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God gave the Holyland to His people Israel by divine covenant for all Etenity.

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  • #31
    Originally posted by GISMYS View Post
    Old Testament saints that worshiped in the temple practiced
    Judaism and are in heaven today!!
    I didn't say otherwise. Jesus the Messiah has come and gave us a new and better covenant and nailed the old covenant to the cross. Judaism does not save anymore than Hinduism once.Jeus fulfilled the law.

    He warned the Jews that if they did not believe Him they would die in their sins.

    Comment


    • #32
      I want you to know about this truth from God, dear brothers, so that you will not feel proud and start bragging. Yes, it is true that some of the Jews have set themselves against the Gospel now, but this will last only until all of you Gentiles have come to Christ—those of you who will. 26 And then """all Israel will be saved""".
      Do you remember what the prophets said about this? “There shall come out of Zion a Deliverer, and he shall turn the Jews from all ungodliness. 27 At that time I will take away their sins, just as I promised.”
      28 Now many of the Jews are enemies of the Gospel. They hate it. But this has been a benefit to you, for it has resulted in God’s giving his gifts to you Gentiles. Yet the Jews are still beloved of God because of his promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. 29 For God’s gifts and his call can never be withdrawn; he will never go back on his promises. 30 Once you were rebels against God, but when the Jews refused his gifts God was merciful to you instead. 31 And now the Jews are the rebels, but some day they, too, will share in God’s mercy upon you. 32 For God has given them all up to sin so that he could have mercy upon all alike.
      33 Oh, what a wonderful God we have! How great are his wisdom and knowledge and riches! How impossible it is for us to understand his decisions and his methods! 34 For who among us can know the mind of the Lord? Who knows enough to be his counselor and guide? 35 And who could ever offer to the Lord enough to induce him to act? 36 For everything comes from God alone. Everything lives by his power, and everything is for his glory. To him be glory evermore. Romans 11:25=36

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by GISMYS View Post
        I want you to know about this truth from God, dear brothers, so that you will not feel proud and start bragging. Yes, it is true that some of the Jews have set themselves against the Gospel now, but this will last only until all of you Gentiles have come to Christ—those of you who will. 26 And then """all Israel will be saved""".
        Do you remember what the prophets said about this? “There shall come out of Zion a Deliverer, and he shall turn the Jews from all ungodliness. 27 At that time I will take away their sins, just as I promised.”
        28 Now many of the Jews are enemies of the Gospel. They hate it. But this has been a benefit to you, for it has resulted in God’s giving his gifts to you Gentiles. Yet the Jews are still beloved of God because of his promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. 29 For God’s gifts and his call can never be withdrawn; he will never go back on his promises. 30 Once you were rebels against God, but when the Jews refused his gifts God was merciful to you instead. 31 And now the Jews are the rebels, but some day they, too, will share in God’s mercy upon you. 32 For God has given them all up to sin so that he could have mercy upon all alike.
        33 Oh, what a wonderful God we have! How great are his wisdom and knowledge and riches! How impossible it is for us to understand his decisions and his methods! 34 For who among us can know the mind of the Lord? Who knows enough to be his counselor and guide? 35 And who could ever offer to the Lord enough to induce him to act? 36 For everything comes from God alone. Everything lives by his power, and everything is for his glory. To him be glory evermore. Romans 11:25=36
        That has nothing to do with your false claim that Jews are saved without Jesus and the New Covenant. And it doesn't mean that Jews are excluded from Christ. Jesus told the Jews in John 14:6 "No one goes to the Father except through Me".

        John 14:36 Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.


        Jesus told some of those Jews still living during the time Paul wrote the letter to the Romans. And in the very first chapter of Romans Paul reminds all of them both Jew and Gentile the Gospel of Christ is the power of God to salvation to Jews and Gentiles. But ere you are stuck on verses out of context because you don't want to know what they mean because Jack Van Impe has convinced you to follow his lies and not the scriptures.

        And again I have already shown you how Paul told the blind Jews how to remove the blindness just as he did. But again you ignore it and Jesus words explaining how He is the only way to salvation. Not only that, but the entire books of the New Testament have to be thrown away for your false doctrine to even make horse sense. Hebrews, Galatians, Ephesians, Romans, ALL have to be discarded because they contradict your false doctrine. And the you have to ignore Jesus Himself.

        Comment


        • #34
          Why argue with God's Word?? My last post was nothing but God's Word. Romans 11:25-36

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by GISMYS View Post
            Why argue with God's Word?? My last post was nothing but God's Word. Romans 11:25-36
            Yeah that's what I asked you. Jesus said no one goes to the Father except through Him and said that unless people believe He is the Christ they will die in their ins. But you don't believe Jesus, you believe your own doctrine and try to falsely claim Romans 11 teaches Jesus is not the only way. It doesn't.

            Comment


            • #36
              God's Word speaks for its self!! Do I ineed help you understand what God is saying here??

              I want you to know about this truth from God, dear brothers, so that you will not feel proud and start bragging. Yes, it is true that some of the Jews have set themselves against the Gospel now, but this will last only until all of you Gentiles have come to Christ—those of you who will. 26 And then """all Israel will be saved""".

              Do you remember what the prophets said about this? “There shall come out of Zion a Deliverer, and he shall turn the Jews from all ungodliness. 27 At that time I will take away their sins, just as I promised.”

              28 Now many of the Jews are enemies of the Gospel. They hate it. But this has been a benefit to you, for it has resulted in God’s giving his gifts to you Gentiles. Yet the Jews are still beloved of God because of his promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. 29 For God’s gifts and his call can never be withdrawn; he will never go back on his promises. 30 Once you were rebels against God, but when the Jews refused his gifts God was merciful to you instead. 31 And now the Jews are the rebels, but some day they, too, will share in God’s mercy upon you. 32 For God has given them all up to sin so that he could have mercy upon all alike.

              33 Oh, what a wonderful God we have! How great are his wisdom and knowledge and riches! How impossible it is for us to understand his decisions and his methods! 34 For who among us can know the mind of the Lord? Who knows enough to be his counselor and guide? 35 And who could ever offer to the Lord enough to induce him to act? 36 For everything comes from God alone. Everything lives by his power, and everything is for his glory. To him be glory evermore. Romans 11:25=36

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by GISMYS View Post
                God's Word speaks for its self!!
                That's right it does and YOU reject it.
                Originally posted by GISMYS View Post
                Do I ineed help you understand what God is saying here??
                Once you come to understand it yourself I won't mind. But your wrongheaded understanding of it has you contradicting the words of Jesus Himself! I don't even know what version that is you're using, but even IT doesn't say Jews don't need the gospel. It's saying almost the exact same thing the KJV says. The Deliverer did indeed come out of Zion. Paul himself being a Jew finally accepted Jesus is the Deliverer prophesied about. Paul himself is the example to all Jews that to remove their blindness they have to believe on Jesus as the Messiah. You want to ignorantly claim a few verses out of Romans 11 says Jews don't need Jesus and His gospel which that interpretation itself contradicts the Lord and calls Him a liar and also contradicts the entire gospel of Christ which was prophesied and commanded to go to the Jews first, which it did. The Jew then carried it to the world just as prophesied. But you reject that and claim the Jews don't need it. And you completely ignore Jesus and the rest of the New testament which is the Gospel that saves.

                Paul said this in the very same letter you want to twist a few verses out of for yourself.. Romans 1:16 That verses alone Proves your twisted doctrine that denies the Jews need the gospel of Christ is wrongheaded.
                For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ,
                for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.


                See, people who don't believe the gospel of Christ reject the power of God to salvation just as Jesus had already said. Your twisted version of a few verses out of Romans 11 not only contradicts Paul in this verse but the rest of Romans which is telling them all, both Jew and Gentile Christian, how to live a Christian life once they had been baptized into Christ. Romans 6:1-4 Also unbelief is sin, how can a Jew remain in unbelief and not be in sin? Paul asked the Romans shall they continue in sin that grace may abound? Then said Certainly not! But you say Jews can remain in sin so grace will abound. Paul says No! and you say YES!!!

                I don't know how the Bible could have been any clearer on how all men are saved. From John 3:16 to Titus2 :11 that tells us the Grace of God that saves has appeared to all men. Paul said the gospel of Christ is the power of God that saves. So we know that what he was telling Titus is the same thing or else he would be contradicting himself. Saving Grace is the gospel of Christ he was talking about in All of those verses. Jesus fulfilled His promises to Abraham Isaac nd Jacob. Romans 11 doesn't contradict Paul or Jesus once a person turns to the gospel and lifts that veil off their hearts.

                Originally posted by GISMYS View Post
                I want you to know about this truth from God, dear brothers, so that you will not feel proud and start bragging. Yes, it is true that some of the Jews have set themselves against the Gospel now, but this will last only until all of you Gentiles have come to Christ—those of you who will. 26 And then """all Israel will be saved""".

                Do you remember what the prophets said about this? “There shall come out of Zion a Deliverer, and he shall turn the Jews from all ungodliness. 27 At that time I will take away their sins, just as I promised.”

                28 Now many of the Jews are enemies of the Gospel. They hate it. But this has been a benefit to you, for it has resulted in God’s giving his gifts to you Gentiles. Yet the Jews are still beloved of God because of his promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. 29 For God’s gifts and his call can never be withdrawn; he will never go back on his promises. 30 Once you were rebels against God, but when the Jews refused his gifts God was merciful to you instead. 31 And now the Jews are the rebels, but some day they, too, will share in God’s mercy upon you. 32 For God has given them all up to sin so that he could have mercy upon all alike.

                33 Oh, what a wonderful God we have! How great are his wisdom and knowledge and riches! How impossible it is for us to understand his decisions and his methods! 34 For who among us can know the mind of the Lord? Who knows enough to be his counselor and guide? 35 And who could ever offer to the Lord enough to induce him to act? 36 For everything comes from God alone. Everything lives by his power, and everything is for his glory. To him be glory evermore. Romans 11:25=36

                Comment


                • #38
                  Great!!!PTL. I am happy to hear that you believe ALL the Bible not just a verse here and there.

                  I want you to know about this truth from God, dear brothers, so that you will not feel proud and start bragging. Yes, it is true that some of the Jews have set themselves against the Gospel now, but this will last only until all of you Gentiles have come to Christ—those of you who will. 26 And then """all Israel will be saved""".

                  Do you remember what the prophets said about this? “There shall come out of Zion a Deliverer, and he shall turn the Jews from all ungodliness. 27 At that time I will take away their sins, just as I promised.”

                  28 Now many of the Jews are enemies of the Gospel. They hate it. But this has been a benefit to you, for it has resulted in God’s giving his gifts to you Gentiles. Yet the Jews are still beloved of God because of his promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. 29 For God’s gifts and his call can never be withdrawn; he will never go back on his promises. 30 Once you were rebels against God, but when the Jews refused his gifts God was merciful to you instead. 31 And now the Jews are the rebels, but some day they, too, will share in God’s mercy upon you. 32 For God has given them all up to sin so that he could have mercy upon all alike.

                  33 Oh, what a wonderful God we have! How great are his wisdom and knowledge and riches! How impossible it is for us to understand his decisions and his methods! 34 For who among us can know the mind of the Lord? Who knows enough to be his counselor and guide? 35 And who could ever offer to the Lord enough to induce him to act? 36 For everything comes from God alone. Everything lives by his power, and everything is for his glory. To him be glory evermore. Romans 11:25=36


                  Yes!!! Anyone that rejects Jesus as their Lord and Savior be they Jew or Gentile cannot be saved!


                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by GISMYS View Post

                    Yes!!! Anyone that rejects Jesus as their Lord and Savior be they Jew or Gentile cannot be saved!

                    And yet you sent all that time arguing with it and telling me the Jews are saved just by being Jews.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by TribulationSigns

                      GISMYS misrepresented himself all the time which is why I can tell that he is being indoctrinated by his favorite false prophet.
                      The Hebrews Roots movement along with dispensationalism with Jack Van Impe, John Hagee, and the entire cast of Daystar and TBN is causing a lot of people to believe the Jews are saved no matter what and if we all don't keep our focus on Israel then we aren't "blessing" the Jews and we are anti-Semites.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Simple!!! Jewish believers believe in God and God is Jesus even if they don't know that Truth!! God is man's final judge Not little men!!

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Hemi View Post
                          The Hebrews Roots movement along with dispensationalism with Jack Van Impe, John Hagee, and the entire cast of Daystar and TBN is causing a lot of people to believe the Jews are saved no matter what and if we all don't keep our focus on Israel then we aren't "blessing" the Jews and we are anti-Semites.
                          Agreed. It is not just the dispensationalism but a great deception upon people on many subjects.

                          For example:

                          2Th 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
                          10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
                          11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
                          12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

                          There is a reason that people will not receive the truth, and the reason is called indoctrination. It doesn't matter if it's ideology, evolution, politics, education or religion, the principle is the same. These people have all learned something from whoever is teaching them, and now that tradition they have is so strong that even truth will not pierce it. We see this today in politics from both the right and the left, the truth is secondary to the tradition of the party. The same with religion where truth is secondary to the traditions you have been taught. It happened to Christ where Israel rejected their Messiah because their tradition was to look for a political warfare and Messiah ruling in a political land. The same with these professed Christians (professed, God only knows) so caught up in that same mentality of a political struggle, people and kingdom. They are the Scribes and Pharisees of our day deluded into believing a lie by what they have been taught by their TV preachers and authors edit example with Jack Van Impe.
                          Last edited by CARM Admin; 05-16-18, 05:31 PM. Reason: alert/personal attack

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by TribulationSigns View Post

                            Agreed. It is not just the dispensationalism but a great deception upon people on many subjects.

                            For example:

                            2Th 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
                            10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
                            11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
                            12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

                            There is a reason that people will not receive the truth, and the reason is called indoctrination. It doesn't matter if it's ideology, evolution, politics, education or religion, the principle is the same. These people have all learned something from whoever is teaching them, and now that tradition they have is so strong that even truth will not pierce it. We see this today in politics from both the right and the left, the truth is secondary to the tradition of the party. The same with religion where truth is secondary to the traditions you have been taught. It happened to Christ where Israel rejected their Messiah because their tradition was to look for a political warfare and Messiah ruling in a political land. The same with these professed Christians (professed, God only knows) so caught up in that same mentality of a political struggle, people and kingdom. They are the Scribes and Pharisees of our day deluded into believing a lie by what they have been taught by their TV preachers and authors edit example with Jack Van Impe.
                            The way to avoid it is simple. Just use the bible to check everything. If it contradicts the Bible, it's false. If it causes the Bible to contradict itself, as Jack Van Impe does constantly, it's false. When someone takes a few verses from Romans 11 to fit this new age "Bless Israel with your money" nonsense and tells me it means the Jews cannot be lost, it causes the Bible to contradict itself all over the place, so it's automatically a false doctrine.
                            Last edited by CARM Admin; 05-16-18, 05:32 PM. Reason: edit

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Hemi View Post

                              The way to avoid it is simple. Just use the bible to check everything. If it contradicts the Bible, it's false. If it causes the Bible to contradict itself, as Jack Van Impe does constantly, it's false. When someone takes a few verses from Romans 11 to fit this new age "Bless Israel with your money" nonsense and tells me it means the Jews cannot be lost, it causes the Bible to contradict itself all over the place, so it's automatically a false doctrine.
                              Yep.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Who thinks God has changed His mind about Israel??
                                Genesis 12

                                12 Now the Lord had said unto Abram, “Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred and from thy father’s house, unto a land that I will show thee.

                                2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing.

                                3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee; and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.”

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