Reformedguy
Well-known member
And your posts prove my point. Thanks
Why Does The Provisionist God Need To Look ? Down The Corridors Of Time To Make His Judgments?
- Thread starter Sketo
- Start date
LOL
My posts refute your views
Scripture stating it is believers who receive the Spirit and deny unbelievers receive the Spirit do not support your view that unbelievers do receive the Spirit.
Josheb
Well-known member
Then you should stop doing it to others lest you make yourself a hypocrite.
Opps! Too late.
Thank you for your time.
Reformedguy
Well-known member
Depends on what you mean by recieve. Show me where the Bible defines the English word recieve?
Reformedguy
Well-known member
You said it well. Nothing but a zealous troll.
You are welcome.
I was pleased to point out your quote mining and assumption regarding it.
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No, it does not
You do not have a verse which states unbelievers receive the Spirit
I have a verse where it states they do not
Too bad you can't deal with the rebuttal I supply and have only ad hominem and denial in response.
Here is Leighton noting how Calvinist caricature Arminians with the looking down the corridors of time straw man
CookedGoose
Well-known member
This is funny Tom.
Flowers describes a situation of God "looking down the corridors of time" but won't actually say the words.
Just like you.
Reformedguy
Well-known member
When I actually see a rebuttal I will deal with it.
Reformedguy
Well-known member
Depends on what you mean by recieve. A world you claimed the Bible defines yet cannot point out where exactly.
Sure do. No one calls Christ Lord but by the Spirit.
Nothing in the flesh pleases God. Is saving faith pleasing to God?
Reformedguy
Well-known member
Exactly. They do the same with foreknowledge being determinative
Bob Carabbio
Well-known member
Who is "Leighton Flowers", and why would anything he says be of any importance???
Josheb
Well-known member
This op does NOT fall into that category. This op posted Flowers' own words and did not misrepresent Flowers in any way (despite the protests to the contrary). The author of this op has linked everyone to the source of the quote, and everyone can see and hear for themselves the greater commentary from Flowers. In the face of the question about quote mining the author of this op did exactly what he was supposed to do: he provided the source material from which his opening post was built. That video is more damning of Flowers, not less.
Sketo had enough integrity to do the right thing.
Too late.
I meant what I said. Plenty of opportunity for you to discuss this op was provided and ignored. Already posted content was ignored and questions already answered were asked in disregard of others and blatant hypocrisy, given the complaints about others doing the same to you. I asked over and over and over for the specifics of Flowers' comments be addressed and addressed relevant to very specific matters directly related to his words.
Now that I've done what scripture says to do when engaged with people who do what you've done, you want to play right..... but that Flowers video does not address this op. This op is NOT about Flowers' view of supposed Calvinist straw men! This op is about Flowers' words and no one else's. This op does not mention Calvin at all. That doesn't matter to you because in every thread you post you change the subject and hijack the op with unrelated Cal-ragging agendas. The entire Arm v Cal board is filled with examples of you doing so; just pick a thread and there's fltom mucking up everyone's otherwise civil conversation.
Titus 3:9-11 ESV
But avoid foolish controversies, genealogies, dissensions, and quarrels about the law, for they are unprofitable and worthless. As for a person who stirs up division, after warning him once and then twice, have nothing more to do with him, knowing that such a person is warped and sinful; he is self-condemned.
I asked once....
...and received NOTHING that could remotely be called op-relevant cogent discourse.
I asked twice, and again received irrelevant responses. I asked thrice AND explicitly told you it would be the last time I'd ask... and again the response was an abject absence of an answer to the point made and the questions asked.
Titus 3:9-11
But avoid foolish controversies, genealogies, dissensions, and quarrels about the law, for they are unprofitable and worthless. As for a person who stirs up division, after warning him once and then twice, have nothing more to do with him, knowing that such a person is warped and sinful; he is self-condemned.
Scripture says those who stir up division and refuse to change when repeated asked are warped, sinful, and self-condemned. In modern-day interwebs vernacular, you are a troll. Don't expect further replies from me in this thread. I encourage all the other posters to ignore you, too. Do better in the next thread. Go trade posts with those who will put up with the subterfuge because that guy is not me.
That would be you who fails to recognize your error. Rather you stubbornly sinfully refuse to accept the fact you were corrected.
Do you seriously think that Leighton having noted that Calvisms caricature of Arminianism which has a doctrine of forseen faith then turns around and adopts it him self
Sorry this another of your ignorant claims that we repeatedly see
for example here is you denying Calvinism posits determinism
Josheb;n5810855 said:
Tom asks
Can we not believe what Calvinists themselves say
One of the foremost Calvinist today (I am told)
Calvinistic Pastor, Dr. John Piper, teaches:
“God . . . brings about all things in accordance with his will. In other words, it isn’t just that God manages to turn the evil aspects of our world to good for those who love him; it is rather that he himself brings about these evil aspects for his glory (see Ex. 9:13-16; John 9:3) and his people’s good (see Heb. 12:3-11; James 1:2-4). This includes—as incredible and as unacceptable as it may currently seem—God’s having even brought about the Nazis’ brutality at Birkenau and Auschwitz as well as the terrible killings of Dennis Rader and even the sexual abuse of a young child… in John Piper and Justin Taylor (eds.), Suffering and the Sovereignty of God (Wheaton: Crossway, 2006), 31-77 (quote from p. 42).
John Hendryx a Calvinist notes
for example states
the desires and circumstances that bring about these choices about occur through divine determinism
voluntary choice is not the freedom to choose otherwise
In other words man can only do what God has previously determined
Audio transcript
How do we know that God always controls everything
? My answer is that we know this because the Bible teaches it. It teaches it by direct statements and by clear and sufficient implication. Desiring God website
Calvinist sites affirming even soft determinism is as deterministic as hard determinism
Compatibilism. It should be noted that this position is no less deterministic than hard determinism - be clear that neither soft nor hard determinism believes man has a free will. Our choices are only our choices because they are voluntary, not coerced. We do not make choices contrary to our desires or natures.
Compatibilism | Monergism
Of course you now acknowledge determinism
here is another
I haven't changed the terms. God did NOT decree the "predetermination of all things which would include the event of Jospeh being sold into slavery..." That is not what Calvinism teaches and as long as you continue to assert this straw man this is the only answer you will receive. You do this either because you do not correctly and adequately understand Calvinism and post out of a lack of knowledge and understanding, or knowingly out of deliberate false witness. Neither are good.
Provisionist Dishonest Tactics #101 ?
SO you know nothing about "Foreknowledge". There no element of "Control" in it. Apparently your "reformed theological system" never paid any attention to James 5:16, or considers it to be a LIE. There is if what God foreknows He determined to occur. That's how He foreknows it.
forums.carm.org
Obviously, it is you who do not know what they are talking about
As many of the Calvinists on this board affirm just that
as does
If God merely foresaw human events, and did not also arrange and dispose of them at his pleasure, there might be room for agitating the question, how far his foreknowledge amounts to necessity; but since he foresees the things which are to happen, simply because he has decreed that they are so to happen, it is vain to debate about prescience, while it is clear that all events take place by his sovereign appointment.
(John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 23, Paragraph 6)
“God . . . brings about all things in accordance with his will. In other words, it isn’t just that God manages to turn the evil aspects of our world to good for those who love him; it is rather that he himself brings about these evil aspects for his glory (see Ex. 9:13-16; John 9:3) and his people’s good (see Heb. 12:3-11; James 1:2-4). This includes—as incredible and as unacceptable as it may currently seem—God’s having even brought about the Nazis’ brutality at Birkenau and Auschwitz as well as the terrible killings of Dennis Rader and even the sexual abuse of a young child…
All the Good That Is Ours in Christ
“Never shall I forget those moments that murdered my God and my soul and turned my dreams to ashes.” Nobel Peace Prize winner Elie Wiesel wrote these words in light of his horrific experience at Auschwitz. He questioned where God was during his unjust suffering. Many of us wonder the same.
www.desiringgod.org
Nothing that exists or occurs falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing, including no evil person or thing or event or deed. God’s foreordination is the ultimate reason why everything comes about, including the existence of all evil persons and things and the occurrence of any evil acts or events. And so it is not inappropriate to take God to be the creator, the sender, the permitter, and sometimes even the instigator of evil… Nothing — no evil thing or person or event or deed — falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing arises, exists, or endures independently of God’s will. So when even the worst of evils befall us, they do not ultimately come from anywhere other than God’s hand.
b Talbot, "All the Good That Is Ours in Christ", in Suffering and the Sovereignty of God, ed. John Piper and Justin Taylor,
another example of you not knowing what you are talking about
Post a verse you think teaches unbelievers receive the Spirit and stop the game playing.
So is inability to see your latest excuse?
What's funny is he says it is a caricature
Car·i·ca·ture
noun
- 1.a picture, description, or imitation of a person in which certain striking characteristics are exaggerated in order to create a comic or grotesque effect:"there are elements of caricature in the portrayal of the hero"
- 1.make or give a comically or grotesquely exaggerated representation of (someone or something):