Runningman
Well-known member
For us there is only one God, the Father. 1 Corinthians 8:6.
For you there are many gods.
Did the God of Jesus say this?
- Thread starter Our Lord's God
- Start date
For you there are many gods.
Yes, but it was through an act of creation, not procreation.
Again, through an act of creation.
If Jesus was procreated, you might have a point. But he wasn't, he was created. God provided what was necessary for Mary to conceive a man.
That's Trin-speak. The Bible NEVER says Jesus Christ has "two natures."
Again, who do Jesus Christ and Paul say that one God is?
...
You just don't listen. I told you no like 4 times now and I explained my reasons. You on the other hand have not answered one of my questions but instead filled the room with "smoke screen" excuses. Thomas identified Jesus Christ as his "Lord and God." Paul identified Jesus as God. John identified Jesus as God.
The high priest at the trial of Jesus at Matthew 26 accused Jesus of blasphemy for claiming to be God. Even Jesus' own Father identified Jesus as God at Hebrews . Revelation 1: 8 Jesus identifies Himself as God. Of course, you have typical excuses that all these text do not mean what they say.
And to make matters even worse for you, you quote Isaiah 44:24 that has nothing to do with whether or not Jesus has a God. It's about creating, and you even got that wrong because Jesus is clearly identified as the creator in multiple verses in the NT. What do you do, ignore them, just like everything else about Jesus.
Do you know what are the four most lethal words are in the Bible? Of course you don't. It's when Jesus said, "I never knew you." I will close with John 5:22-23, "For not even the Father judges anyone, but He has given all judgment to the Son, (WHY) vs23, in order that ALL may honor the Son, even as they honor the Father who sent Him." Notice the Father sent the Son into the world which means Jesus was not created like the rest of us. To be sent you have to have existed already.
IN GOD THE SON,
james
Can you please give me a list of all the verses you think prove Jesus Christ was a created being?
IN GOD THE SON,
james
Matt 1:18 Now the birth [genesis, meaning origin, source, or beginning] of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature [all creation, in this case meaning the new creation]:
Deut 18:15 The LORD thy God will raise up unto thee a Prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto me; unto him ye shall hearken;
Jesus is a MAN (many verses), men do not preexist their conception.
Well can you explain why you stopped there? What does the rest of the verse say? Here, let me help you out. "yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things, and we exist for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him." Since it explicitly says there is "one Lord Jesus Christ" does that mean that God the Father is not the Lord in your mind? Btw, notice the little word "and" in the verse, what is the function of this conjunction word in the verse?
IN GOD THE SON,
james
Is not a verse found in the bible. It is something you made up. Even in the OT, pre-existent angels are recorded as being men.
Moreover, Luke 18:27 “The things which are impossible with men are possible with God.”
Seems your God is very small.
How will you account for "God is the head of Christ" 1 Cor 11:3?
There is no record anywhere, Bible or secular writings, where men preexist their conception.
They appeared AS men, they weren't men.
People use that verse to support all kinds of things that don't make sense.
My God is the Creator of heaven and earth. There is none mightier. He is the God and Father of my Lord Jesus Christ.
No he didn't. He accused Jesus of blasphemy for claiming to be the Christ, the Son OF God.
It's written in 4 gospels and the whole of the NT that Christ pre-existed his conception vis-a-vis his spiritual make up. Why else the need for the phrase, "Christ was an Israelite according to the flesh" in Rom 9:5? Why the reference to the pre-existent "spirit of Christ" in 1 Peter?
You follow a Jewish heresy. Are you a Jew?
The bible says they were men.
Many miracles "don't make sense." Doesn't mean they didn't happen.
Your God would be a deceiver for making out that Christ pre-existed his conception, if in fact he didn't. But he did, for "In the beginning was the Logos," Jn 1:1a.
Got any verses?
Jesus Christ is a blood descendant of "the fathers" on his mother's side. His Father is God.
What verse are you referring to?
No.
The Bible calls them men, but they were angels appearing AS men.
True enough.
God does not "make out" that Christ preexisted his conception.
God's logos was not a sentient being. It is His will, plan, or purposes.
The phrase "[monogenes] son of God" means "sent son" cf. Luke 20:13. It is recorded that God loved his son, even before he was sent. It would not be possible if Jesus didn't pre-exist.
So he came from God, which mean he pre-existed.
1 Peter 1:11.
It was a heretical Jewish sect who first refused to accept Christ's pre-existence: Ebionites.
Why espouse Jewish heresies, then?
They were real men. They ate and drank with Abraham.
Your motto "men do not pre-exist their conception" is fallacious, where "men" denotes sinful men, and so you infer Jesus to be a sinner like all other men. If Jesus was created, he would be like every other man, irrespective of whether he was created by parthenogenesis, which is impossible btw, as "men are not created by parthenogenesis."
Every argument you raise against Jesus's pre-existence is self-defeating and without any foundation.
Again, an addition to the bible that finds no support from within the bible.
I'm curious shroom? You said, "They appeared AS men, they weren't men." What verse or verses are you referring to?
In Him,
James. It"s late, will respond tomorrow. Good night!
Our Lord's God
Well-known member
Like you trying to change the subject from the OP?
Wrong, wrong, and wrong.
Somehow in your misguided head, blasphemy only occurs when someone is claiming to be God. Where did you get that twisted idea?
No, he did not.
No it does not. So this self reaffirmation chant is how you deal with your problem concerning Isaiah 44:24? Pitiful.
The OP is about Isaiah 44:24. Did you bang your head?
It has everything to do with his God who declared that He alone created everything.
But you don't care what his God said do you?
You condemn yourself by your own testimony.
Are you again insanely claiming that it was not the God of Jesus speaking at Isaiah 44:24?
Do tell us.
johnny guitar
Well-known member
Every Bible I'm familiar with says your throne O God.
God is NOT a throne. He sits on His throne.
johnny guitar
Well-known member
The Deity of Christ was believed by ALL Christians from Pentecost.
johnny guitar
Well-known member
NO ONE can be made The ONE True Lord. He either is or He isn't.
Of course Jesus was PROCLAIMED, who He was from conception, The Lord and Christ by His resurrection.
johnny guitar
Well-known member
Through Begettal. The SON of God can NEVER be created.
God provided for Mary???
God The Holy Spirit CONCEIVED Jesus.
It means unique or only. God sent His Son. It does not mean Jesus preexisted.
That was prophetic.
No, it does not mean Jesus preexisted.
No Jew believed Jesus Christ preexisted his conception.
No, they were angels appearing as men.
They did.
It's not "my motto." It's the truth. Human beings do not preexist their conception.
It denotes all men. Jesus Christ was, and still is, a man, a human being. He has been resurrected, glorified, and highly exalted by God.
No, I do not infer that at all. Jesus Christ was born sinless, and kept himself from sinning.
He was.
God provided what was necessary for Mary to conceive. It was a miracle, an act of creation.
That's simply false.
Look up the word logos and see how it's used.