Why Jews will never accept Jesus

Biblican said:
This is a foreshadow or typology. God is setting the precedent for His plan of redemption. Something had to die in order for His children to be covered. It's no coincidence that the covering of the tabernacle was in ram's skins dyed red. That tabernacle was also the foreshadow of Jesus' final sacrifice. It's also no coincidence that God accepted Abel's offering of the lamb because it represented the sacrifice that clothed his parents. Cain's offering represented his own works, the fig leaves. The typology is consistent throughout the Old Testament.
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Do you have to make something up that never happened (a sacrifice in Eden) in order for your theology to work?
 
Biblican said:
I don't have time. I can only do one thread at a time. I have dealt with the subject sufficiently here. If you can't see the correlation between Genesis 3:21 and Isaiah 53, then there's no point in discussing it any further. God ordained salvation to be through His plan of atonement and the reason for that is He is eliminating the spirit of pride from His kingdom. We have to do it His way, not ours. That's why Aaron's son's were fried and their corpses had to be dragged from the tabernacle. It has to be God's way or not at all, and His way is described in Isaiah 53.
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The problem is that you don't recognize God's way.
 
Biblican said:
The context in Jeremiah say you are not a part of it.
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House of Israel and Judah. You're excluded.

Biblican said:
He's talking about the New Everlasting Covenant that the Messiah would instigate after the captivity.
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That's not the context. Why are you making up things?

Biblican said:
Read it in context. Jeremiah was prophesying before the captivity.
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And? The prophecy is still in the future. Messiah hasn't come.

Biblican said:
Jesus references Daniel nine in Matthew 24.
Jesus has obviously not manifested Himself to you. He only manifests Himself to those He knows will love Him.
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No mention of Jesus being either of the 2 anointed in Danuel 9. Rotfl...
 
Biblican said:
There are so many of them it would take too long. Why don't you do your own research and prove me wrong?
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Just as I suspected. There are none. You're back to your many false claims.

You made the claim. Now prove it or stop with the shtuyot.
 
Biblican said:
Sorry, the typology in Eden is consistent with the remainder of the relating texts going up to Isaiah 53 and beyond. That sacrifice in Eden sets the precedent. The remaining typology confirms it.
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Sorry, but another false claim. You're good at imagination.

Biblican said:
The Tanakh supports everything I've said, that's where I got it from.
I am under the New Everlasting Covenant you are not because you have rejected the only Messiah that is promised.
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And once again, Jeremiah 31:31-34 is clear you're not part of the New Covenant with the houses of Israel and Judah. Messiah isn't called out as part of the covenant.

Biblican said:
There is no other Messiah recorded in scripture after the destruction of the temple in 70AD. Live with it.
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As I've said and proven, Cyrus was the first anointed and Israel the 2nd, which ties into the 70 week prophecy related to the Sabbatical Years - Isaiah 44:28-45:1,13; Ezra 1:1-3; 2 Chronicles 36:21-23; Leviticus 26:18; Leviticus 25:1-22; Jeremiah 25:12; Jeremiah 29:10; Daniel 9:26; Psalm 105:15.

Bye bye...
 
Biblican said:
Don't talk about what you don't understand. You obvisouly don't understand that the Gentiles are prophesied to come to the Messiah which has been fulfilled.
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Isaiah 56:1-8 gentiles are grafted following Torah.

Isaiah 59:20 -

The Redeemer will come to Zion,
to those in Jacob who turn from transgression," declares the LORD.

So repentance first, Messiah afterwards.

Biblican said:
Yom Kipur does not have anything to do with me because I follow Moses and what he taught about the Messiah and what the tabernacle services were all about.
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So you prove my point. Neither Isaiah 53 nor Yom Kippur have anything to do with you, nor the new covenant which applies to the houses of Israel and Judah.

Biblican said:
The Rabbis had to come up with something else after the temple was destroyed because they rejected the Messiah's salvation.
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So much for the salvation you speak of - Christians are still dying because of their sins, unredeemed.

Your Jesus said listen to the Rabbis. They sit in Moses' seat. You better start listening.... rotfl
 
Open Heart said:
Do you have to make something up that never happened (a sacrifice in Eden) in order for your theology to work?
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I am not making anything up, I am letting the scriptures guide me. The typology in Eden is consistent with the relating typology throughout the Old Covenant that confirms it. Because of Adam and Eve's sin, death entered the garden. They were shown the visible reality of what they had done by being clothed from the first death that their sin had produced. In turn we are clothed by the death of the Messiah. Connect Genesis with Isaiah 53.
 
Open Heart said:
LOL in other words you have no proof. Again.
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I recommend Risto Santala's book "The Messiah in the Old Testament in the Light of Rabbinical Writings. He has a lot of material in there and I don't have time to type it all out. Get the book. If you had that before you left Jesus you'd still be a Christian.
 
Open Heart said:
Cop out. You are just avoiding the thread.
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Nope. When I started here I did not have the work load I have now and I don't have time. I do all the computer graphic work for an artist and he's started a new project. I can't write that much here anymore, at least for awhile.
 
Jewjitzu said:
Isaiah 56:1-8 gentiles are grafted following Torah.

Isaiah 59:20 -

The Redeemer will come to Zion,
to those in Jacob who turn from transgression," declares the LORD.

So repentance first, Messiah afterwards.


So you prove my point. Neither Isaiah 53 nor Yom Kippur have anything to do with you, nor the new covenant which applies to the houses of Israel and Judah.


So much for the salvation you speak of - Christians are still dying because of their sins, unredeemed.

Your Jesus said listen to the Rabbis. They sit in Moses' seat. You better start listening.... rotfl
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The Gentiles are drawn to the Messiah and receive God's word through Him and salvation through repentance.
The New Covenant is instigated by the Messiah according to the prophets and He was prophesied to come to the second temple which He did. Any Gentile who receives Jesus is under the New Covenant because there is no other Messiah prophesied in scripture after the destruction of the second temple.
 
Jewjitzu said:
Sorry, but another false claim. You're good at imagination.


And once again, Jeremiah 31:31-34 is clear you're not part of the New Covenant with the houses of Israel and Judah. Messiah isn't called out as part of the covenant.


As I've said and proven, Cyrus was the first anointed and Israel the 2nd, which ties into the 70 week prophecy related to the Sabbatical Years - Isaiah 44:28-45:1,13; Ezra 1:1-3; 2 Chronicles 36:21-23; Leviticus 26:18; Leviticus 25:1-22; Jeremiah 25:12; Jeremiah 29:10; Daniel 9:26; Psalm 105:15.

Bye bye...
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You are not very good at understanding biblical typology. Again, the New Covenant was prophesied to be instigated by the Messiah who was also prophesied to come to the second temple. That has to be Jesus. There is no other messiah showing up anywhere in scripture after the destruction of the second temple.
The 70 week prophecy has to do with bringing in the atonement. Read Daniel 9:24 slowly and carefully. The angel is being very specific that the seventy weeks are for the purpose of making "reconciliation for iniquity." Any relation to the Sabbatical years has to do with the rest that the Messiah Jesus brings. The Sabbath was mentioned by Moses in relation to the instigation of the tabernacle which was a foreshadow of the atonement of Jesus.
So long.
 
Jewjitzu said:
Just as I suspected. There are none. You're back to your many false claims.

You made the claim. Now prove it or stop with the shtuyot.
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I gave you the reference in the MIdrash that associates the Messiah with the Holy Spirit that moved upon the waters in Genesis. Aside from the references in the Rabbinical writings which you should study for yourself, the Arm of the Lord mentioned in Isaiah 53:1, is a distinct person - Isaiah 51:9, and viewed as an extension of God Himself in Isaiah 63:12,40:10,11,51:5,59:16.
 
Jewjitzu said:
House of Israel and Judah. You're excluded.


That's not the context. Why are you making up things?


And? The prophecy is still in the future. Messiah hasn't come.


No mention of Jesus being either of the 2 anointed in Danuel 9. Rotfl...
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God says that He will establish an everlasting covenant Jeremiah 32:40, Ezekiel 16:60. This covenant would restore their relationship with Him and it would be given after their captivity though the Messiah that would come to the new temple that was built when they returned to the Holy land. That Covenant was established by Jesus because there is no other benevolent Messiah appearing in scripture after the destruction of the temple in 70 AD.
 
Biblican said:
I am not making anything up, I am letting the scriptures guide me.
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No, that is not honest. There was no sacrifice in Eden. Killing animals to make clothing is not the same thing as a sacrifice no matter how much you really, really, really, really want it to be.
 
Biblican said:
I recommend Risto Santala's book "The Messiah in the Old Testament in the Light of Rabbinical Writings. He has a lot of material in there and I don't have time to type it all out. Get the book. If you had that before you left Jesus you'd still be a Christian.
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Again, no proof from you. Again. When will you learn, offer the evidence yourself, either by way of summary, or quotation, and then cite your source.
 
Biblican said:
Nope. When I started here I did not have the work load I have now and I don't have time. I do all the computer graphic work for an artist and he's started a new project. I can't write that much here anymore, at least for awhile.
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Well, personally, I wish you would quit this thread and move to the new one. This thread has simply become an endless repetition of the same stuff being said by you and Jewijitzu and me over and over again. It needs to be put to bed. I really am mostly interested in the newbies that come in and respond to the OP. As for me, I almost never actually read the thread itself. I respond to the alerts I get, and I usually get about a half dozen alerts. That's pretty easy to handle.
 
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