The Eucharist is the New Testament

[1Thess521]

For a will to be established.

will is the SAME word as covenant!!

Hebrews 9:15 Greek Text Analysis

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Hebrews 9:16 Greek Text Analysis

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Hebrews 9:17 Greek Text Analysis

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15 Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, (diathéké) so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant.
16 For where a will (diathéké) is involved, the death of the one who made it must be established.
17For a will (diathéké) takes effect ONLY at death, since it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive."

 

[balshan]

Unless the wine is indeed his blood of the covenant.

And it wasn't.

 

[balshan]

will is the SAME word as covenant!!

Hebrews 9:15 Greek Text Analysis

biblehub.com

Hebrews 9:16 Greek Text Analysis

biblehub.com

Hebrews 9:17 Greek Text Analysis

biblehub.com

15 Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, (diathéké) so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant.
16 For where a will (diathéké) is involved, the death of the one who made it must be established.
17For a will (diathéké) takes effect ONLY at death, since it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive."

You make it easy to understand the truth. It is plain english and in literal language, not symbolic. It is easy SINCE A DEATH OCCURRED. No since the wine was poured out of a cup, not anything else at all.

 

[1Thess521]

For a will to be established.

true or false?

It states that a death must take place for a covenant (diathéké) to be established.

 

[dingoling.]

will is the SAME word as covenant!!

Hebrews 9:15 Greek Text Analysis

biblehub.com

Hebrews 9:16 Greek Text Analysis

biblehub.com

Hebrews 9:17 Greek Text Analysis

biblehub.com

15 Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, (diathéké) so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant.
16 For where a will (diathéké) is involved, the death of the one who made it must be established.
17For a will (diathéké) takes effect ONLY at death, since it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive."

This doesn't prove that Jesus was using a figure of speech when he said, "This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood." There are other issues involved here that you should understand also.

 

[dingoling.]

true or false?

It states that a death must take place a covenant (diathéké) to be established.

Essentially, yes it does.

 

[balshan]

And it wasn't.

Also no death at the Last Supper. Just wishful dreaming on the parts of RCC who seem to enjoy pagan practices and beliefs.

• Salish - (a northwestern coastal Native American tribe) The Salish believe the salmon is a god, as is the deer, and they must return the bones to the water to not bring harm to the family for eating the god.
• Mexica (Aztecs) - famous for their ritual sacrifices, they would often kill a man wearing a costume of a particular god. They ate his heart, thus eating the god. They also thought that eating a respected enemy would endow them with the powers of that enemy's god.

Theophagy

Theophagy means "god eating", and it refers to the practice of ritually eating what the eater believes to be the flesh of a deity. The practice is believed to have derived from earlier forms of ritual cannibalism, in which the descendants of a deceased person would ritually eat parts of the...

rationalwiki.org

Also the commandments are clear do not drink blood, it is in both the OT and NT and you believe Jesus was telling His followers to drink blood. This is not the case that is a pagan practice.

 

[balshan]

This doesn't prove that Jesus was using a figure of speech when he said, "This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood." There are other issues involved here that you should understand also.

Of course it does.

 

[1Thess521]

This doesn't prove that Jesus was using a figure of speech when he said, "This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood." There are other issues involved here that you should understand also.

Instead of avoiding the Hebrews verses; (like you lectionary schedule) explain them to us:
what does "must be" and and "ONLY at " mean?

" it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive.""
"the death of the one who made it must be established."
"takes effect ONLY at death,"


Please explain what that means

 

[balshan]

Essentially, yes it does.

No need for the word essentially. It clear does.

 

[1Thess521]

Essentially, yes it does.

is this symbolic language?
" it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive.""
"the death of the one who made it must be established."
"takes effect ONLY at death,"


15 Therefore He is the mediator of a new covenant, (diathéké) so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant.
16 For where a will (diathéké) is involved, the death of the one who made it must be established.
17For a will (diathéké) takes effect ONLY at death, since it is not in force as long as the one who made it is aliv

 

[Beloved Daughter]

But for some reason you sure are interested in the sins of some of the Catholic clergy. Selective outrage, right?

Really? Selective? On what do you base this conclusion? I didn't just point to ordinary Catholics, but your leadership in particular. I answered the question presented. If you don't like it, you are free to challenge that poster. The Pope is hardly a role model to Catholicism.

Outrage is a perfect word. Anyone who teaches contrary to the Word of God is an outrage to those of us who love the Lord and try to follow his precepts.

Hill Song is nothing more than a cult and yes, I'm outraged by their use of music (a gift of God) to spread evil heresy. I never support that. There are other groups and people that I oppose. That is my right as a child of God. Don't even start with the USCCB supporting abortion by the supposed left leaning charities of people they use. They know about, but choose to ignore it.

Go somewhere else to plead your case, because no one is buying it here. There are few Catholics supporting you here.

Spend your time in God's Word. It is the only thing of value you possess

 

[Alonzo]

If you state that the wine is symbolic then you are saying that the blood of the covenant is symbolic because Jesus said the wine was his blood of the covenant.

- Jesus indicated that the wine was the new covenant in his blood.
- You state that the wine is symbolic
- Hence you are saying that the new covenant in his blood is symbolic.

The logic is not that difficult is it?

You cannot get around the fact that Jesus explicitly indicated that the wine was the new covenant in his blood, because that is what scripture says.

They have twisted the scriptures to validate their rejection of solid orthodox teaching on this for over two thousand years. We can only pray for them at this point, only God could ever convince them.

 

[Alonzo]

Really? Selective? On what do you base this conclusion? I didn't just point to ordinary Catholics, but your leadership in particular. I answered the question presented. If you don't like it, you are free to challenge that poster. The Pope is hardly a role model to Catholicism.

Outrage is a perfect word. Anyone who teaches contrary to the Word of God is an outrage to those of us who love the Lord and try to follow his precepts.

Hill Song is nothing more than a cult and yes, I'm outraged by their use of music (a gift of God) to spread evil heresy. I never support that. There are other groups and people that I oppose. That is my right as a child of God. Don't even start with the USCCB supporting abortion by the supposed left leaning charities of people they use. They know about, but choose to ignore it.

Go somewhere else to plead your case, because no one is buying it here. There are few Catholics supporting you here.

Spend your time in God's Word. It is the only thing of value you possess

I myself do not care for our current head Bishop, the Pope. Now, if you could direct me to the evidence of the USCCB supporting left leaning abortion organization I would be grateful.

Also, please provide the evidence that few Catholics support me here. (I have only been posting for like 3 days). Charges are easily levelled, so proof is needed. God bless!

 

[dingoling.]

Instead of avoiding the Hebrews verses; (like you lectionary schedule) explain them to us:
what does "must be" and and "ONLY at " mean?

" it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive.""
"the death of the one who made it must be established."
"takes effect ONLY at death,"


Please explain what that means

You need to take the entire teaching of scripture into consideration and not just a few verses in the book of Hebrews.

 

[mica]

You need to take the entire teaching of scripture into consideration and not just a few verses in the book of Hebrews.

so you're claiming. why don't catholics do that?

 

[mica]

This doesn't prove that Jesus was using a figure of speech when he said, "This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood." There are other issues involved here that you should understand also.

and you will explain those other issues - right?

 

[dingoling.]

Your ignorance on the topic is showing and it is clearly showing. I am stunned by the lack of knowledge of the RCs about covenants. Maybe you need to go back and look at all the covenants and then you will understand you error.

Like I said the OC wasn't established when Moses received the 10 commandments.

Hebrews 9:18-21, "Hence not even the first covenant was inaugurated without blood. For when every commandment had been told to all the people by Moses in accordance with the law, he took the blood of calves and goats, with water and scarlet wool and hyssop, and sprinkled both the scroll itself and all the people, saying, “This is the blood of the covenant that God has ordained for you.” And in the same way he sprinkled with the blood both the tent and all the vessels used in worship."

We also see in Exodus that besides the blood, the elders and other saw the God of Israel and they had a meal.

Exodus 24:9-11, "Then Moses and Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel went up, and they saw the God of Israel. Under his feet there was something like a pavement of sapphire stone, like the very heaven for clearness. God did not lay his hand on the chief men of the people of Israel; also they beheld God, and they ate and drank."

What happened in the upper room. The there was the blood of the covenant, the disciples saw the God of Israel and there was a meal.

 

[dingoling.]

so you're claiming. why don't catholics do that?

Yes, we do.

 

[dingoling.]

They have twisted the scriptures to validate their rejection of solid orthodox teaching on this for over two thousand years. We can only pray for them at this point, only God could ever convince them.

Yes, we need to pray for them. It is really sad that they don't understand the tremendous gift that God has given us in the Eucharist.

My understanding is that not only does the Eucharist bring an end to all the OC sacrifices, but it is also is the new Passover meal and the new manna from heaven. This is correct, right?