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w term is אֲדֹנָי (’adonay).

God.
We do not have the original text. And the text that we do have records some of the changes, like substituting Lord for Yahweh.
My error we do not have the original. As far as I see we have fiver confirmed. 6000 is a huge leap.
It's a matter of honestly. The Bible you reviewed is at least honest in that they document that they implemented the Massora as documented by Ginsberg for the 134 scribal changes.
No it does not. The are verses where The Scriptures translate using Elohim in place of YHWH, even though they list the alleged changes.
That's honest. What's not honest is the Bible's you read in your faith tradition that silently remove YHWH and insert Lord or God 1000s of times without notifying the reader.

In fact the ONLY reason you know YHWH belongs in the text is due to bibles that you criticize for informing the public.
How do you know that? I never communicated any such thing. Btw the reason I know it, is because I study the Bible.
No, the DSS have proved nothing. If you read what the biblical scholars say on the subject, there is controversy and questions as to the use of the DSS in translation.
with the exception of Isaiah one cannot produce a coherent translation, because so much is missing. But one can consult the DSS. As I did.
The Bibles you read in your worship don't use it. You have an incorrect view of textual criticism. The oldest manuscripts are not always the best.
Wrong again. I use NKJV, in the Foward it states that the DSS was consulted.
Back to Genesis 18

Interestingly, it appears that even evangelical sources like the NET also recognize that Genesis 18:3 should be treated differently than a mere "lord."



Also see 19:18, another instance where Ginsberg tags as originally YHWH.



NET Genesis 18:3; 19:18

18:3 He said, “My lord,12 if I have found favor in your sight, do not pass by and leave your servant.



12tc The MT has the form אֲדֹנָי (’adonay, “Master”) which is reserved for God. This may reflect later scribal activity. The scribes, knowing it was the Lord, may have put the proper pointing with the word instead of the more common אֲדֹנִי (’adoni, “my master”).





19:18 But Lot said to them, “No, please, Lord!48



48tn Or “my lords.” See the following note on the problem of identifying the addressee here. The Hebrew term is אֲדֹנָי (’adonay).



49tn The second person pronominal suffixes are singular in this verse (note “your eyes,” “you have made great,” and “you have acted”). Verse 18a seems to indicate that Lot is addressing the angels, but the use of the singular and the appearance of the divine title “Lord” (אֲדֹנָי, ’adonay) in v. 18b suggests he is speaking to God.
The original issue is your claim that YHWH is plural in 18:3. “Eyes “ or “sight” is not plural but dual.
Being dual if it is Lord or YHWH it does not matter, Abraham is addressing one person. It does not change the doctrine at all if it is Lord or YHWH.
 
The original issue is your claim that YHWH is plural in 18:3. “Eyes “ or “sight” is not plural but dual.
Being dual if it is Lord or YHWH it does not matter, Abraham is addressing one person. It does not change the doctrine at all if it is Lord or YHWH.

You misinterpreted me and I corrected you. YHWH is never plural. I argued that the same addressee was found in verse 4 where Abraham was speaking to all three men.


However recently I found Gen 19:18 which is the smoking gun. There Abraham is speaking to the 2 angels.

Ginsburg tags this as YHWH.
NET says of it and Gen 18:3 that's it's likely an address to God.
The BHS critical edition has a similar footnote, 18 a prp אֵלָיו‎ || b prp י‎—ִ
 
However recently I found Gen 19:18 which is the smoking gun. There Abraham is speaking to the 2 angels.

Smoking gun indeed. And this is the verse which is always ignored concerning the topic of Abraham's 3 visitors because it blows Trinitarian claims right out of the water no matter which way you look at it.
 
Because he isn't God, but in the text of Psalm 110:1 is prophetically David's Lord. The sitting of Jesus at the right hand of his God didn't happened until after he was born, died, was resurrected, and taken to heaven as a complete human man ascending to the sky.
You did NOT answer the question.
HOW can the son of a king be that king's Lord?????
 
Maybe not, you've not identified them but I'm 99% certain they have tampered with the text themselves by removing the name some 6000 times.




It's simple math. Taking issue about 134 instances of YHWH being included where the scribes admit they removed it is hypothetical when endorsing translators who remove it 6000 times where it belongs.

Straw Rafter???
Nothing removed. YHWH was TRANSLATED as Lord.
 
You did NOT answer the question.
HOW can the son of a king be that king's Lord?????
Jesus Christ is a literal blood descendant of David on his mother's side. God glorified and highly exalted Jesus Christ, making him Lord and Christ. David will be saved because he looked forward to the coming Messiah.
 
Jesus Christ is a literal blood descendant of David on his mother's side. God glorified and highly exalted Jesus Christ, making him Lord and Christ. David will be saved because he looked forward to the coming Messiah.
Failed again. Jesus was The ONE and ONLY Lord and Christ straight from His mother's womb.
You did NOT explain how the son of a king of Israel can be that king's LORD.
 
Every King of Israel is the Lord of Israel - just like David was.

But you have been reminded of this fact dozens of times. You just don't care.



Nowhere in your Bible does it say such a thing.
NO king was EVER The Lord of Israel.
Israel had ONE Lord: God.
And you failed to address the fact Jesus Christ is The Lord of His father, David.
 
NO king was EVER The Lord of Israel.

There you go again contradicting the Bible.

Your Bible states many times that David was the Lord of Israel.

How do you manage to contradict the Bible so shamelessly?

Israel had ONE Lord: God.
And you failed to address the fact Jesus Christ is The Lord of His father, David.

Because God made David's human son the Lord of the living and the dead, including dead David.
 
There you go again contradicting the Bible.

Your Bible states many times that David was the Lord of Israel.

How do you manage to contradict the Bible so shamelessly?



Because God made David's human son the Lord of the living and the dead, including dead David.
Provide one verse which states David was The Lord of Israel.
NO human can EVER be The ONE Lord of the living and the dead.
Jesus Christ was The ONE LORD of lords from conception.
 
There you go again contradicting the Bible.

Your Bible states many times that David was the Lord of Israel.

How do you manage to contradict the Bible so shamelessly?



Because God made David's human son the Lord of the living and the dead, including dead David.
The pre-incarnate Jesus was David’s Lord and Shepherd. Psalms 23;John 10:11-14
 
John 8:58 Jesus identifies Himself as YHWH
Zech 2:10-11;Isaiah 48;Deut 6:4

Although you are fully aware of this, I want to remind you that after Jesus had delivered His people out of the land of Egypt, He destroyed those who did not believe.

Jesus didn’t pre-exist his birth. The Old Testament is prophetic.

The sitting at God’s right hand didn’t occur until after he was already born, died, resurrected by God, and taken to heaven.

Mark 16
19After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, He was taken up into heaven and sat down at the right hand of God.
 
Jesus didn’t pre-exist his birth. The Old Testament is prophetic.
You are reall making yourself look bad.

For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

2 But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.
The sitting at God’s right hand didn’t occur until after he was already born, died, resurrected by God, and taken to heaven.
Word was made flesh.

And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
Mark 16
19After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, He was taken up into heaven and sat down at the right hand of God.
And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Isaiah 6:1
In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up, and his train filled the temple.
 
You misinterpreted me and I corrected you. YHWH is never plural. I argued that the same addressee was found in verse 4 where Abraham was speaking to all three men.
Your post#
It is noted in the manuscripts where the change was made by copyists.

The Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia, R Kittel, 1984 Margin at verse Gen 18:3 has a Masoretic note with the Hebrew letters Koph Lamed Dalet (134) indicating the first of 134 instances where pre-Masoretic copyists removed the name YHWH from the Hebrew text, replacing it with the word Lord.

And so:
Gn 18:3 Then he said: "YHWH, if, now, I have found favor in Y'all's [**] eyes, please do not pass by Y'all's [**] servant. [Y'all's indicates plural possessive addressees] Masorite changed from YHWH to Adonay. [**] nouns marked with second person plural suffixes in alternate readings.


Also see: Brown Driver Briggs Hebrew Lexicon, page 11b
a. my Lord ... (Sam. YHWH) elsewhere in Hex, J; Gn 18 [3(?).27.30.31.32 19.2.18(?)

Your post #137
The alternate translation in the footnote of BHS does translate to Abraham saying to the LORD YHWH y'alls eyes which means Abraham is speaking to more than one person.

That means the LORD is more than one person. And that's not even considering the BHS reading for YHWH.

But does that matter now? It refutes your assertion that the LORD could be Jesus.

--------------
Is the following true? [Y'all's indicates plural possessive addressees]
Genesis 18:3
Your =אַתָּה= pronoun, suffixed, second person, masculine, singular
Sight = עֵינֶ֔י = noun, common, dual, construct
Your =אַתָּה= pronoun, suffixed, second person, masculine, singular
Servant = noun, common, singular, construct

In 18:3 every noun, pronoun, and verb is singular. Sight is dual. Nothing in the verse hints at 'plural possessive addressees'.

18:4 We find plurality.
vs 4 Your = אַתֶּם = pronoun, suffixed, second person, masculine, plural = 'you all'
vs 4 Feet = רֶ֫גֶל =noun, common, dual, construct
vs 4 'wash' and 'rest' are plural verbs.

Hebrew, grammatical rules state that the noun should agree with the verb in gender and number.
If Abraham is addressing the same person or persons in both verse 3 and 4, then the verbs in verses 3 and 4 should either be singular or plural. Why is verse 3 singular and verse 4 plural? Abraham is addressing one individual in verse 3 and three individuals in verse 4. It's that simple. Moses is recording simple hospitality.
Be it Adonai or YHWH in verse 3 it does not contradict my original statement that Abraham was addressing Jesus.

However recently I found Gen 19:18 which is the smoking gun. There Abraham is speaking to the 2 angels.

Ginsburg tags this as YHWH.
NET says of it and Gen 18:3 that's it's likely an address to God.
The BHS critical edition has a similar footnote, 18 a prp אֵלָיו‎ || b prp י‎—ִ
I will do your homework again. ----Homework = test your ideas before you post them.
Then Lot said to them, “Please, no, my lords!
How is this the smoking gun?

Notice
18:22 Then the men turned away from there and went toward Sodom, but Abraham still stood before the Lord [YHWH].
Moses is differentiating between YHWH and the other two angels.
And if that is the case Lot could only be addressing the two angels as Adonia

19:2 And he said, “Here now, my lords [adonia]...
19:13 For we will destroy this place, because the outcry against them has grown great before the face of the Lord [YHWH], and the Lord {YWHW} has sent us to destroy it.”
18 Then Lot said to them, “Please, no, my lords! [Adonia]

Notice 19:13 the angels state that YHWH sent them, and the outcry against the city has grown great before the face of YHWH. Simple, the angles are stating that they are not YHWH, for if they were YHWH or any manifestation or what have you, it would read something similar to.
"For we will destroy this place, because the outcry against them has grown great before our face and we came to destroy it.”



Suggest you purchase an exegetical guide.
 
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You are reall making yourself look bad.

For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

2 But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

Word was made flesh.

And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Isaiah 6:1
In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up, and his train filled the temple.
All prophetic. Want to put it to the test?

Simply quote a single word or action by Jesus in the Old Testament. Find us the pre-existent Son of God at the right hand of God or God the Word with God in the beginning of creation.

I might add, no one in the universe has found it yet.
 
All prophetic. Want to put it to the test?

Simply quote a single word or action by Jesus in the Old Testament. Find us the pre-existent Son of God at the right hand of God or God the Word with God in the beginning of creation.

I might add, no one in the universe has found it yet.
Classic head in the sand denial.
 
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