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Do you believe that Jesus appeared to Mary on Sunday Eve?

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  • Do you believe that Jesus appeared to Mary on Sunday Eve?

    So do I, but the difference between your idea of when Sunday Evening is, is not the same as Jesus'. For on God's calendar, Sunday Evening is at the end of the 7th day Sabbath at sundown......Not after Sunday day as we suppose. Evening comes first then the day.
    Jesus rose on Saturday and appeared to them after sundown when it was now Sunday Evening being the first day of the Week for Jesus, but is also the 7th day of the week for the Gentiles until midnight.
    The purpose of my posts are not to cause bicker or division, but to show truth from the scripture for edifying of the soul. It does not matter what we think, it is what God's Word says that matters.

  • #2
    Originally posted by afaithfulone4u View Post
    So do I, but the difference between your idea of when Sunday Evening is, is not the same as Jesus'. For on God's calendar, Sunday Evening is at the end of the 7th day Sabbath at sundown......Not after Sunday day as we suppose. Evening comes first then the day.
    Jesus rose on Saturday and appeared to them after sundown when it was now Sunday Evening being the first day of the Week for Jesus, but is also the 7th day of the week for the Gentiles until midnight.
    Yup. He DIED on Wednesday, and was interred Thursday Evening (at dusk on Wednesday).

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by afaithfulone4u View Post
      So do I, but the difference between your idea of when Sunday Evening is, is not the same as Jesus'. For on God's calendar, Sunday Evening is at the end of the 7th day Sabbath at sundown......Not after Sunday day as we suppose. Evening comes first then the day.
      Jesus rose on Saturday and appeared to them after sundown when it was now Sunday Evening being the first day of the Week for Jesus, but is also the 7th day of the week for the Gentiles until midnight.
      One of the major problems folks have is understanding just when "evening" was to the Hebrews.

      The Hebrews observed two evenings each day.....one at high noon (when the sun was directly overhead) and the other at sundown when the sun was "even" with the horizon. Everything in between was referred to as "Even". This why you see (expressed in Hebrew) the word, "Evenings" in the plural throughout the Old Testament.

      All passages are from "Young's Literal Translation.

      [Exodus 12:6] ‘And it hath become a charge to you, until the fourteenth day of this month, and the whole assembly of the company of Israel have slaughtered it between the evenings;

      [Leviticus 23:5] in the first month, on the fourteenth of the month, between the evenings, [is] the passover to Jehovah;

      [Numbers 9:3] in the fourteenth day of this month between the evenings ye prepare it in its appointed season; according to all its statutes, and according to all its ordinances ye prepare it.’

      [Numbers 9:5] and they prepare the passover in the first [month], on the fourteenth day of the month, between the evenings, in the wilderness of Sinai; according to all that Jehovah hath commanded Moses, so have the sons of Israel done.

      [Numbers 9:11] in the second month, on the fourteenth day, between the evenings they prepare it; with unleavened and bitter things they eat it;

      All of the above passages deal with the Passover preparation and this was to take place anytime between noon and sunset on the 14th.....Passover.

      Yeshua was killed at 3:00 P.M. [Matthew 27:45-50] exactly between the evenings.
      The stone was not rolled away from the tomb so He could come out. It was removed so the world could look in.......... and see that the tomb was empty.

      Comment


      • #4
        I was taught in Sunday School that Jesus ate the Passover meal with the disciples; i.e., the Last Supper was the seder.
        Your thoughts on this?
        Proverbs 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter. KJV
        This is why I am here.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by yosef View Post
          I was taught in Sunday School that Jesus ate the Passover meal with the disciples; i.e., the Last Supper was the seder.
          Your thoughts on this?
          The Last Supper was just that.....a supper, not a Passover Seder. There are many translation additions in the KJV that show this to be the case as the "middle age" Church was attempting to replace the Passover with their new theology. I haven't time right now to delve into this but will explain later.

          They succeeded (by the way) as many folks now believe that Yeshua.... indeed ate the Passover with the 12.
          The stone was not rolled away from the tomb so He could come out. It was removed so the world could look in.......... and see that the tomb was empty.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Diego 1618 View Post

            One of the major problems folks have is understanding just when "evening" was to the Hebrews.

            The Hebrews observed two evenings each day.....one at high noon (when the sun was directly overhead) and the other at sundown when the sun was "even" with the horizon. Everything in between was referred to as "Even". This why you see (expressed in Hebrew) the word, "Evenings" in the plural throughout the Old Testament.

            All passages are from "Young's Literal Translation.

            [Exodus 12:6] ‘And it hath become a charge to you, until the fourteenth day of this month, and the whole assembly of the company of Israel have slaughtered it between the evenings;

            [Leviticus 23:5] in the first month, on the fourteenth of the month, between the evenings, [is] the passover to Jehovah;

            [Numbers 9:3] in the fourteenth day of this month between the evenings ye prepare it in its appointed season; according to all its statutes, and according to all its ordinances ye prepare it.’

            [Numbers 9:5] and they prepare the passover in the first [month], on the fourteenth day of the month, between the evenings, in the wilderness of Sinai; according to all that Jehovah hath commanded Moses, so have the sons of Israel done.

            [Numbers 9:11] in the second month, on the fourteenth day, between the evenings they prepare it; with unleavened and bitter things they eat it;

            All of the above passages deal with the Passover preparation and this was to take place anytime between noon and sunset on the 14th.....Passover.

            Yeshua was killed at 3:00 P.M. [Matthew 27:45-50] exactly between the evenings.
            But doesn't that only mean from one sundown to the next? The Sabbath begins at sundown and ends at sundown the following day.
            Gen 1:5
            5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
            KJV
            And isn't it possible that the translators failed to put a comma after "risen" instead of after, early the first day of the week? Early in a day would be sunset, not sunrise, because the day it's self is half over at 6am according to the Evening first, then Day = 1 day in Gen.

            Mark 16:9 Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
            KJV

            Also the end of the Sabbath is at sundown which then turns to
            Sunday the first day of the week. Yet we see that it says in the same day being the day at evening Jesus appeared to the disciples for the first time. So, knowing that their days begin in the evening, if this were Sunday morning that she saw him, the evening would now be the second day of the week Monday, not Sunday that is the first day of the week.

            John 20:18 Mary Magdalene came and told the disciples that she had seen the Lord, and that he had spoken these things unto her.

            19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.
            KJV
            The purpose of my posts are not to cause bicker or division, but to show truth from the scripture for edifying of the soul. It does not matter what we think, it is what God's Word says that matters.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Diego 1618 View Post

              The Last Supper was just that.....a supper, not a Passover Seder. There are many translation additions in the KJV that show this to be the case as the "middle age" Church was attempting to replace the Passover with their new theology. I haven't time right now to delve into this but will explain later.

              They succeeded (by the way) as many folks now believe that Yeshua.... indeed ate the Passover with the 12.
              If you read the KJV (many folks still do) you come away with the assumption that the Last Supper was a Passover Seder. This is mainly because the Gospels do not agree with each other regarding the chronology. There have been many additions in the KJV to make it look like a Seder but when you eliminate the Italicized words (additions) it then makes sense.

              John's Gospel was written much later than the others and many converted Gentiles had become followers by that time.

              John says very plainly [13:1] Now before the feast of the passover, when Jesus knew that his hour was come that he should depart out of this world unto the Father, having loved his own which were in the world, he loved them unto the end.

              [13:2] And supper being ended, the devil having now put into the heart of Judas Iscariot, Simon's son, to betray him;

              The meal is now over.

              He also says [13:28-29] Now no man at the table knew for what intent he spake this unto him. For some of them thought, because Judas had the bag, that Jesus had said unto him, Buy those things that we have need of against the feast; or, that he should give something to the poor.

              If they had already eaten the Passover the disciples would not assume that Judas was going out to buy things for the Feast.

              [John 18:28] Then led they Jesus from Caiaphas unto the hall of judgment: and it was early; and they themselves went not into the judgment hall, lest they should be defiled; but that they might eat the passover.

              It is now daytime of the 14th and the Jews have not yet eaten the Passover.

              [John 19:14] And it was the preparation of the passover, and about the sixth hour: and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your King!

              The 6th hour would be noon (Hebrew time) and the date is still the 14th.

              [John 19:31] The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.

              The preparation took place on the 14th.

              [John 19:42]There laid they Jesus therefore because of the Jews' preparation day; for the sepulchre was nigh at hand.

              Thus....... through the gospel of John we have established that these passages all take place on the 14th.....the day of preparation. They arrive at the upper room, they dine, Judas is sent on his mission, Yeshua is arrested and stands before the Sanhedrin, He is taken to Pilate and condemned, He is executed and taken from the tree and placed in the tomb..........all on the day of preparation.

              When is the day of preparation?

              [Exodus 12:6] And ye shall keep it up until the fourteenth day of the same month: and the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it in the evening.

              The literal Hebrew says they shall kill it Between the Evenings (plural) Beyn ha Arbayim.

              Yeshua died on the 14th and as He was being placed in the tomb by Joseph.... families all over Jerusalem had just finished the preparation and soon after sundown the 15th would arrive and they would eat their own Passover Seders.

              I'll later post the confusing passages in the KJV in Matthew, Mark and Luke where folks become mixed up about the dates because of translator additions to scripture.
              The stone was not rolled away from the tomb so He could come out. It was removed so the world could look in.......... and see that the tomb was empty.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by yosef View Post
                I was taught in Sunday School that Jesus ate the Passover meal with the disciples; i.e., the Last Supper was the seder.
                Your thoughts on this?
                Actually, Jesus is our Passover meal, he is the Bread of life the Word of Life we must feed upon to be found worthy to pass over from death unto life. The Bread is the Word of God who was made flesh, to be forsaken on the cross for us, and the blood is the Spirit of life that we must drink in to pass over into the Kingdom of God. For the life of the flesh is in the blood says God.Heirs of God and His Christ being born of God's Spirit by the bloodline as Jesus was when the Holy Ghost came unto Mary.
                Matt 1:18-20

                18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.

                19 Then Joseph her husband, being a just man, and not willing to make her a publick example, was minded to put her away privily.

                20 But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost.
                KJV


                John 11:25-26

                25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

                26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
                KJV

                The purpose of my posts are not to cause bicker or division, but to show truth from the scripture for edifying of the soul. It does not matter what we think, it is what God's Word says that matters.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by afaithfulone4u View Post

                  But doesn't that only mean from one sundown to the next? The Sabbath begins at sundown and ends at sundown the following day.
                  Let's take this one step at a time.

                  Philo.....early first century

                  After the new moon comes the "Crossing-Feast" which the Hebrews call "Pascha" in their native tongue. During this festival many myriads of victims (sheep) from noon until eventide are offered by the whole people. The day on which this national festivity takes place is the 14th of the month. (De Specialibus Legibus 2:145-149)

                  Josephus.....late first century


                  on the occasion of of the feast called Passover, at which they sacrifice from the 9th hour to the eleventh hour (3:00 P.M. to 5:00 P.M.) and a little fraternity, as it were, gather round each sacrifice, of not fewer than persons. (War 6:9:3.)

                  Septuagint.....3rd century B.C.


                  Leviticus 23:5 gives a literal translation of the words "Beyn ha Arbayim" (Greek: anameson ton hesperinon)....or "Between the Evenings"

                  Eustathius.....Patriarch of Antioch.....4th century A.D.

                  ............in a note on the 17th Book of the Odyssey shows that the Greeks too held that there were two evenings, one which they called the latter evening at the close of the day and the other.....the former evening which commenced immediately after noon. (McClintok and Strong. Vol. VII, 1877, page 735)

                  Rabbinic literature also enforces this belief of Beyn ha Arbayim......Between the Evenings"
                  The stone was not rolled away from the tomb so He could come out. It was removed so the world could look in.......... and see that the tomb was empty.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    As you can now see the Passover sacrifices were limited to just a few hours (between the evenings/noon and sunset). They were not allowed over a 24 hour period of time which is what the KJV sometimes will render, i.e. "in the evening" which to 16th century English meant......after sundown. Quite the contrary. The sacrifice had to be completed prior to sundown and begun no earlier than noon.

                    While Yeshua was suffering on the tree, lambs were being slaughtered in the Temple.....to be completed by sundown and then were taken by residents of Jerusalem to their homes to be the Seder meal with unleavened bread.

                    Next we'll look at the confusing passages in the synoptics............


                    The stone was not rolled away from the tomb so He could come out. It was removed so the world could look in.......... and see that the tomb was empty.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      King James unless otherwise specified.

                      [Matthew 26:2] Ye know that after two days is the feast of the passover, and the Son of man is betrayed to be crucified.

                      The highlighted words have been added and they appear in Italics in most Bibles. Let's see what it looks if the Greek KOINE is faithfully translated:

                      Ye know that after two days is the passover, and the Son of man is betrayed to be crucified.

                      Passover preparation was on the 14th and was considered part of the observation of Passover although the Passover meal did not occur until the 15th.

                      So.....this passage appears to be taken place on the 13th sometime.

                      [Matthew 26:17] On the first day of the Festival of Unleavened Bread, the disciples came to Jesus and asked, “Where do you want us to make preparations for you to eat the Passover?”

                      Notice there is no Italics so we can see that indeed.....Passover Preparation was considered part of the observance. This speaks of the 14th.

                      [Mark 14:12] On the first day of the Festival of Unleavened Bread, when it was customary to sacrifice the Passover lamb, Jesus’ disciples asked him, “Where do you want us to go and make preparations for you to eat the Passover?”

                      Again.....no Italics and the day the lamb was killed was the 14th......i.e. the first day of the festival.

                      [Luke 22:7] Then came the day of Unleavened Bread on which the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed.

                      The 14th.

                      [Luke 22:8-12]Jesus sent Peter and John, saying, “Go and make preparations for us to eat the Passover.

                      “Where do you want us to prepare for it?” they asked.

                      He replied, “As you enter the city, a man carrying a jar of water will meet you. Follow him to the house that he enters, and say to the owner of the house, ‘The Teacher asks: Where is the guest room, where I may eat the Passover with my disciples?’ He will show you a large room upstairs, all furnished. Make preparations there.”

                      Passover preparations took an entire day so they arrive on the 14th and intend to spend an entire day cleaning and preparing the room. They had no idea at the time that Yeshua would be slaughtered Himself as the Passover Lamb for mankind within a few short hours from then.
                      The stone was not rolled away from the tomb so He could come out. It was removed so the world could look in.......... and see that the tomb was empty.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        KJV [John 20:15-18] Jesus saith unto her, Woman, why weepest thou? whom seekest thou? She, supposing him to be the gardener, saith unto him, Sir, if thou have borne him hence, tell me where thou hast laid him, and I will take him away. Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master. Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. Mary Magdalene came and told the disciples that she had seen the Lord, and that he had spoken these things unto her.

                        Is this taking place on Sunday night as the title of the thread asks? Let's look.

                        [John 20:1]The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.

                        Here is the literal Greek translation:

                        Young's Literal Translation [John 20:1]And on the first of the sabbaths, Mary the Magdalene doth come early (there being yet darkness) to the tomb, and she seeth the stone having been taken away out of the tomb,


                        Jay P. Green's Literal Translation [John 20:1] But on the first of the sabbaths, Mary Magdalene came early to the tomb, darkness yet being on it . And she saw the stone had been removed from the tomb.

                        Neither one of these Greek scholars call this the "first day of the week".....but they both say it is the "First of the Sabbaths"! What does that mean?

                        [Leviticus 23:15] describes the count of the Omer after Passover. There were seven Sabbaths in the count until Pentecost and [John 20:1] speaks of the first one. This weekly Sabbath was the day of resurrection and Mary has come to the tomb early while it is still dark. Perhaps 5 or 6 A.M. Saturday morning. The sun hasn't yet completely risen......but the Son has.

                        He was crucified at 9:00 A.M. on the 14th, Passover Preparation. He died at 3:00 P.M. the same day and Joseph entombed Him before sundown on the 14th. That year the 14th began on a Tuesday night modern time and 6 hours later it became Wednesday when Yeshua went to the garden after the meal......still the 14th Hebrew time. He was later crucified and died at 3:00 P.M. (Between the Evenings) still the 14th. At sundown the 15th began and Passover Seders were taking place throughout Jerusalem.....still Wednesday our time.

                        He spent Wednesday night/Thursday......Thursday night/Friday......Friday night to Saturday sunrise in the tomb which comes to 60 hours. But.......His time in the "Heart of The Earth" began 12 hours earlier after He was arrested by the Sanhedrin and turned over to the Roman Governor, Pilate. Total time in the Heart of the Earth.......under the command control of evil mankind was 72 hours, or......three days and three nights [Matthew 12:40].

                        So.....in actuality, He first spoke with Mary early Saturday (Sabbath) morning after He had risen while it was yet not quite light.
                        The stone was not rolled away from the tomb so He could come out. It was removed so the world could look in.......... and see that the tomb was empty.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Diego 1618 View Post


                          [John 19:14] And it was the preparation of the passover, and about the sixth hour: and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your King!

                          The 6th hour would be noon (Hebrew time) and the date is still the 14th.
                          I made a mistake in the above post regarding the time.

                          I had forgotten that John wrote mainly to a Greek audience and when he says "6th hour"......he does not mean Hebrew time (which is what I originally wrote) but he references "Roman time" which indeed began at midnight such as our modern time. So.....the 6th hour would be 6:00 A.M. as Yeshua is standing before Pilate.

                          This is an answer to post #7............
                          The stone was not rolled away from the tomb so He could come out. It was removed so the world could look in.......... and see that the tomb was empty.

                          Comment

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