Is the word "as" being used for similar, equal, or sameness?

So just to clarify the doctrine of the Trinity…

Did Jesus have human nature when he wrestled Jacob?

I never been a fan on Theophany/Christophany. It would be best for you to study that out for yourself instead of trolling Trinitarians with questions. A simple google search can provide you with lots of information instead of relying on me for all your answers. However, according to Wikipedia, "A Christophany is an appearance or non-physical manifestation of Christ". There is no connection between Christophany and Incarnation. They are two entirely different doctrines and should be fused together and labeled as incarnation. Since that would defeat the whole purpose of the incarnation (or, God 'in the flesh') and the incarnation is not like the angel of the Lord, the burning bush, or the whirl wind, etc.

Docetism was probably derived from first century Christianity.
1 John 2:18-19 Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour. They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.

Jesus Christ coming in the flesh is physical and not illusion.
1 John 1:1-2 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked at and our hands have touched-this we proclaim concerning the Word of life. The life appeared; we have seen it and testify to it, and we proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and has appeared to us.

Confessing God the Son is Jesus Christ "in the flesh" is from God.
1 John 4:1-3 Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.

Docetism is kinda a mixture of both ancient Greek Mythology concepts and Biblical Theophany/Christophany. The idea is rooted that all physical matter is evil and God is good. And God will not assumed any thing evil. So all appearances or manifestations was non-physical. For instance, Docetism taught that Jesus Christ, being fully God and the physical fleshly-body was only an illusion, that God, "to seem, to appeared in human form" or ""apparition and phantom". And Christ's crucifixion was 'only seemed' to have a physical body (or "God eats, God slept, God suffered and God died"), but the underlying of all this illusion was God who is incorporeal, spiritual, and cannot physically die because all physical matter is evil. So in reality, what they saw, heard, and touched was only phantasm.

Also, Theophanies would be a commonly believed in the first century, especially among the Greeks. It wouldn't be hard to accept Jesus Christ being God since the whole Mediterranean culture believed in gods and godests, or some form of deity, etc. So the concept of "theophany" was common knowledge and widely influenced from ancient Mediterranean religions/mythologies, Egyptian gods, Roman gods, Greek gods, and Mesopotamia gods, etc from the Epic of Gilgamesh to the Iliad (Acts 14:11-12). No wonder a cultic group of proto-gnosticism would capitalize on the greatest person in history.
11-12 When the crowd saw what Paul had done, they shouted in the Lycaonian language, “The gods have come down to us in human form!” Barnabas they called Zeus, and Paul they called Hermes because he was the chief speaker.​
 
No.

The spirit of antichrist is “every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh” (1 John 4:3).

No mention of word salads or color-coded terms etc. ?

And I DO confess that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh.

Do you believe when people resort to personal attacks in a debate they are admitting defeat?

Do you believe God the Son is Jesus Christ in the flesh? Of course not, you believe in a neo-type version of Docetism and claiming it was a physical incarnation. Its double-talk and framework switching. After all the Spirit of the anti-Christ is a spiritual condition in people lives and also an actual Spirit/s. Its already at work spiritually and will physically manifest in the last days.

1 John 4:3 but every spirit that does not acknowledge (homologeo) Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.

In other words, they are blasphemers who have actually confessed and acknowledged a anti-christ spirit in their lives ("or if you receive a different spirit from the Spirit you received" 2 Corinthians 11:4, i.e. Luke 12:8-10, Matthew 12:31-32, Mark 3:28-29) and you can forgiven and delivered from this spiritual condition. Because that anti-Spirit begins working in people on a spiritual level. Spiritually this causes a person to touch in agreement with that certain reality to ("not confess or acknowledge, 1 John 4:3); which is understood as continuous denial confessions (self-proclaimed denials) or to say the same open denials to others repeatedly.

The Bible teaches that a blasphemer is denied before the angles of God by the Son himself which causes unknown spiritual underlying to occur in him/her. This opens up the door to the blasphemer's human spirit for demonic activity. Then in that person's spiritual condition he/she will always act out in disorderly and in a blaspheming manner to others. You ever notice in every post you personally make to me, its always in the form of self-proclaimed open publicly denial confessions like "Trinity this blah, blah," and "Hypostatic Union that blah, blah". You are exhibiting the characteristics of the one known as the anti-christ spirit.
 
Do you believe God the Son is Jesus Christ in the flesh?

There is no “God the Son” mentioned in the Bible.

However the names “the Son of God” and “Jesus Christ” both refer to Yahweh manifest in the flesh.

So I believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God

Acts 8:37… And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

In other words, I believe the names “Jesus Christ” and “the Son of God” are interchangeable

Mark 1:1… The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

What do YOU believe…

Are the names “Jesus Christ” and “the Son of God” interchangeable?

I think some Trinitarians would say No, the name “Jesus Christ” refers to the second Person of the Trinity as a MAN whereas the name “the Son of God” refers to the second Person of the Trinity as GOD.

But I would like to know YOUR answer.
 
There is no “God the Son” mentioned in the Bible.

However the names “the Son of God” and “Jesus Christ” both refer to Yahweh manifest in the flesh.

So I believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God

Acts 8:37… And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

In other words, I believe the names “Jesus Christ” and “the Son of God” are interchangeable

Mark 1:1… The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

What do YOU believe…

Are the names “Jesus Christ” and “the Son of God” interchangeable?

I think some Trinitarians would say No, the name “Jesus Christ” refers to the second Person of the Trinity as a MAN whereas the name “the Son of God” refers to the second Person of the Trinity as GOD.

But I would like to know YOUR answer.

They are interchangeable but Son of God emphasizes His Godhood. Jesus is a man none other than God ie the Word.
 
There is no “God the Son” mentioned in the Bible.

However the names “the Son of God” and “Jesus Christ” both refer to Yahweh manifest in the flesh.

So I believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God

Acts 8:37… And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

In other words, I believe the names “Jesus Christ” and “the Son of God” are interchangeable

Mark 1:1… The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

What do YOU believe…

Are the names “Jesus Christ” and “the Son of God” interchangeable?

I think some Trinitarians would say No, the name “Jesus Christ” refers to the second Person of the Trinity as a MAN whereas the name “the Son of God” refers to the second Person of the Trinity as GOD.

But I would like to know YOUR answer.
Jesus refers to the MAN, The Son of God became.
The Son of God is indeed The second Person of The Trinity.
 
There is no “God the Son” mentioned in the Bible.

However the names “the Son of God” and “Jesus Christ” both refer to Yahweh manifest in the flesh.

So I believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God

Acts 8:37… And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

In other words, I believe the names “Jesus Christ” and “the Son of God” are interchangeable

Mark 1:1… The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

What do YOU believe…

Are the names “Jesus Christ” and “the Son of God” interchangeable?

I think some Trinitarians would say No, the name “Jesus Christ” refers to the second Person of the Trinity as a MAN whereas the name “the Son of God” refers to the second Person of the Trinity as GOD.

But I would like to know YOUR answer.

The spirit of the anti-Christ will use "Terminology Block" (God, Jesus Christ, in the flesh) and its part of his deception. Just because you say, "I believe in the incarnation " doesn't mean we are in agreement. Its true that you are using Biblical terms, but you have redefine those terms to fit your own man-made Christology. You have essentially emptied biblical terms of all of its content. Then you have replaced the content with a perverted Christological heresaies. Even twisting and distorting the heresaies to be some kind of neo-type version or combining them all together. After that you spray paint it over with Biblical words and terminology. The outer wrapping looks nice and seems like its Biblical. But when I examine the content and essence of the package. The term "God," "Jesus Christ," and "in the flesh" was redefine to fit your own Christology. Your Jesus looks like the real Jesus Christ only on the surface. After I dig a little and another one of those false Christs rises up."

Find It Quick Handbook On Cults & New Religions, by Ron Rhodes

“Redefinitions of Biblical Terms. Cults often use words from the Bible–words like God, Jesus, sin, salvation, the cross, resurrection, and ascension–but redefine them to mean something entirely different from what historic Christianity teaches. This is known as the terminology block”. (page 12).​

The wrong view of "God" will give you the wrong view of the incarnation.

a). Who is the identification of "God" from the phrase "God in the flesh"?

b). Your view of the phrase "in the flesh" is a mixture of Christophany and Incarnation, or a neo-type version of Docetism. But you've tweak Docetism to mean "physical" instead of "illusion". Then you realized that it didn't make sense when it comes to Christophany so you gotta tweak it for your made-made Christology. A whole lot of framework switching going on. But it doesn't surprise me. Majority of Non-Trins has a deep felt dislike for both Trinity and Hypostatic Union phraseologies.

The phrase "God the Son" mean:

God the Son is the second person of the Trinity and identifies as Jesus Christ coming in the flesh. He is united in the Divine Nature but distinct in person with regard to God the Father and God the Holy Spirit. God the Son pre-existed before incarnation, is co-eternal with God the Father. So God the Son refers to his divinity. He is the self-same person in pre-existence, same person in incarnation, same person in resurrection, same person in exalation, and continuously on-going forever.​

When a Hypostatic Unionist use the phrase "God in the flesh," the word "God" in the phrase means "God the Son" (second person in the Trinity) according to the Divine Nature and he is the same underlying person of the human nature (Chalcedonian language "one subsistence"). The created human nature has no person 'existing prior to or apart from' the incarnate Son (or the Divine Person), while instantaneously and synchronously, the human nature is 'existing in and through' the Divine Person. Technically the created human nature was not for a moment impersonal rather created in-personal and made completely in the Divine Person. And he goes by the name Jesus Christ in the incarnate state. And "Jesus Christ" refers to both God and man (we don't separate God from the man, its the self-same individual) when Scriptures are taken as a whole.
 
The phrase "God the Son" mean:

God the Son is the second person of the Trinity and identifies as Jesus Christ coming in the flesh. He is united in the Divine Nature but distinct in person with regard to God the Father and God the Holy Spirit. God the Son pre-existed before incarnation, is co-eternal with God the Father. So God the Son refers to his divinity. He is the self-same person in pre-existence, same person in incarnation, same person in resurrection, same person in exalation, and continuously on-going forever.​
"God the Son" is a human-invented epithet that no-one needs to have any regard for, as it isn't found in the mouth of Jesus or in the mouth of his apostles. In many ways, it is destructive of true theology, because it is so misleading in raising Jesus to a position of total equality with his Father, which isn't born out by his words, or those of the apostles.
 
"God the Son" is a human-invented epithet

Are you using the word "epithet" from Greek origins meaning “attributed to.” If so, then you are suggesting a byname, or a descriptive term, word, or phrase that accompanies or occurs in a place of a name.

If I say, "Jesus."

I also know Jesus to be "God the Son" in a descriptive phrase.

that no-one needs to have any regard for,

Maybe according to cjab and other like-minded people. You are entailed to your opinions.
Not everyone thinks the same like you. So if anything you are simply speaking to the choir of like-minded people.

as it isn't found in the mouth of Jesus or in the mouth of his apostles.

According to your logic neither is the terms omnipresent or transcendent specifically stated from Jesus or the apostles. Maybe you shouldn't have no regards for those terms too. After all you don't need them based on your critical thinking skills.

In many ways, it is destructive of true theology,

Because cjab say so, therefore it must be true.

But it is true that certain phrases and terms can be destructive. Depending on the topic and heresy being discussed.

because it is so misleading in raising Jesus to a position of total equality with his Father,

Thats because of your rejection of the Trinity and the Hypostatic Union.

You should be able to come with a better argument.

which isn't born out by his words, or those of the apostles.

Are you suggesting the term omnipresence isn't exegetical? And you choose not to use extra-biblical terms and phrases?
 
"God the Son" is a human-invented epithet that no-one needs to have any regard for, as it isn't found in the mouth of Jesus or in the mouth of his apostles. In many ways, it is destructive of true theology, because it is so misleading in raising Jesus to a position of total equality with his Father, which isn't born out by his words, or those of the apostles.
Absolut heresy. God The Son is all over the NT.
 
Are you using the word "epithet" from Greek origins meaning “attributed to.” If so, then you are suggesting a byname, or a descriptive term, word, or phrase that accompanies or occurs in a place of a name.

If I say, "Jesus."

I also know Jesus to be "God the Son" in a descriptive phrase.
"epithet "an adjective or phrase expressing a quality or attribute regarded as characteristic of the person or thing mentioned."

I used epithet loosely. The use of "God" in the "God the Son" certainly involves "God" as title, not as descriptor, as it is directly analogous to "God the Father," which as found in Greek, involves "God" as the title of the Father, where "theos" is used with the Greek definite article.

Moreover when the Greek Orthodox (mis)use "God the Son" they also (mis)use it with the Greek definite article, to denote the Son as the possessor of the very same title as the Father. But this isn't biblical. The Son isn't afforded the Father's "God" title, but he is afforded other comparable titles & descriptors involving form, nature, co-existence, power, sovereignty over creation.

Jn 1:1c, and in other places where anarthrous "theos" is used, involves "theos" as descriptor, not title.

"God the Son" is a particularly inappropriate title for the Son in the NT, given his role in mediating the New Covenant, because it detracts from his mediatorship between God and man, which is based on his humanity, which is of vital importance and the foundation of true faith. Once you lose sight of his human mediator role, you are enveloped in a deist theology; and no appeal to a Trinitarian "God the Son" will help you back to orthodoxy.

As "God the Son," Christ has problems in continuing in his mediator role.


Maybe according to cjab and other like-minded people. You are entailed to your opinions.
Not everyone thinks the same like you. So if anything you are simply speaking to the choir of like-minded people.



According to your logic neither is the terms omnipresent or transcendent specifically stated from Jesus or the apostles. Maybe you shouldn't have no regards for those terms too. After all you don't need them based on your critical thinking skills.



Because cjab say so, therefore it must be true.

But it is true that certain phrases and terms can be destructive. Depending on the topic and heresy being discussed.



Thats because of your rejection of the Trinity and the Hypostatic Union.

You should be able to come with a better argument.
When you have defined how "God" can die, may be I will credit the hypostatic union. As even votaries of it concede, what was formulated at Chalcedon was inherently defective in terms of its coherence. And the "assumption of a human nature" is also problematic, as it detracts from and undermines the Logos "becoming" a man: the hypostatic unions suggests that he remained always "God" (descriptor).

Then there is the further issue that you insist on using the term "divine nature" in a way that is unscriptural, and which makes people assume that they are unable to emulate Christ. But 2 Peter exhorts all believers to put on the divine nature. People have been struggling with the hypostatic union ever since Chalcedon, tweaking it here and there. For me, it is an exercise in philosophy and nothing to do with religion.

Are you suggesting the term omnipresence isn't exegetical? And you choose not to use extra-biblical terms and phrases?
Omnipresence is a strange term, as it conceives God as somehow immanent in creation, which I suppose is true to an extent, but not in a pantheist sense. For God exists in heaven, outside the jurisdiction of the earth, from which vantage God knows and governs all things, even as Christ taught, and per Eph 4:6. Also see Rev 1:1 vis-a-vis the Son and his dependency relation with his Father.
 
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"epithet "an adjective or phrase expressing a quality or attribute regarded as characteristic of the person or thing mentioned."

I used epithet loosely. The use of "God" in the "God the Son" certainly involves "God" as title, not as descriptor, as it is directly analogous to "God the Father," which as found in Greek, involves "God" as the title of the Father, where "theos" is used with the Greek definite article.

Moreover when the Greek Orthodox (mis)use "God the Son" they also (mis)use it with the Greek definite article, to denote the Son as the possessor of the very same title as the Father. But this isn't biblical. The Son isn't afforded the Father's "God" title, but he is afforded other comparable titles & descriptors involving form, nature, co-existence, power, sovereignty over creation.

Jn 1:1c, and in other places where anarthrous "theos" is used, involves "theos" as descriptor, not title.

"God the Son" is a particularly inappropriate title for the Son in the NT, given his role in mediating the New Covenant, because it detracts from his mediatorship between God and man, which is based on his humanity, which is of vital importance and the foundation of true faith. Once you lose sight of his human mediator role, you are enveloped in a deist theology; and no appeal to a Trinitarian "God the Son" will help you back to orthodoxy.

As "God the Son," Christ has problems in continuing in his mediator role.



When you have defined how "God" can die, may be I will credit the hypostatic union. As even votaries of it concede, what was formulated at Chalcedon was inherently defective in terms of the very concept. And the "assumption of a human nature" is also problematic, as it detracts from and undermines the Logos "becoming" a man.

Then there is the further issue that you insist on using the term "divine nature" in a way that is unscriptural, and which makes people assume that they are unable to emulate Christ. But 2 Peter exhorts all believers to put on the divine nature. People have been struggling with the hypostatic union ever since Chalcedon, tweaking it here and there. For me, it is an exercise in philosophy and nothing to do with religion.


Omnipresence is a strange term, as it conceives God as somehow immanent in creation, which I suppose is true to an extent, but not in a pantheist sense. For God exists in heaven, outside the jurisdiction of the earth, from which vantage God knows and governs all things, even as Christ taught, and per Eph 4:6. Also see Rev 1:1 vis-a-vis the Son.
God The Son has NO problems whatsoever.
And NO man can put on the divine nature.
 
I used epithet loosely. The use of "God" in the "God the Son" certainly involves "God" as title, not as descriptor, as it is directly analogous to "God the Father," which as found in Greek, involves "God" as the title of the Father, where "theos" is used with the Greek definite article.

We basically have the same definition but worded differently.

Binyawmene: "epithet" from Greek origins meaning “attributed to.” If so, then you are suggesting a byname, or a descriptive term, word, or phrase that accompanies or occurs in a place of a name.

c-jab: "epithet "an adjective or phrase expressing a quality or attribute regarded as characteristic of the person or thing mentioned."​

What do you know about Binyawmene? Something that would describe me or something that can be attributed to me. I like Hypostatic Union topics. So you can phrase this as "Binyawmene the Hypostatic Unionist". And what do you know about the persons in the Trinity? Just follow the line of reasoning I am explaining here. What can we describe or what can be attributed to the persons. Each persons is God, not three gods but one same God. Then you would phrase this as "God the Father," "God the Son," and "God the Holy Spirit".

God the Son is the second person of the Trinity and identifies as Jesus Christ coming in the flesh. He is united in the Divine Nature but distinct in person with regard to God the Father and God the Holy Spirit. God the Son pre-existed before incarnation, is co-eternal with God the Father. So God the Son refers to his divinity. He is the self-same person in pre-existence, same person in incarnation, same person in resurrection, same person in exaltation, and continuously on-going forever.​

In context between me and Yahchristian we specifically have the subject name.

1 John 4:1-3 Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.​

What do you know who Jesus Christ is according to the Trinity and Hypostatic Union? He is the second person in the Trinity, God the Son and God the Word. So the phrase "God in the flesh" is alluding to Jesus Christ. And "God" in the phrase "God in the flesh" is identified as God the Son who is the underlying subject of the flesh.

Moreover when the Greek Orthodox (mis)use "God the Son" they also (mis)use it with the Greek definite article, to denote the Son as the possessor of the very same title as the Father. But this isn't biblical. The Son isn't afforded the Father's "God" title, but he is afforded other comparable titles & descriptors involving form, nature, co-existence, power, sovereignty over creation.

Now that is interesting, I also say, "Whatever the Father is, the Son is". The thing is that since you don't believe in the Trinity or the Hypostatic Union. Then of course you will say, "misused" or "misleading" because you don't like the idea of co-equality or the Son is equal to the Father. That's your worldview. Its only based on your opinion and assumption that other like-minded people might agree with.. But on the other hand, we (Trinitarians) believe the Son is equal to the Father according to the Divine Nature and subordinate to the Father according to the human nature.

Jn 1:1c, and in other places where anarthrous "theos" is used, involves "theos" as descriptor, not title.

I'm assuming you don't like the phrase "God the Word" too? Since both the Father and the Son has the same Divine Nature. Then the verse makes its conclusion in John 1:1c "the Word," is a definite nominative that precedes the verb “was,” is anarthrous, by refers to the qualities of “God” in the Greek θεός - transliteration theos is in possession by the Logos. Since anarthrous nouns are qualitative. The qualitative noun places the stress on the quality, the nature, or the essence of God. So in that sense it is correct to say, "God the Word" and the Logos is identified as the Son, or correct to say, "God the Son".

"God the Son" is a particularly inappropriate title for the Son in the NT, given his role in mediating the New Covenant, because it detracts from his mediatorship between God and man, which is based on his humanity, which is of vital importance and the foundation of true faith. Once you lose sight of his human mediator role, you are enveloped in a deist theology; and no appeal to a Trinitarian "God the Son" will help you back to orthodoxy.

As "God the Son," Christ has problems in continuing in his mediator role.

That might be a problem for your version of Christology to apply "God the Son". But for us (Hypostatic Unionists), we believe Jesus Christ is both God and man. So it doesn't matter how Christ functions from either divinity or humanity. He is still the self-same theanthropic person.

When you have defined how "God" can die, may be I will credit the hypostatic union. As even votaries of it concede, what was formulated at Chalcedon was inherently defective in terms of its coherence. And the "assumption of a human nature" is also problematic, as it detracts from and undermines the Logos "becoming" a man: the hypostatic unions suggests that he remained always "God" (descriptor).

Then there is the further issue that you insist on using the term "divine nature" in a way that is unscriptural, and which makes people assume that they are unable to emulate Christ. But 2 Peter exhorts all believers to put on the divine nature. People have been struggling with the hypostatic union ever since Chalcedon, tweaking it here and there. For me, it is an exercise in philosophy and nothing to do with religion.

We can discuss Jesus Christ's death after all Jesus Christ is God the Son incarnate. From my standpoint, death is simply a matter of the soul separating from the body. Then the immortal soul can no longer give life or existence to that body. A person would simply breathe their last breath and the body will stop functioning and shut down altogether. The same operation of the soul to the body happened in Jesus Christ. There is no difference because he has become one of us. Jesus breathed his last breath on the cross. That life or existence is cut-off from his body, but that life or existence is not cut-off from the soul. His soul and body separated, "He was put to death in the body" (1 Peter 3:18) and "he might taste death for everyone" (Hebrews 2:9), the sufferings of the body and death is being ascribed (1 Corinthians 2:8), again, death simply means "the body without the spirit is dead" (James 2:26). Therefore, the Son-Person died in the body only in the sense that his life was withdrawn from the body.

Omnipresence is a strange term, as it conceives God as somehow immanent in creation, which I suppose is true to an extent, but not in a pantheist sense. For God exists in heaven, outside the jurisdiction of the earth, from which vantage God knows and governs all things, even as Christ taught, and per Eph 4:6. Also see Rev 1:1 vis-a-vis the Son and his dependency relation with his Father.

When I discuss the omnipresence of Christ is refer to God's immensity is an essential property and implies both His "Being" and "omnipresence" that's 'transcending immensity' of the universe. This is understood as infinity is in relation to space and omnipresence is in relation to creatures. In Ephesians 4:10 "fill the whole universe" is the immensity of Christ, who "ascended higher than all the heavens". (Matthew 18:20, 28:20). The immensity of God doesn't have its basis from immanence in the sense of a 'divine presence' is operating within creation. We should not think of God being "in" the universe or the universe "in" God. But that God transcends the universe with His whole Being and is present everywhere. He is separate from His creation (Creator/creation separation) and He is transcendent. While in Theological classification, omnipresence itself is systematized under immanence of God, viewed in relation to His creation, and fills every point of space with His entire Being.
 
We basically have the same definition but worded differently.

Binyawmene: "epithet" from Greek origins meaning “attributed to.” If so, then you are suggesting a byname, or a descriptive term, word, or phrase that accompanies or occurs in a place of a name.​
c-jab: "epithet "an adjective or phrase expressing a quality or attribute regarded as characteristic of the person or thing mentioned."​

What do you know about Binyawmene? Something that would describe me or something that can be attributed to me. I like Hypostatic Union topics. So you can phrase this as "Binyawmene the Hypostatic Unionist". And what do you know about the persons in the Trinity? Just follow the line of reasoning I am explaining here. What can we describe or what can be attributed to the persons. Each persons is God, not three gods but one same God. Then you would phrase this as "God the Father," "God the Son," and "God the Holy Spirit".

God the Son is the second person of the Trinity and identifies as Jesus Christ coming in the flesh. He is united in the Divine Nature but distinct in person with regard to God the Father and God the Holy Spirit. God the Son pre-existed before incarnation, is co-eternal with God the Father. So God the Son refers to his divinity. He is the self-same person in pre-existence, same person in incarnation, same person in resurrection, same person in exaltation, and continuously on-going forever.​

In context between me and Yahchristian we specifically have the subject name.

1 John 4:1-3 Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.​

What do you know who Jesus Christ is according to the Trinity and Hypostatic Union? He is the second person in the Trinity, God the Son and God the Word. So the phrase "God in the flesh" is alluding to Jesus Christ. And "God" in the phrase "God in the flesh" is identified as God the Son who is the underlying subject of the flesh.
The bible never uses the term "God in the flesh." As 1 John 4 says above, Jesus is "from God." It is a logical faux pas to say that Jesus is God, if he is also "from God." If Jesus was God, then he wouldn't be "from" God. An elementary grasp of English is sufficient to understand this.

Alternatively you are introducing polytheism, which is no-no. You cannot have one God in heaven, and another on earth in the flesh, whether "one" or not.

Now that is interesting, I also say, "Whatever the Father is, the Son is". The thing is that since you don't believe in the Trinity or the Hypostatic Union. Then of course you will say, "misused" or "misleading" because you don't like the idea of co-equality or the Son is equal to the Father.
Equality as to the rule over the earth I concede, but not equality of the Son vis-a-vis the Father, which Jesus repudiated, as indeed does John 1:1 (as followed by Jesus) which assigns the Greek definite article only to the Father.

That's your worldview. Its only based on your opinion and assumption that other like-minded people might agree with.. But on the other hand, we (Trinitarians) believe the Son is equal to the Father according to the Divine Nature and subordinate to the Father according to the human nature.
When Jesus said "the Father is greater than I" he wasn't comparing apples and oranges. To suppose he was comparing the human nature and the divine nature (humans and God) would be absurd.

I'm assuming you don't like the phrase "God the Word" too? Since both the Father and the Son has the same Divine Nature.
The same "divine nature" as in 2 Pet 1:4? But participating in the divine nature doesn't render us "o theos". I think you have a usage of "divine nature" which really equates to the form of God, which is therefore not a correct usage.

Then the verse makes its conclusion in John 1:1c "the Word," is a definite nominative that precedes the verb “was,” is anarthrous, by refers to the qualities of “God” in the Greek θεός - transliteration theos is in possession by the Logos. Since anarthrous nouns are qualitative. The qualitative noun places the stress on the quality, the nature, or the essence of God. So in that sense it is correct to say, "God the Word" and the Logos is identified as the Son, or correct to say, "God the Son".
You are overdoing the qualitative aspect, and making quality the only inference of Jn 1:1c. This is wrong, because even if qualitative to a degree - and that degree is form per Paul in Phil 2:6 - there is a more important functional aspect to consider, which is rule over creation, and participation in creation.

The emphasis is on who is performing the role of God in creation, which is the Word.

That might be a problem for your version of Christology to apply "God the Son". But for us (Hypostatic Unionists), we believe Jesus Christ is both God and man. So it doesn't matter how Christ functions from either divinity or humanity. He is still the self-same theanthropic person.



We can discuss Jesus Christ's death after all Jesus Christ is God the Son incarnate. From my standpoint, death is simply a matter of the soul separating from the body. Then the immortal soul can no longer give life or existence to that body. A person would simply breathe their last breath and the body will stop functioning and shut down altogether. The same operation of the soul to the body happened in Jesus Christ. There is no difference because he has become one of us. Jesus breathed his last breath on the cross. That life or existence is cut-off from his body, but that life or existence is not cut-off from the soul. His soul and body separated, "He was put to death in the body" (1 Peter 3:18) and "he might taste death for everyone" (Hebrews 2:9), the sufferings of the body and death is being ascribed (1 Corinthians 2:8), again, death simply means "the body without the spirit is dead" (James 2:26). Therefore, the Son-Person died in the body only in the sense that his life was withdrawn from the body.
IOW, Jesus was human. So why say you that Jesus the man was God, for "God is Spirit" (Jn 4:24), and God cannot die or change.

Was Jesus man or Spirit? If you say he remained as Spirit (through the hypostatic union), and retained (unmodified) his heavenly instantiation, then you deny that he left his Father's side, and you deny the ascension as an exercise in deception.

When I discuss the omnipresence of Christ is refer to God's immensity is an essential property and implies both His "Being" and "omnipresence" that's 'transcending immensity' of the universe. This is understood as infinity is in relation to space and omnipresence is in relation to creatures. In Ephesians 4:10 "fill the whole universe" is the immensity of Christ, who "ascended higher than all the heavens". (Matthew 18:20, 28:20). The immensity of God doesn't have its basis from immanence in the sense of a 'divine presence' is operating within creation. We should not think of God being "in" the universe or the universe "in" God. But that God transcends the universe with His whole Being and is present everywhere. He is separate from His creation (Creator/creation separation) and He is transcendent. While in Theological classification, omnipresence itself is systematized under immanence of God, viewed in relation to His creation, and fills every point of space with His entire Being.
I agree God transcends the universe. I am not clear how it leads to
"is present everywhere"
because "everywhere" brings God down to the level of creation, thus suppressing his transcendence. I prefer the Pauline phraseology in Eph 4:1 "one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all."
 
The bible never uses the term "God in the flesh." As 1 John 4 says above, Jesus is "from God." It is a logical faux pas to say that Jesus is God, if he is also "from God." If Jesus was God, then he wouldn't be "from" God. An elementary grasp of English is sufficient to understand this.

Alternatively you are introducing polytheism, which is no-no. You cannot have one God in heaven, and another on earth in the flesh, whether "one" or not.


Equality as to the rule over the earth I concede, but not equality of the Son vis-a-vis the Father, which Jesus repudiated, as indeed does John 1:1 (as followed by Jesus) which assigns the Greek definite article only to the Father.


When Jesus said "the Father is greater than I" he wasn't comparing apples and oranges. To suppose he was comparing the human nature and the divine nature (humans and God) would be absurd.


The same "divine nature" as in 2 Pet 1:4? But participating in the divine nature doesn't render us "o theos". I think you have a usage of "divine nature" which really equates to the form of God, which is therefore not a correct usage.


You are overdoing the qualitative aspect, and making quality the only inference of Jn 1:1c. This is wrong, because even if qualitative to a degree - and that degree is form per Paul in Phil 2:6 - there is a more important functional aspect to consider, which is rule over creation, and participation in creation.

The emphasis is on who is performing the role of God in creation, which is the Word.


IOW, Jesus was human. So why say you that Jesus the man was God, for "God is Spirit" (Jn 4:24), and God cannot die or change.

Was Jesus man or Spirit? If you say he remained as Spirit (through the hypostatic union), and retained (unmodified) his heavenly instantiation, then you deny that he left his Father's side, and you deny the ascension as an exercise in deception.


I agree God transcends the universe. I am not clear how it leads to

because "everywhere" brings God down to the level of creation, thus suppressing his transcendence. I prefer the Pauline phraseology in Eph 4:1 "one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all."
Sharing the divine nature does NOT make one God.
Possessing the Divine nature, which Jesus does, makes Him God.
Anyone who rules over or participates in creation is God.
Jesus The man is MAN; Jesus The Son of God is God.
Paul also said ONE Lord, Jesus Christ, The God of Acts 17:24.
 
Sharing the divine nature does NOT make one God.
Possessing the Divine nature, which Jesus does, makes Him God.
What's the substantial difference between partaking of the divine nature and possessing the divine nature?

Anyone who rules over or participates in creation is God.
Jesus The man is MAN; Jesus The Son of God is God.
This isn't what the bible says.

Paul also said ONE Lord, Jesus Christ, The God of Acts 17:24.
So why do you entitle him "God," if he is Lord?

Acts 17:31 clearly distinguishes "the Lord of heaven and earth" in Acts 17:24 from Jesus, so you're on very shaky ground here.
 
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The bible never uses the term "God in the flesh." As 1 John 4 says above, Jesus is "from God." It is a logical faux pas to say that Jesus is God, if he is also "from God." If Jesus was God, then he wouldn't be "from" God. An elementary grasp of English is sufficient to understand this.

I believe the result of a person's regeneration is acknowledging the Hypostatic Union and the Trinity. That revelation is personally revealed through the Holy Spirit. Anyways, you have a weird interpretation. In 1 John 4:2. you have "the Spirit of God" (this is how you can recognize the Spirit of God) which is done by what people confess (1 Corinthians 12:3). So in context the "is from God" is referring the regenerate or the ones who confessed through the Spirit of God and have acknowledged God the Son in the flesh. They can only acknowledge the Hypostatic Union if they have the Holy Spirit.

2 This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God,​

And in the next verse you have "the spirit of the antichrist" (This is the spirit of the antichrist). And the "is not from God" is referring the unregenerate the ones who "touch in agreement with that certain reality to ("not confess or acknowledge, 1 John 4:3); which is understood as continuous denial confessions (self-proclaimed denials) or to say the same open denials to others repeatedly.

3 but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.​

Alternatively you are introducing polytheism, which is no-no. You cannot have one God in heaven, and another on earth in the flesh, whether "one" or not.

Not at all. And don't forget that I have addressed that with you once before.


God is everywhere. The Son-person is the underlying subject of both Divine and human natures. The Divine Nature is automatically present in the union by the logical conjunction of the Son-Person, which he is in presence of both natures simultaneously without the Divine Nature being physically birth. But if you want to use "In heaven and on earth" analogy which is spatial locations, then the Son-person through the incarnate state was "present" in heaven and present on earth simultaneously along with the Father and the Holy Spirit. Since all three Persons are simultaneously present on earth in the incarnation according to the Divine Nature. The Father who sent the Son is always with the Son, "The one who sent me is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what pleases him." (John 8:29) "because whatever the Father does the Son also does." (John 5:19) all in the accordance to the Divine Nature. The Persons does not act outside of the Divine Nature in isolation and separation for they are inseparable. After all God is undivided and indivisible singular Being.

The same "divine nature" as in 2 Pet 1:4? But participating in the divine nature doesn't render us "o theos". I think you have a usage of "divine nature" which really equates to the form of God, which is therefore not a correct usage.

I wouldn't use that verse to demonstrate Christ's Divine Nature. Rather I would point out:
a). Equality with the Father demonstrates the Divine Nature.
b). Divine titles/names and divine attributes ascribed to Christ.
c). Certain things Christ said is according to the Divine Nature.
d). And of course the resurrection. The Lexicon definition for Spirit has a wide range of semantic meaning, which also can means "the spiritual Divine Nature of Christ" according to these particular verses (1 Timothy 3:16, 1 Peter 3:18, Romans 1:3-4). You already know the Bible has the phrase "in the flesh" (human nature reference to the incarnation) and there is also antithesis expression "in the Spirit" (Divine Nature reference to the resurrection) in relation to Christ.

IOW, Jesus was human. So why say you that Jesus the man was God, for "God is Spirit" (Jn 4:24), and God cannot die or change.

The Scriptures and the Hypostatic Union doesn't teach "Jesus the man was God." What do you mean by that phrase? Anyways, I believe in 1 Peter 3:18 "made alive in the Spirit took place between his death and resurrection. And it doesn't mean "kept alive" but "made alive". So the Son-person literally suffered death according to the human nature and is made alive according to the Divine Nature. And both "death" and "alive" is part of the same action and no subsequences, such as: a). He was put to death in the flesh (first aorist passive participle) being contrast and parallel to b).but made alive in the Spirit (first aorist passive participle). Now we have two first aorist passive participle, which this means these participles indicates death and alive are not antecedent to "Christ also suffered once for sins," but "put to death" and "made alive" happen simultaneous in the same instance of time. Because there is no such construction as the participle of subsequent action that death occur first and three days later alive secondly.
 
I believe the result of a person's regeneration is acknowledging the Hypostatic Union and the Trinity. That revelation is personally revealed through the Holy Spirit. Anyways, you have a weird interpretation. In 1 John 4:2. you have "the Spirit of God" (this is how you can recognize the Spirit of God) which is done by what people confess (1 Corinthians 12:3). So in context the "is from God" is referring the regenerate or the ones who confessed through the Spirit of God and have acknowledged God the Son in the flesh. They can only acknowledge the Hypostatic Union if they have the Holy Spirit.
Well I suppose that's one curious and highly unscriptural way of resolving all the issues with the HU: "don't believe in the hypostatic union : ergo not a Christian."

If that is so, why did it take 451 years for it to be defined, and can I assume there were no Christians until 451AD when it came into being?
 
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