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discuss Jesus's mentioning of the awaited Comforter. who I believe is now among us

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  • discuss Jesus's mentioning of the awaited Comforter. who I believe is now among us

    ** MODERATOR's I believe this is the correct forum for such a discussion. if there is any issue please message me or move the thread to the proper location. This is a serious topic I would like to discuss with you all. I am not spamming. **

    Hello good people!
    I would like to discuss who (or what) Jesus was referring to in the following verse when he mentions the Comforter.

    Jesus said: (But now I am going to him who sent me; and not one of you says to me, where you are going? But your hearts are full of sorrow because I have said these things. But what I am saying is true: my going is for your good: for if I do not go away, the Comforter will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. And he, when he comes, will convict the world is respect of sin, and of righteousness, and of being judged: Of sin, because they have not faith in me; Of righteousness, because I go to the Father and you will see me no more; Of being judged, because the ruler of this world has been judged). John: Chapter 16.

    I am not going to play games and ask everyone what they think Jesus meant in this verse and THEN share my belief.

    I believe he is here and his name is Ahmed Al Hassan.
    for reference if you would like you can visit some of the websites for further research on your own. EDIT

    looking forward to hearing your opinions and discussing as to who Jesus was (or what) Jesus was referring to in John: Chapter 16!

    Take care
    May God protect you
    Last edited by Mod16; 07-27-13, 07:52 PM. Reason: Rule 8

  • #2
    Originally posted by Maloney View Post
    ** MODERATOR's I believe this is the correct forum for such a discussion. if there is any issue please message me or move the thread to the proper location. This is a serious topic I would like to discuss with you all. I am not spamming. **

    Hello good people!
    I would like to discuss who (or what) Jesus was referring to in the following verse when he mentions the Comforter.

    Jesus said: (But now I am going to him who sent me; and not one of you says to me, where you are going? But your hearts are full of sorrow because I have said these things. But what I am saying is true: my going is for your good: for if I do not go away, the Comforter will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. And he, when he comes, will convict the world is respect of sin, and of righteousness, and of being judged: Of sin, because they have not faith in me; Of righteousness, because I go to the Father and you will see me no more; Of being judged, because the ruler of this world has been judged). John: Chapter 16.

    I am not going to play games and ask everyone what they think Jesus meant in this verse and THEN share my belief.

    I believe he is here and his name is Ahmed Al Hassan.
    for reference if you would like you can visit some of the websites for further research on your own. EDIT

    looking forward to hearing your opinions and discussing as to who Jesus was (or what) Jesus was referring to in John: Chapter 16!

    Take care
    May God protect you
    Jesus answered and said to them: “Take heed that no one deceives you. For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many....many false prophets will rise up and deceive many....if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ do not believe it. For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. See, I have told you beforehand. (Matt. 24:4-5, 11, 23-25 NKJV)

    Your false prophet is an imposter.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Maloney View Post

      I would like to discuss who (or what) Jesus was referring to in the following verse when he mentions the Comforter.

      Jesus said: (But now I am going to him who sent me; and not one of you says to me, where you are going? But your hearts are full of sorrow because I have said these things. But what I am saying is true: my going is for your good: for if I do not go away, the Comforter will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. And he, when he comes, will convict the world is respect of sin, and of righteousness, and of being judged: Of sin, because they have not faith in me; Of righteousness, because I go to the Father and you will see me no more; Of being judged, because the ruler of this world has been judged). John: Chapter 16.
      Jesus' reference to the Comforter/Advocate is also mentioned in John 14: Take important note that Jesus is speaking to His disciples. Take note that Jesus identifies the Comforter/Advocate as the Holy Spirit of God.

      15 “If you love me, keep my commands. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be[c] in you. 18 I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19 Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20 On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21 Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”

      22 Then Judas (not Judas Iscariot) said, “But, Lord, why do you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world?”

      23 Jesus replied, “Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them. 24 Anyone who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.

      25 “All this I have spoken while still with you. 26 But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you. 27 Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.

      Originally posted by Maloney View Post

      I believe he is here and his name is Ahmed Al Hassan.
      How so?
      They will put you out of the synagogue; in fact, the time is coming when anyone who kills you will think they are offering a service to God. John 16:2

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Maloney View Post
        ** MODERATOR's I believe this is the correct forum for such a discussion. if there is any issue please message me or move the thread to the proper location. This is a serious topic I would like to discuss with you all. I am not spamming. **

        Hello good people!
        I would like to discuss who (or what) Jesus was referring to in the following verse when he mentions the Comforter.

        Jesus said: (But now I am going to him who sent me; and not one of you says to me, where you are going? But your hearts are full of sorrow because I have said these things. But what I am saying is true: my going is for your good: for if I do not go away, the Comforter will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. And he, when he comes, will convict the world is respect of sin, and of righteousness, and of being judged: Of sin, because they have not faith in me; Of righteousness, because I go to the Father and you will see me no more; Of being judged, because the ruler of this world has been judged). John: Chapter 16.

        I am not going to play games and ask everyone what they think Jesus meant in this verse and THEN share my belief.

        I believe he is here and his name is Ahmed Al Hassan.
        for reference if you would like you can visit some of the websites for further research on your own. EDIT

        looking forward to hearing your opinions and discussing as to who Jesus was (or what) Jesus was referring to in John: Chapter 16!

        Take care
        May God protect you
        Maloney, Respectfully, there is nothing to discuss regarding the 'who' Jesus was referring to. It's not a mystery to any student of the holy scriptures. John Chapter 14 solves the question. The Holy Spirit is the Comforter.

        I will add you to my prayer list. Only the love of Jesus can transform your life and if you become a Christian you will get to know the Holy Spirit personally.

        "Amazing Grace, How sweet the sound, that saved a wretch like me." John Newton
        It is fundamentally necessary and healthy for Christians to acknowledge that God foreknows nothing uncertainly, but that He foresees, purposes, and does all things according to His own immutable, eternal and infallible will. This bombshell knocks "free-will" flat…

        Martin Luther The Bondage of the Will

        Comment


        • #5
          I would like to stick to the topic of this thread but I will respond as i feel it is very important.


          There has been MANY people claiming to be Jesus(as) and many false prophets. too many to list.

          sorry you where not to clear, But If you are referring that Ahmed Al Hassan is claiming to be a prophet that is incorrect.

          However I do recognize Muhammad(as) as the last Prophet of God. As he was sent (and i am not accusing all Christians of this) because Christianity was steered away from monotheism by man and transformed into the worship of the Prophet Jesus(as) himself and even trinity by Catholics.

          just like the pharaohs did not accept Joseph, Jews did not accept Jesus and Christians did not accept Muhammad.

          again and again man altered the message and God answered in the same way. with a proceeding Prophet continuing the message of monotheism and that the One an only Creator is to be worshiped alone.

          Below is a short segment from a compilation one of the believes of Ahmed Al Hassan has put together. I wish i could attach the whole document for you to read....

          God has dispatched the prophets and messengers as bearers of glad tidings and as warners for people to promote justice, fairness, monotheism, and the worship of God in this Earth according to God's will. And because the Lord is one, His command to His messengers is one as well.

          Prophet David said to the entire congregation: “O Lord, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and of Israel, our fathers, keep this forever in the deepest thoughts of your people, and let their hearts be fixed and true to you” –Chr1 [29:18]

          The command of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is itself the command of David, Solomon and Jesus.

          Moses said to his people: “Let the words which I have said to you today go deep into your hearts, and give orders to your children to do every word of this law” Dt [32:46].

          And Jesus came to proceed with what those prophets were commanded and that is calling to the monotheism of God and submitting to His commandments.

          Jesus said: “Let there be no thought that I have come to put an end to the law or the prophets. I have not come to put an end to them, but to proceed. The truth I say unto you, till heaven and earth come to an end, not the smallest letter or part of a letter will in any way be taken from the law, till all things are done”. Mt [5:17-18]

          So the real commander of practicing the Divine law is God, and what He commanded Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David, Solomon, Moses and Jesus is itself what He commanded the Seal of the Prophets Muhammad, the Most High said in the Quran: “He has ordained for you of religion what He enjoined upon Noah and that which We have revealed to you, and what We enjoined upon Abraham and Moses and Jesus - to establish the religion and not be divided therein. Difficult for those who associate others with God is that to which you invite them. God chooses for Himself whom He wills and guides to Himself whoever turns back [to Him]” –Ash-Shura [42:13].

          The above scriptures clarified that the concern of those successors of God is one and they do not differ, as their God is the same, and so is their religion, which is to surrender to God. All of them guide us to God, and act under God's command. The truth which they all call for is the same, and their purpose is the same; it is to prepare people for the Minor Judgment.

          And because every call from the calls of the prophets has a special feature, and God, Glory to Him and May He be exalted, wants a certain thing from it to convey it to His worshipers, we find Jesus the Messiah coming with his message, which was the most important message before the dispatch of the sealing Prophet Muhammad, and it was the last preparatory stage by the means of the prophets from the lineage of Isaac, the son of Abraham.

          And Jesus wanted to put forth the spiritual meanings and establish the basis for it and covey his message to his people by giving examples through his journey of teaching and spreading the call which he was charged with. However, this has an essential role in the life of the Rising Mahdy or the Savior; because the savior represents the beginning of the journey of returning to God, he is actually the turning point and the fruit of all the calls of the prophets. The Savior is here to build the Divine Justice Land and to establish the religion of the One and Only God, so who are the workers of Lord that will help him to do so?

          The Savior Ahmad Al-Hassan said: “I did not come seeking servants. Nor did I come for people to see me so that I can be a veil between them and God. I came to demolish the structure of falsehood and build the structure of truth, so help me do so, may God have mercy upon you”.

          looking forward to a response.

          Bless you brother

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Maloney View Post
            I would like to stick to the topic of this thread but I will respond as i feel it is very important.


            There has been MANY people claiming to be Jesus(as) and many false prophets. too many to list.

            sorry you where not to clear, But If you are referring that Ahmed Al Hassan is claiming to be a prophet that is incorrect.

            However I do recognize Muhammad(as) as the last Prophet of God. As he was sent (and i am not accusing all Christians of this) because Christianity was steered away from monotheism by man and transformed into the worship of the Prophet Jesus(as) himself and even trinity by Catholics.

            just like the pharaohs did not accept Joseph, Jews did not accept Jesus and Christians did not accept Muhammad.

            again and again man altered the message and God answered in the same way. with a proceeding Prophet continuing the message of monotheism and that the One an only Creator is to be worshiped alone.

            Below is a short segment from a compilation one of the believes of Ahmed Al Hassan has put together. I wish i could attach the whole document for you to read....

            God has dispatched the prophets and messengers as bearers of glad tidings and as warners for people to promote justice, fairness, monotheism, and the worship of God in this Earth according to God's will. And because the Lord is one, His command to His messengers is one as well.

            Prophet David said to the entire congregation: “O Lord, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and of Israel, our fathers, keep this forever in the deepest thoughts of your people, and let their hearts be fixed and true to you” –Chr1 [29:18]

            The command of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is itself the command of David, Solomon and Jesus.

            Moses said to his people: “Let the words which I have said to you today go deep into your hearts, and give orders to your children to do every word of this law” Dt [32:46].

            And Jesus came to proceed with what those prophets were commanded and that is calling to the monotheism of God and submitting to His commandments.

            Jesus said: “Let there be no thought that I have come to put an end to the law or the prophets. I have not come to put an end to them, but to proceed. The truth I say unto you, till heaven and earth come to an end, not the smallest letter or part of a letter will in any way be taken from the law, till all things are done”. Mt [5:17-18]

            So the real commander of practicing the Divine law is God, and what He commanded Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David, Solomon, Moses and Jesus is itself what He commanded the Seal of the Prophets Muhammad, the Most High said in the Quran: “He has ordained for you of religion what He enjoined upon Noah and that which We have revealed to you, and what We enjoined upon Abraham and Moses and Jesus - to establish the religion and not be divided therein. Difficult for those who associate others with God is that to which you invite them. God chooses for Himself whom He wills and guides to Himself whoever turns back [to Him]” –Ash-Shura [42:13].

            The above scriptures clarified that the concern of those successors of God is one and they do not differ, as their God is the same, and so is their religion, which is to surrender to God. All of them guide us to God, and act under God's command. The truth which they all call for is the same, and their purpose is the same; it is to prepare people for the Minor Judgment.

            And because every call from the calls of the prophets has a special feature, and God, Glory to Him and May He be exalted, wants a certain thing from it to convey it to His worshipers, we find Jesus the Messiah coming with his message, which was the most important message before the dispatch of the sealing Prophet Muhammad, and it was the last preparatory stage by the means of the prophets from the lineage of Isaac, the son of Abraham.

            And Jesus wanted to put forth the spiritual meanings and establish the basis for it and covey his message to his people by giving examples through his journey of teaching and spreading the call which he was charged with. However, this has an essential role in the life of the Rising Mahdy or the Savior; because the savior represents the beginning of the journey of returning to God, he is actually the turning point and the fruit of all the calls of the prophets. The Savior is here to build the Divine Justice Land and to establish the religion of the One and Only God, so who are the workers of Lord that will help him to do so?

            The Savior Ahmad Al-Hassan said: “I did not come seeking servants. Nor did I come for people to see me so that I can be a veil between them and God. I came to demolish the structure of falsehood and build the structure of truth, so help me do so, may God have mercy upon you”.

            looking forward to a response.

            Bless you brother
            Sorry, but that's just complete nonsense. All of it.

            I can respect that you are a Muslim of sorts. But what I will not accept is you using our scriptures to try to project your own ideas. It's a form of disrespect. You demonstrated that you didn't know what the scriptures taught by quoting a scripture without doing all your research. The Bible isn't hiding who the identification of the 'Comforter' is.

            The Savior Ahmad Al-Hassan said: “I did not come seeking servants. Nor did I come for people to see me so that I can be a veil between them and God. I came to demolish the structure of falsehood and build the structure of truth, so help me do so, may God have mercy upon you”.
            On a Christian site this is blasphemy.

            I will continue to pray for you.
            It is fundamentally necessary and healthy for Christians to acknowledge that God foreknows nothing uncertainly, but that He foresees, purposes, and does all things according to His own immutable, eternal and infallible will. This bombshell knocks "free-will" flat…

            Martin Luther The Bondage of the Will

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Maloney View Post

              However I do recognize Muhammad(as) as the last Prophet of God. As he was sent
              On what basis do you recognize Muhammad as the last prophet? He is not foretold anywhere in the Bible.

              Originally posted by Maloney View Post

              (and i am not accusing all Christians of this) because Christianity was steered away from monotheism by man and transformed into the worship of the Prophet Jesus(as) himself and even trinity by Catholics.
              True Christians are monotheistic. We worship one God and one God only.

              The deity of the Messiah, is biblically based. Don't forget we Christians believe Jesus is fully human.

              Originally posted by Maloney View Post

              just like the pharaohs did not accept Joseph, Jews did not accept Jesus and Christians did not accept Muhammad.
              It is true that most Jews of Jesus' day did not accept Him as the Messiah or a prophet.

              Christians and Jews do not accept Muhammad as a prophet because there is no proof he was.

              Originally posted by Maloney View Post

              again and again man altered the message and God answered in the same way. with a proceeding Prophet continuing the message of monotheism and that the One an only Creator is to be worshiped alone.
              Christians and Jews worship one God and one God only. We are monotheists.

              Originally posted by Maloney View Post

              Below is a short segment from a compilation one of the believes of Ahmed Al Hassan has put together. I wish i could attach the whole document for you to read....

              God has dispatched the prophets and messengers as bearers of glad tidings and as warners for people to promote justice, fairness, monotheism, and the worship of God in this Earth according to God's will. And because the Lord is one, His command to His messengers is one as well.

              Prophet David said to the entire congregation: “O Lord, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and of Israel, our fathers, keep this forever in the deepest thoughts of your people, and let their hearts be fixed and true to you” –Chr1 [29:18]

              The command of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is itself the command of David, Solomon and Jesus.

              Moses said to his people: “Let the words which I have said to you today go deep into your hearts, and give orders to your children to do every word of this law” Dt [32:46].

              And Jesus came to proceed with what those prophets were commanded and that is calling to the monotheism of God and submitting to His commandments.

              Jesus said: “Let there be no thought that I have come to put an end to the law or the prophets. I have not come to put an end to them, but to proceed. The truth I say unto you, till heaven and earth come to an end, not the smallest letter or part of a letter will in any way be taken from the law, till all things are done”. Mt [5:17-18]

              So the real commander of practicing the Divine law is God, and what He commanded Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David, Solomon, Moses and Jesus is itself what He commanded the Seal of the Prophets Muhammad, the Most High said in the Quran: “He has ordained for you of religion what He enjoined upon Noah and that which We have revealed to you, and what We enjoined upon Abraham and Moses and Jesus - to establish the religion and not be divided therein. Difficult for those who associate others with God is that to which you invite them. God chooses for Himself whom He wills and guides to Himself whoever turns back [to Him]” –Ash-Shura [42:13].

              The above scriptures clarified that the concern of those successors of God is one and they do not differ, as their God is the same, and so is their religion, which is to surrender to God. All of them guide us to God, and act under God's command. The truth which they all call for is the same, and their purpose is the same; it is to prepare people for the Minor Judgment.

              And because every call from the calls of the prophets has a special feature, and God, Glory to Him and May He be exalted, wants a certain thing from it to convey it to His worshipers, we find Jesus the Messiah coming with his message, which was the most important message before the dispatch of the sealing Prophet Muhammad, and it was the last preparatory stage by the means of the prophets from the lineage of Isaac, the son of Abraham.

              And Jesus wanted to put forth the spiritual meanings and establish the basis for it and covey his message to his people by giving examples through his journey of teaching and spreading the call which he was charged with. However, this has an essential role in the life of the Rising Mahdy or the Savior; because the savior represents the beginning of the journey of returning to God, he is actually the turning point and the fruit of all the calls of the prophets. The Savior is here to build the Divine Justice Land and to establish the religion of the One and Only God, so who are the workers of Lord that will help him to do so?

              The Savior Ahmad Al-Hassan said: “I did not come seeking servants. Nor did I come for people to see me so that I can be a veil between them and God. I came to demolish the structure of falsehood and build the structure of truth, so help me do so, may God have mercy upon you”.

              looking forward to a response.

              Bless you brother
              Christians and Jews submit to the will of the One True God. The Comforter/Advocate is the Holy Spirit of God as I pointed out to you.
              They will put you out of the synagogue; in fact, the time is coming when anyone who kills you will think they are offering a service to God. John 16:2

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Beloved Daughter View Post
                Maloney, Respectfully, there is nothing to discuss regarding the 'who' Jesus was referring to. It's not a mystery to any student of the holy scriptures. John Chapter 14 solves the question. The Holy Spirit is the Comforter.

                I will add you to my prayer list. Only the love of Jesus can transform your life and if you become a Christian you will get to know the Holy Spirit personally.

                "Amazing Grace, How sweet the sound, that saved a wretch like me." John Newton


                Let’s put the spotlight on the words of Jesus: “for if I do not go away, the Comforter will not come to you” this shows that the Comforter and Jesus do not come together, for as long as Jesus in among them, the Comforter will not come to them. Which means the Comforter does not exist during the life of Jesus neither before him. Whereas we know that the Holy Spirit was always with Jesus and he existed before and after Jesus; as mentioned in the Bible: “And his father, Zacharias, was full of the Holy Spirit, and with the voice of a prophet said these words: Praise be to the Lord, the God of Israel, for he has come to his people and made them free”-Lk [1:67-68]. Here the Holy Spirit was there with Zacharias.

                And also Jesus was full of the Holy Spirit: “And Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, came back from the Jordan, and was guided by the Spirit in the waste land” –Lk [4:1].

                The Holy Spirit was even upon Simon before the dispatch of Jesus as mentioned in this verse: “And there was then in Jerusalem a man whose name was Simeon; and he was an upright man, fearing God and waiting for the comfort of Israel: and the Holy Spirit was on him. And he had knowledge, through the Holy Spirit, that he would not see death till he had seen the Lord's Christ.”- Lk [2:25-26].

                Thus, the most important of all is that the Holy Spirit was given to the disciples during the life of Jesus: “And when he had said this, breathing on them, he said to them, Let the Holy Spirit come on you: Any to whom you give forgiveness, will be made free from their sins; and any from whom you keep back forgiveness, will still be in their sins”-John [20:22-23].

                So the Holy Spirit cannot be the Comforter that would come in a condition, which is the departure of Jesus, for the aforementioned verses show clearly that the Holy Spirit was already there before the dispatch of Jesus and during his life.

                Moreover, Jesus clarified that the Comforter convicts the world “And he, when he comes, will convict the world is respect of sin, and of righteousness, and of being judged” so did the Holy Spirit do any of this?

                Those words: (speak, hear, tell, convict) suggests sensual descriptions that fits humans, not the Holy Spirit that is described as flames of fire descending on the disciples as mentioned in the scriptures. Perhaps the Christians know that the Holy Spirit is suitable for heartfelt inspirations, not speech that needs phonetic device.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Maloney View Post
                  Let’s put the spotlight on the words of Jesus: “for if I do not go away, the Comforter will not come to you” this shows that the Comforter and Jesus do not come together, for as long as Jesus in among them, the Comforter will not come to them. Which means the Comforter does not exist during the life of Jesus neither before him. Whereas we know that the Holy Spirit was always with Jesus and he existed before and after Jesus; as mentioned in the Bible: “And his father, Zacharias, was full of the Holy Spirit, and with the voice of a prophet said these words: Praise be to the Lord, the God of Israel, for he has come to his people and made them free”-Lk [1:67-68]. Here the Holy Spirit was there with Zacharias.

                  And also Jesus was full of the Holy Spirit: “And Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, came back from the Jordan, and was guided by the Spirit in the waste land” –Lk [4:1].

                  The Holy Spirit was even upon Simon before the dispatch of Jesus as mentioned in this verse: “And there was then in Jerusalem a man whose name was Simeon; and he was an upright man, fearing God and waiting for the comfort of Israel: and the Holy Spirit was on him. And he had knowledge, through the Holy Spirit, that he would not see death till he had seen the Lord's Christ.”- Lk [2:25-26].

                  Thus, the most important of all is that the Holy Spirit was given to the disciples during the life of Jesus: “And when he had said this, breathing on them, he said to them, Let the Holy Spirit come on you: Any to whom you give forgiveness, will be made free from their sins; and any from whom you keep back forgiveness, will still be in their sins”-John [20:22-23].

                  So the Holy Spirit cannot be the Comforter that would come in a condition, which is the departure of Jesus, for the aforementioned verses show clearly that the Holy Spirit was already there before the dispatch of Jesus and during his life.

                  Moreover, Jesus clarified that the Comforter convicts the world “And he, when he comes, will convict the world is respect of sin, and of righteousness, and of being judged” so did the Holy Spirit do any of this?

                  Those words: (speak, hear, tell, convict) suggests sensual descriptions that fits humans, not the Holy Spirit that is described as flames of fire descending on the disciples as mentioned in the scriptures. Perhaps the Christians know that the Holy Spirit is suitable for heartfelt inspirations, not speech that needs phonetic device.
                  Yes, the Holy Spirit has been in existence forever. There was never a time where God's Spirit did not exist. Remember Jesus is speaking with His disciples. He told them that they knew the Comforter/Advocate (Holy Spirit) and of course, they did.

                  John 14: 17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you.

                  The first Comforter is Jesus Himself. Jesus said that when He left He would send the Holy Spirit to indwell His disciples. The Holy Spirit would be their Comforter/Advocate on earth (Jesus in heaven). The Holy Spirit came to the disciples on Pentecost.

                  The Holy Spirit of God does all of the following:

                  John 16: 8 When he comes, he will prove the world to be in the wrong about sin and righteousness and judgment: 9 about sin, because people do not believe in me; 10 about righteousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer; 11 and about judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned.

                  Matthew Henry's Commentary:

                  Christ's departure was necessary to the Comforter's coming. Sending the Spirit was to be the fruit of Christ's death, which was his going away. His bodily presence could be only in one place at one time, but his Spirit is every where, in all places, at all times, wherever two or three are gathered together in his name. See here the office of the Spirit, first to reprove, or to convince. Convincing work is the Spirit's work; he can do it effectually, and none but he. It is the method the Holy Spirit takes, first to convince, and then to comfort. The Spirit shall convince the world, of sin; not merely tell them of it. The Spirit convinces of the fact of sin; of the fault of sin; of the folly of sin; of the ***** of sin, that by it we are become hateful to God; of the fountain of sin, the corrupt nature; and lastly, of the fruit of sin, that the end thereof is death. The Holy Spirit proves that all the world is guilty before God. He convinces the world of righteousness; that Jesus of Nazareth was Christ the righteous. Also, of Christ's righteousness, imparted to us for justification and salvation. He will show them where it is to be had, and how they may be accepted as righteous in God's sight. Christ's ascension proves the ransom was accepted, and the righteousness finished, through which believers were to be justified. Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged. All will be well, when his power is broken, who made all the mischief. As Satan is subdued by Christ, this gives us confidence, for no other power can stand before him. And of the day of judgment. The coming of the Spirit would be of unspeakable advantage to the disciples. The Holy Spirit is our Guide, not only to show us the way, but to go with us by continued aids and influences. To be led into a truth is more than barely to know it; it is not only to have the notion of it in our heads, but the relish, and savour, and power of it in our hearts. He shall teach all truth, and keep back nothing profitable, for he will show things to come. All the gifts and graces of the Spirit, all the preaching, and all the writing of the apostles, under the influence of the Spirit, all the tongues, and miracles, were to glorify Christ. It behoves every one to ask, whether the Holy Spirit has begun a good work in his heart? Without clear discovery of our guilt and danger, we never shall understand the value of Christ's salvation; but when brought to know ourselves aright, we begin to see the value of the Redeemer. We should have fuller views of the Redeemer, and more lively affections to him, if we more prayed for, and depended on the Holy Spirit.
                  They will put you out of the synagogue; in fact, the time is coming when anyone who kills you will think they are offering a service to God. John 16:2

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    However I do recognize Muhammad(as) as the last Prophet of God.
                    - - - Christians cannot accept that statement. In the Bible, a prophet's qualificatiions was that he could predict the future without error, even to predicting the weather 3 years in advance, for example - Elijah .



                    .
                    . . . . . . Christianity was steered away from monotheism by man and transformed into the worship of the Prophet Jesus(as) himself and even trinity by Catholics.
                    - - - This is not true ! Christians are monotheists; but God exists simultaneously in 3 personalities. Jesus was God manifest in the flesh and these doctrines were not originated by the Roman Catholic church. The trinity can be proved by reference to the Hebrew scriiptures, without dependence on the New Testament.


                    "The Savior Ahmad Al-Hassan said:. . . . . . . . . "
                    - - - There is only one saviour and His name is the Lord Jesus Christ who just happens to be the same as the God of Israel.

                    I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour - Isaiah 43:11

                    Verily thou art a God that hidest thyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour - Isaiah 45:15

                    Tell ye, and bring them near ; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour ; there is none beside me. - Isaiah 45:21

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Greeting in the name of the Lord Jesus the Christ.

                      2 Maloney,

                      this is my understanding of the "Comforter".

                      Premise #1. Jesus is the Holy Spirit.
                      meaning that he is the comforter, even from birth into this world with flesh, bone, and blood. supportive scripture, Luke 2:25 "And, behold, there was a man in Jerusalem, whose name was Simeon; and the same man was just and devout, waiting for the consolation of Israel: and the Holy Ghost was upon him". that word "consolation" is the Greek word, G3874 παράκλησις paraklesis (par-ak'-lay-sis) n.
                      1. an imploration, entreaty (urgent request (for mercy or help))
                      2. an exhortation (urgent counsel, encouragement, or caution)
                      3. a comfort, solace
                      [from G3870]
                      KJV: comfort, consolation, exhortation, intreaty

                      one who give exhortation is a an advocate, comforter
                      in definition #2. above is say "urgent counsel". confirming Isaiah 9:6 "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace". this child that was born, and this son given is "Counsellor", or Comforter. which is bared out in 1 John 2:1 "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous". that word, "advocate", is Counsellor, or COMFORTER, G3875 παράκλητος parakletos (par-ak'-lay-tos) n.
                      1. (properly) one called near (to give help)
                      2. an intercessor (one who entreats of behalf of another)
                      3. a comforter
                      [(not given)]
                      KJV: advocate, comforter

                      so clearly our Lord Jesus the Christ is the "comforter", in flesh, and bone with blood, according to Luke 2:25. and the word "intercessor", definition #2 of G3875 παράκλητος parakletos above, means he is "MEDIATOR". listen, according to Noah Webster's 1828 Dictionary of American English
                      INTERCES'SOR, n. [L. See intercede.]
                      1. A mediator; one who interposes between parties at variance, with a view to reconcile them; one who pleads in behalf of another.
                      2. A bishop who, during a vacancy of the see, administers the bishopric till a successor is elected.

                      clearly our Lord Jesus is Mediator, and Comforter, the advocate, or Counsellor.

                      so Jesus is the Holy Spirit, listen, John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever". and then our Lord said this also, John 14:18 "I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you". now the identity of the comforter, John 14:26 "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you".

                      so the bottom line is this. Ahmed Al Hassan is not his name nor him.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        In an age when the world is pregnant with lies a great truth will be revealed.
                        -A murdered widow

                        Fortunately this guy The Benefactor is not that truth. Nothing that comes from Abraham is truth. This seems to be more propagation of what Nietzsche called the slave religions.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by RecoveringSBaptist View Post
                          In an age when the world is pregnant with lies a great truth will be revealed.
                          -A murdered widow

                          Fortunately this guy The Benefactor is not that truth. Nothing that comes from Abraham is truth. This seems to be more propagation of what Nietzsche called the slave religions.
                          And we all know it things turned out for good ol' Nietz!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            "I would like to discuss who (or what) Jesus was referring to"

                            Nothing to discuss, really -

                            He Spoke of The HOLY SPIRIT - who's been WITH us since the get-Go, and IN us since the evening of the ressurection. HE fulfills all the promised functions.

                            Simple as that.

                            This Ahmed Character, is obviously "Just another" phony messiah - who may (and probably will) deceive many. I'd suggest that you don't want to be one of 'em for your own good.
                            Last edited by Bob Carabbio; 07-09-14, 04:16 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              "Which means the Comforter does not exist during the life of Jesus neither before him."

                              Don't be silly. "Will not come to you" doesn't mean: "Doesn't exist".

                              The Holy Spirit DID NOT INDWELL humans - until AFTER their SINS were removed by the perfect "SIN OFFERING" of Jesus. Jesus says of the Holy Spirit: you KNOW him because he's been WITH YOU, and he WILL BE IN YOU.

                              Since your FIRST premise is shown to be incorrect, the rest of the post is ignored.

                              Simple as that.

                              Comment

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