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  • #16
    Originally posted by Calvert View Post

    Of course God is the cause of everything.
    Not according to the bible

    1 John 2:16 (KJV)
    16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

    James 1:13-17 (KJV)
    13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
    14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
    15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
    16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.
    17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

    1 Corinthians 10:13 (KJV)
    13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.
    Let God's word speak and everyman be silent

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by PeanutGallery View Post
      What has God laid out for man to look for him?
      Love. He is Love, He is Spirit and that Spirit is Love, perfect undefiled holy pure and without sin. That is what Love is, that is who God is, and that is who man is who is of God and one in Him His temple, He in you and you in Him as one. The kingdom of God doesn't come with observation it is within you and either one has the same anointing from God that is Love that Jesus had from Him or one doesn't. Christ means to be anointed of God. One is anointed of God, Love, which is Christ in you or one is not. Once one has receive the Christ, Gods anointing, the look is over for He is manifest in you. That is what His salvation is.
      The human side is to claim the promises of God. The divine side is to receive them.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by reformedguy View Post

        So He works ALL things out but is not the cause? LOL Apparently this conversation is above your pay grade.
        Apparently you still don't know what you are talking about.

        Example Israel's failure to receive the promises which according to scripture a result of their own unbelief

        God used it to bring the gospel to the gentiles



        Let God's word speak and everyman be silent

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by GaryMac View Post

          Love. He is Love, ...
          How did God demonstrate his Love?
          1Peter 1:18,19 Redeemed ... with the precious blood of Christ

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by TomL View Post

            Apparently you still don't know what you are talking about.

            Example Israel's failure to receive the promises which according to scripture a result of their own unbelief

            God used it to bring the gospel to the gentiles


            So He works out ALL things but is not the cause? Kindly adress your illogical statement.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by TomL View Post

              Not according to the bible

              1 John 2:16 (KJV)
              16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

              James 1:13-17 (KJV)
              13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
              14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
              15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
              16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.
              17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

              1 Corinthians 10:13 (KJV)
              13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.
              The verses you listed do not address God's causation. John 1:3 addresses God's causation.

              John 1:3
              "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."

              ​Is God not the cause of what He made?
              Nothing can exist apart from the power of God.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by reformedguy View Post

                So He works out ALL things but is not the cause? Kindly adress your illogical statement.
                I don't want to sound like a broken record, but it's why I say that Providence always breaks the tie. Foreknowledge without Providence is Open Theism or Deism, and no one wants to go there; but Foreknowledge with Providence would by all accounts be Determinism...

                To most Christians, this is cut and dry...
                New-Protestant Reformation ~ Dec 2009 - ____

                I'm a Christian. An Evangelical, Reformed, Independent Fundamental Baptist; a New Calvinist...

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by bruisermiller View Post

                  I don't want to sound like a broken record, but it's why I say that Providence always breaks the tie. Foreknowledge without Providence is Open Theism or Deism, and no one wants to go there; but Foreknowledge with Providence would by all accounts be Determinism...

                  To most Christians, this is cut and dry...
                  Could also be simple foreknowledge. God merely knows the future but in that sense has no control over it. How could He? He can't change what He foresees or what He foresaw before He changed it was not actually true. There are some many logic issues with that view it's mind boggling.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by reformedguy View Post
                    I see one of two options, either God simply observes the future and His foreknowledge is passive or God knows the future because it plays out just the way He planned it to. Ephesians 1:11 would seem to indicate the latter. Among many others. What say you?
                    God knows the future because it plays out just the way He planned it to. Gods foreknowledge is connected to His determinate counsel Acts 2:23

                    23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

                    Him, being delivered by the determinate will and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken and by wicked hands have crucified and slain. kj21

                    AMPC
                    This Jesus, when delivered up according to the definite and fixed purpose and settled plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and put out of the way [killing Him] by the hands of lawless and wicked men.


                    DLNT
                    this One, given-over by the determined purpose and foreknowledge of God, you killed, having fastened Him to a cross by the hand of Lawless ones,

                    ESV
                    this Jesus, delivered up according to the definite plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and killed by the hands of lawless men.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Calvert View Post

                      The verses you listed do not address God's causation. John 1:3 addresses God's causation.

                      John 1:3
                      "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."

                      ​Is God not the cause of what He made?
                      You are confounding issues

                      Confounding creation with God causing the actions of those he created

                      1 John 2:16 (KJV)
                      16 For all that
                      is
                      in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

                      James 1:13-17 (KJV)
                      13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
                      14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
                      15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
                      16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.
                      17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

                      1 Corinthians 10:13 (KJV)
                      13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God
                      is
                      faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear
                      it
                      .

                      Let God's word speak and everyman be silent

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by reformedguy View Post

                        So He works out ALL things but is not the cause? Kindly adress your illogical statement.
                        I already did and you ignored it

                        Apparently you still don't know what you are talking about.

                        Example Israel's failure to receive the promises which according to scripture a result of their own unbelief

                        God used it to bring the gospel to the gentiles

                        You did not deal with it
                        Let God's word speak and everyman be silent

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by reformedguy View Post

                          So He works out ALL things but is not the cause? Kindly adress your illogical statement.
                          Does not mean he causes all the things that he has to work out.
                          1Peter 1:18,19 Redeemed ... with the precious blood of Christ

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by TomL View Post

                            Apparently you still don't know what you are talking about.

                            Example Israel's failure to receive the promises which according to scripture a result of their own unbelief

                            God used it to bring the gospel to the gentiles


                            Their unbelief was the Lords doing Matt 21:42

                            42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?

                            1 Pet 2:7-8


                            7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,

                            8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

                            Lk 2:34


                            And Simeon blessed them, and said unto Mary his mother, Behold, this child is set for the fall and rising again of many in Israel; and for a sign which shall be spoken against;

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by TomL View Post

                              I already did and you ignored it

                              Apparently you still don't know what you are talking about.

                              Example Israel's failure to receive the promises which according to scripture a result of their own unbelief

                              God used it to bring the gospel to the gentiles

                              You did not deal with it
                              Would Israel's failure be part of God's plan to bring the gospel to the Gentiles? You know, working out ALL things? LOL

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by reformedguy View Post

                                Would Israel's failure be part of God's plan to bring the gospel to the Gentiles? You know, working out ALL things? LOL
                                Is there a reason you avoided the point ?



                                Example Israel's failure to receive the promises which according to scripture a result of their own unbelief


                                God used it to bring the gospel to the gentiles

                                You did not deal with it


                                Working all things out and causing all things are different actions




                                Let God's word speak and everyman be silent

                                Comment

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