted step- and half-siblings. Others actually live with their boyfriend or girlfriend's family, or sort of jump from place to place to stay with assorted relatives and friends. My aunt said she'd estimate 15% of her students have parents who are in jail, based on disclosure from the students, at least a couple get pregnant every year and more than 50% are on the school's free hot lunch list, a service which is either state or locally funded. These kids basically raise themselves and many don't have any adult in their life who actually takes care of them, supports their educational pursuits, gets after them about homework. There's only so much a teacher can do in these situations. Kids can't concentrate on studies when they've got little to no support or structure at home. How well would any of us sit a test if we weren't sure where our parents were and when we're going to have our next meal.


              The most excellent, dedicated, professional teachers I know--and I teach in a top-notch district--are telling their children NOT to go into education.

              And that is scary, folks.
              Yes. That's terrible because people who go into teaching aren't all about the money, they usually care about the kids, and for these people to be discouraged and give up means so many students will be missing out.
              May we all always remember to
              Love People
              more than Profit :rolleyes:
              Judge Not, Lest We Be Judged
              Follow the Golden Rule
              Respect the Dignity of All
              And Forgive, As We Are Forgiven

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by grog View Post
                Are US school failing?
                ABSOLUTELY NOT. they're doing an EXCELLENT JOB of training Students from OTHER COUNTRIES to successfully "eat our lunch".

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by HelloKaren View Post
                  My aunt is a teacher at a public school in South Carolina, and I wholeheartedly agree with everything you're saying here. In her class of nearly forty students, less than 10% live with both biological parents. The majority live with mom and her parade of new boyfriends, or mom, step-dad and assorted step- and half-siblings. Others actually live with their boyfriend or girlfriend's family, or sort of jump from place to place to stay with assorted relatives and friends. My aunt said she'd estimate 15% of her students have parents who are in jail, based on disclosure from the students, at least a couple get pregnant every year and more than 50% are on the school's free hot lunch list, a service which is either state or locally funded. These kids basically raise themselves and many don't have any adult in their life who actually takes care of them, supports their educational pursuits, gets after them about homework. There's only so much a teacher can do in these situations. Kids can't concentrate on studies when they've got little to no support or structure at home. How well would any of us sit a test if we weren't sure where our parents were and when we're going to have our next meal.




                  Yes. That's terrible because people who go into teaching aren't all about the money, they usually care about the kids, and for these people to be discouraged and give up means so many students will be missing out.
                  What grade does your aunt teach?
                  ********
                  cassie
                  ********
                  Fundies say the darndest things - simplicio

                  Every saint has a past, every sinner has a future.

                  Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that.” - Martin Luther King Jr.

                  for today, for this moment... it is well with my soul.

                  as long as there is life, there is hope.

                  what unites us is stronger than what divides us...

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by grog View Post
                    I am interested in exploring a variety of issues pertaining to US public education. Since about the mid-90s and the passage of ESEA, we have been in an era of educational reform. In 2001, the Bush v.2 administration passed No Child Left Behind with some very ambitious goals to reform education by 2014. 2014 has come and gone.

                    What has NCLB accomplished? Has it been successful? What are the demonstrable results?

                    NCLB was a test-based accountability system: has that worked? What are the main assumptions undergirding test-based accountability?

                    Are US school failing? By what indicators do we determine how US schools are doing?

                    How does the Common Core fit into this context? What is the desired goal and what are the assumptions of that goal?

                    What is the purpose of the Smarter Balanced and PARCC tests? How do these tests fit in? What are these tests supposed to do?

                    Full disclosure: I have thought about these issues and have strong opinions on them. I am hoping to find arguments that challenge my positions.

                    exactly which schools are in questions but in the main most schools in USA/UK/EUROPE etc are not teaching the truth or facts for RE education for Catholics see newsletters at www.proecclesia.com - for Junior general education via google see [Fact vs Faith/textbooks]Hovind for Senior general education see www.EvolutionvsGod.com - wincam

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Keith C View Post
                      ... With so many students moving from state to state as parents relocate, national standards are desirable. These do not seem too difficult and why should we need to keep dumbing things down?
                      National standards, central government control, is according to EPHESIANS 2, and GALATIANS, and REVELATION, et al,
                      controlled by the prince of the power of the air -
                      thus
                      has led to continued dumbing down in almost all schools, with no reason needed nor given. It is the natural course of the world system, long time practiced and expected the last 2 generations,

                      and continuing to get worse this and the next generation. It has made most everything (and most everyone involved) more difficult than ever before to stay unstained from an evil and adulterous mankind.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        The students from other countries study long hours with good habits and better diet

                        than most U.S. students have access to (by governance and parents choice and other societal factors harming the children of all ages)

                        Some U.S. students are prevailing, doing well, by their own good study habits and diet different from the others, and from/because of less government intrusion in their lives.

                        Parenting is more important that the school they go to, and many parents grew up without parents, never learning what is good.

                        The 'common' government stuff, has routinely and generously made things bad to bad to worse - the more money they get (every year for over 30 years) , the worse it gets ....

                        Originally posted by Bob Carabbio View Post

                        ABSOLUTELY NOT. they're doing an EXCELLENT JOB of training Students from OTHER COUNTRIES to successfully "eat our lunch".

                        Comment

                        Working...
                        X